<p>Recently attended a luncheon for a local college's "Honors Program." After reviewing the program, DH and I concluded that the only Honor about it was the stamp on the degree. Kids have far more requirements to graduate, including a thesis. This particular program touted trips to local sporting events as one of its great honors. It used to require and subsidize travel abroad, now it requires community service.</p>
<p>Frankly, I think Honors programs should significantly enrich the Honors student. Community service while valuable, does not generally bring significantly more knowledge or skill to the Comp Sci major or Accountancy major. </p>
<p>And, while some colleges offer financial incentives to Honors students, this particular one offered $1000 per semester - not much of a dent in the annual COA of approx $50,000!</p>
<p>Anyone have tood or bad experiences with Honors programs? Can you recommend one?</p>
<p>fencer: Schreyers has been everything it advertises.
Guaranteed honors housing in the middle of campus all 4 yrs/this has allowed him the opportunity to quickly find a core group of serious, hard working peers.
Individual advising and opportunity to get to know your advisor well
Early registration
Hundreds of small honors courses/ability to know profs
availability of study abroad and $$
additional programs/speakers.
$3500 yr.
A thesis is required and a number of credits are geared to this thesis so it's not so much as "extra work" but focused work. Especially helpful if student is considering research. Honors courses are required. GPA required 3.3 each and every semester w/1 semester to recover.</p>
<p>The perks and opportunities that Schreyers has brought to my son have been amazing and beyond his dreams. This school has 40,000 students. His advisor and the dean of his college have never taken more than 30 min. to get back to him if he e-mails them...30 min. He turned down a few top ten schools w/merit to attend his "safety." He has never looked back.</p>
<p>Many of the sports clubs are very high skill level. I don't know about fencing.
Good luck.</p>
<p>My oldest dropped out of Honors at UPenn ("Benjamin Franklin Scholars") in the middle of Jr year. Meeting the course requirements meant taking courses he had absolutely no interest in, while having to give up courses he really wanted. The stamp on his diploma wasn't worth it to him.</p>
<p>He still lists the program on his resume, as he WAS part of it for several years, and it was an honor to be admitted to it.</p>
<p>The only benefit he got from it was having an Honors program advisor, but in hind-sight, some of her advice was good and some wasn't. So who knows if a non-honors advisor would have been better or worse.</p>
<p>I can't remember if he got any priority for scheduling. I don't think so. At some schools, that priviledge is worth being in the program for the first year or two! (After that, seniority takes over.)</p>
<p>My son chose not to apply to the Honors Program when he applied to the University of Delaware (and then ended up getting a letter from Delaware saying that he should apply -- but he still didn't).</p>
<p>His reason was that the honors program required a lot more liberal arts stuff than the regular program did, which would have detracted from his ability to focus on his intended major, which was computer science.</p>
<p>Not all honors programs are suitable for every student who's qualified for them (and my son didn't end up at Delaware anyway).</p>
<p>We were always told that when looking to have an "honors" experience at a large state U, you should look for a school that has an "honors college" vs an "honors program". Honors colleges within a university are usually totally seperate - have their own classes, their own professors, etc. The entire experience is honors, not just a class here or there.</p>
<p>That said, unfortunately, at the state U our daughter attends, they have an honors program. She will graduate with "honors" in May because she has taken the required number of honors classes (classes that have less than 25 students, rather than the regular section which could have several hundred students), completed two required "alternative learning experiences" (a short study abroad and an alternative winter break stint), etc. She is writing a 100 page "honors thesis", but this has nothing to do with the honors program. It will allow her to graduate with honors from her department (along with honors from the university at large). The honors program offers lectures from times to time. Our hope was that the honors program would have a lot of "social" get togethers where she could meet more "like minded" students, and thus make such a large campus seem smaller. They really did not offer anything like that. She ended up making most of her friends through her living arrangement, a 50 girl scholarship hall. But, you are not guaranteed housing in a scholarship hall just because you are in the honors program. This was at the University of Kansas. Sax's experience sounds ideal.</p>
<p>I have two in the UF Honors program. The dorm alone is DEFINITELY worth it. Students choose their honors classes, and there is no requirement to take a bunch of liberal arts classes. However, the course offering are more sparse in math/science and abundant in LA. Son took an excellent food biotechnology class elective his freshman year and enjoyed it. Hopefully he will find more classes like it. Sons believe that the honors prereqs, like chem, calc, etc., do not grade using 'curves' as the regular classes do.</p>
<p>There are no sporting event perks, which they would have LOVED. And the only priority with registration is in the honors classes themselves, not the regular courses. All in all, I'd recommend the honors program to any student who wants to go to UF and can get in- why not? You can always drop out if it's not your cup of tea.</p>
<p>After reading some of the above posts, I'm beginning to appreciate my own school's honors college even more. </p>
<p>We not only have priority honors class registration, but get to register before everyone else (after first semester, freshman year) based on hours, so AP hours help even more with that. There are almost always a number of upper-level honors classes in each subject- in addition to honors versions of intro classes- and you can take honors classes in any subject you want without needed prereqs. Plus if you're taking a regular class and want to get honors credit, you can work with the professor (must be tenure-track) to "honors-option" it and complete extra papers/projects for honors credit. You have to take 9 honors classes, but they can be in any subject you want. Finally, honors students can register for grad-level classes with only a simple form to fill out. </p>
<p>Beyond that, there's a real honors college with lounges, computer labs, advising, etc. in addition to an almost all-honors dorm that includes a satellite advising office and usually a pretty good amount of activities. There's an honors student council that usually does a lot of programming on interesting stuff like Spanish Telenovellas and Chocolate Science/Tasting but students are now even putting on their own "mini-lecture" series. First-year students have to take an honors seminar that introduces them to all aspects of the honors program, lets them meet fellow honors students of all years, and gives them tons of chances to get involved. </p>
<p>Finally, there's a huge emphasis on undergraduate research- several offices are devoted to just that and provide tons of opportunities for honors students to get involved with real projects and lots of support for them to get publish, present, etc. Plus there's a good number of honors-only internships, study abroad scholarships, etc. and plenty of major scholarship advising/support. </p>
<p>Looking back, I'm really amazed and pleased by all the opportunities we've had here especially when I compare it to some of the stories posted above. School is a large state U that imho hasn't gotten enough national attention of late.</p>
<p>Re: Taking classes you are not interested in.</p>
<p>Son went into college w/#of AP classes and was able to bypass most general education classes required by the University as a whole. No special requirements by the honors college. This allowed him to have more free choice which he used to double major across colleges and still be able to get out in 4 yrs. </p>
<p>Good point by midwest parent about having a separate "honors college"
Somewhere around here is an old thread that has great list of points about what makes a good honors program.</p>
<p>crosspost w/vig. Wow, your program sounds exactly like Schreyers. That's awesome</p>
<p>As we know, honors programs and colleges vary quite a bit from school to school. But within each school, the honors experience can vary a lot, depending on how the program is structured. </p>
<p>At UPitt, where my daughter is a freshman, the experience is very individual. Some honors kids load up their schedules with honors courses, while others don't take any at all. (There is no set number of honors courses that have to be taken, ever.) Some kids attend the honors events, which include movies and lectures and more social outings, and others choose not to. Honors housing at Pitt is NOT guaranteed, and quite a few kids applied for it last year but didn't get it. Also, at Pitt, the honors kids don't get to register early. Despite that, my daughter hasn't been closed out of any courses so far. And although she qualifies for honors advising, she's quite happy with her regular adviser. </p>
<p>On the other hand, for a kid who's driven to the max, the Pitt honors college does offer many perks and opportunities. If a kid has an idea for a project that involves travel, for instance, the honors college may pony up the funds for it. And if a student wants to complete the honors thesis and get a special, enhanced degree, that's an option too. And Pitt has been very generous to my daughter, who was awarded the university honors scholarship, which covers full tuition for four years. </p>
<p>So my advice would be to check out each program carefully to see which college offers the approach that fits your student best.</p>
<p>Sax, I have heard only good thing about Schreyer's at PSU. My kids are eligible and (I think they) have put in their apps there. Should find out soon.</p>
<p>On dorms: this particular college said that their Honors students did not want to be in their own dorms (or dorm section) because people might think they were "nerdy." I thought that was baloney; these are HONORS students! How do you or your kids feel about having separate dorms? I would think at Flagship U where there are huge highrise dorms that having your own dorm would be very advantageous.</p>
<p>vig180-
Would you please come whack my kid over the head for refusing to apply to our Flagship state U (I see that you attend our state U). We did visit campus, but he REFUSED to apply to a huge university and doubly refused to apply to the honors program. All the perks of the program are wonderful, and I know several kids who have benefitted greatly from the program. Also, a friend's son is a Foundation Fellow, a true honor. </p>
<p>So, my s refuses to apply to our Flagship U (its UGA, bookworm) but is now planning to attend an Honors program weekend at another school. He still does not want to be "identified" as an "honors kid", which is, IMO, silly, but that's his current thinking. Oh well-- I hope he sees the potential benefit of these programs. Certainly it was VERY clear at UGA the myriad of benefits.</p>
<p>I'd sure like to hear from a few architects of university Honors programs, because I can't figure the purpose either. Older D is at a private, which offers very interesting alternatives to the, um, rudimentary 101//102 series. And the Honors dorm is worthwhile. But other that that the Honors program is mostly extra work without extra recognition. D has lost interest in attaining the asterisk, and I can't say that I blame her. Younger D is in Honors program at a flagship public, and I'm still searching for the raison d'etre there --- not even an honors dorm!</p>
<p>My nephew is in an Honors program at an LAC in the midwest and they go to conferences at other local colleges, etc., but they have to miss a lot of their own classes to do it. As a consequence, no one participates!</p>
<p>UW-Madison has an Honors program, I think it's better than the isolation of an Honors College. It was good in my day eons ago and has only improved. There are specific Honors courses, Honors sections of some courses and extra work one can do in yet others. One can join at any time, although too late makes it impossible to meet requirements (take courses in various areas, do thesis). Also weekly e-mail anyone, even parents, can sign up for that lists various opportunities. </p>
<p>Also glad there is no Honors dorm. The purpose is to get more intense, better courses, not to be isolated from the rest of the campus. The school's website has a lot more information.</p>
<p>jym626- I certainly understand why some people would look down on an honors program, but I came from a similar program at my high school so I kinda knew the drill. And I think it's interesting how programs like the one wis75 mentioned at Wisconsin take such a different philosophy into what students need from an honors program. I think the key for a successful honors program is to create an environment where academic achievements of all kinds are celebrated, from policy writing to service-learning to competing for major post-grad scholarships. An honors program that only offers classes and advising perks isn't going to provide that- you need a separate physical space almost to demonstrate the university's commitment to the program. When I walk into my U's honors college (yes, it's UGA), I see people I recognize from classes, activities, leadership events, etc. and can literally walk into any room and get help in whatever I need, be it a scholarship application, research abstract, or just registering for a class. What I also like about it though too is that while there's plenty of encouragement, there's no hand-holding, so the students who take advantage of these opportunities tend to be self-motivators. And that's what the best honors programs should be: extensive resources for students who want them to seek them out and use them to make the most of their college experience.</p>
<p>I do want to address the idea of a "stigma" associated with honors- that's pretty much a myth. I'm involved in many organizations, some honors, some non honors and NEVER have I heard honors vs. nonhonors come up as an issue either in public or private. People really don't care and so long as honors students don't make a huge deal about it, nobody cares. Sure you may live in a different dorm (if you'd like to), but you're going to find jocks, jerks, geeks, greeks, awesome people and megalomaniacs everywhere. In my experience, the most important things you'll find in higher quantities around honors students are academic seriousness, a proclivity for debate and discussion, and usually some unique interests that are truly interesting. That's it. People still party. People still have a normal college life. It's just with a different group of people than the average student might have without an honors program, and in my case I believe it's been for the better. Of course, students certainly are different and might have different needs/goals, but for academic achievers who want to be around like-minded peers during a good portion (though certainly not all) of their college experience, an honors college is the way to go.</p>
<p>Maryland has an honors program with two extra special subdivisions--Honors Humanities and Gemstone.</p>
<p>Regular university honors students have to take 5 honors course while at Maryland--3 honors seminars and 2 other classes (seminars or H-versions). They are supposed to be classes that replace CORE classes, but some students come in finished with CORE, so for them it is extra work. I personally LOVE the seminars. They are special classes capped at 20 students that are focused on a subject chosen by the teacher. The one's I have taken were called "Novels and Who We Are," "Rip, Mix, Burn: Social Creativity Online," and "From Willowbrook to Attica: Delinquency in the Context of Disability in America." Only one of these classes counted for my gen ed requirements, but they were fascinating courses (I'm one of those kids who wants to take classes in everything). I just need one more class to earn my citation, but I'm going to save it for next year because I have 3 awesome classes in my major next semester.</p>
<p>There's also Gemstone, which is the subdivision of honors that focuses on research. Students form teams of 6-15 students in their year and complete a 3-year long research project for which they need to write a 150 page thesis and present in front of faculty and companies that might be interested in the research. My roommate is working on a computer program that can identify the doors on a building from a video with the goal of making a headset that can direct a blind person. My girlfriend is researching the use Alternative Medicines by cancer patients. My RA from the summer is helping develop a Mapquest-like program for disabled students on campus (giving directions from building to building, etc.) It's good for some students, but not good for others (I turned it down.) Students in this program earn their honors citation by finishing the project. They are allowed to take seminars if they wish, but they are not required.</p>
<p>I don't know much about Honors Humanities, except that they take seminars and complete an individual creative/research project.</p>
<p>That said, I love the honors program because it is a strong community without being separated from the University. I do not feel like an a** for wearing my "Maryland Honors" shirt on campus--honors is just one of the many "things you can be in" at Maryland. There is a listserv that goes out every other day telling students of Honors and non-Honors events. Honors sponsors ice cream socials ALL the time where students meet up, each ice cream, and chat with other students and faculty about anything from sports, to music, to politics, to research, to the Office. They also host movie nights and discussion, guest lectures, and an open mic once a semester. They also did an honors open house during parent weekend where they had students bake cookies (the program footed the bill for ingredients) and perform music (there's a baby grand in the honors lounge).</p>
<p>Students can be as involved with honors as they like here, and that's why I love it.</p>
<p>I am of the mind that taking extra courses (even ones you don't yet see the value in!), doing a thesis, and doing community service is enriching, developmental, and educational. Not everything of value has to have an obvious instrumental outcome. </p>
<p>The whole point of going to a great educational institution, and one we often have to pay tons of money for, is to grow our kids and their minds and their character. If the goal is simply to minimize the course load to qualify for the degree and get a great paying job as expeditiously as possible, we might as well opt for vocational school or community college.</p>
<p>I don't agree that schools with honors colleges and dorms are "isolated"
Son is in Schreyer (SHC) at PSU. Lived in the dorm the first year. He did not view it as isolating. It was in a great location with large rooms and great facilities (cafe, study rooms, computer lab). He mixes with kids in and out of the honors college...actually most of his friends are non-honors.
The good thing about SHC is that it's OK to do what you want. Some kids attend the social functions...others don't and it's OK. My son does not...but he does take advantage of the many honors classes in and out of his major (over 250 classes). The classes are usually taught by full professors and are small and discussion-oriented. He also uses the advising, is thinking about using the grant for study abroad, attends some special lectures, and does lots of community service (although it's not a requirement). Early registration is also a big advantage.
He's a business guy so the thesis requirement is quite unusual as compared to science major. But I think it's a great idea to get these kids to think out of the box and learn how research can be applicable to ANY field.<br>
Overall a great program. The more you put into, it the more you get out of it.
And it's not isolating...at least that's not been my son's experience.<br>
Each college honors program is different though. Check them out carefully - and make sure you ask the experts on the topic - the students themselves.</p>