@GoForth, so you went for the warmer weather! My son has not done a show in Phoenix yet, but maybe he can add it to the beginning or end of his next west coast tour. Travel can be hard - and exhausting - but my son still loves sharing his music with as many people as he can. And he says his current west coast tour has been his most successful yet - both musically and financially. Two more shows, then back to NYC for a couple of weeks before he hits the road again. My guess is that at some point he’ll try to scale back on the travel, but for now he’s loving it.
Let me also say congratulations again to everyone in the forum with so many amazing music school acceptances and decisions. So great to see the next generation keeping music alive and vibrant.
I always enjoy checking back in here at this time of year, with all the school decisions out and the excitement (and yes, the angst) of making choices for the next stage of the journey. I didn’t want to divert any of the admissions / journey threads, so I’m posting on this old thread I started last year. But I did want to say congratulations on all the great choices! And to thank everyone on this journey for keeping music alive.
And to reassure you that live music is back stronger than ever. My son’s recent tours have played to full and enthusiastic audiences. The pent-up demand for live music post-pandemic is evident. Hopefully you’ll be going out to support live music whenever you can.
I also mentioned, the last time I posted, that my son had some exciting news to which I was sworn to secrecy. For the (maybe) one or two people curious, I can now say that he and his music got a very nice write up in the May issue of Downbeat Magazine - just on the newsstands today. Great picture of him too.
It feels almost like yesterday that I was on this site gathering information as my son was making his college / music school decisions. He took all the way to the end of April to decide. You should all take the time you need. And I’m confident you’ll end up at the right place for you.
Congrats to your son! That’s quite the accomplishment.
My D is also on an upswing now getting hired at some top companies. Being my easy-going kid (not), she did say: will this continue or will it all go away in a year!? I told her…you’ve been cast/hired to perform since you were a kid…so I’m guessing it will continue. Still enjoying the ride (mostly…lol)!
A little reality check. Contemporary classical musicians may struggle a bit, but make it; composers and sound artists, not! They really need to go to Germany where there is funding. Academia is no longer a solution for PhD’s, with the adjunctification of positions and decline in arts and humanities. My composer kid is lucky to have a 9-5 job that is marginally related to music. My kids’ music friends are all very accomplished but a main topic among them is how to pay the rent and have a stable life.
Thanks @bridgenail and good to hear your D is also on the upswing! I think that the more you get hired / get gigs, the more likely it is that you’ll continue to get hired / get gigs. There’s some fair amount of inertia to overcome starting out, but once you get rolling, there’s a bit of a snowball effect where success begets success. @compmom I do recognize that composers have a whole different set of challenges - I think I mentioned that I have a couple of extended family members in composition, one of whom just got their PhD and is doing the adjunct thing for now. The other is older and more established, getting commissions and having works played around the world, but it took a long time to get there. I hope yours will hang in (assuming they still have their passion for the music).
And…as unpopular as I make myself at home…I’ll say one thing I told my D about an unfair world was…FOLLOW THE MONEY! I think that you can have passion and love for music and still follow the money.
For UG, I think it’s OK to not worry about this and just pick an affordable school (how much are you willing to pay for a bachelors). But as you move through UG and into grad school, I really think you need to understand (right or wrong) that music (classical, contemporary, jazz etc) is a business. My D hated it initially…but I would say…wait a minute…who’s making money on this summer program and how much? Who’s making money on auditions? Why are the least able to pay, paying the most? How do you get a piece of that pie…or get something very good for less. One good thing about a school with grad students is they all talk about this. Why should classical singers PAY a rich opera company to audition while MT and Theater companies don’t do this. And…of course the dirty little secret, the tippy top don’t always have to pay…. My D was told by teachers, you have to walk the straight and narrow and do a lot of free work and pay to auditon or you’ll never make it. She walked away from it…and guess what she still gets offered and doesn’t have to pay (admittedly not at top opera companies). She was in her mid-20s when she stopped paying to audition.
So, eyes wide open…as you learn the industry and make decisions…sniff out the money and opportunities…and make sure you aren’t the chump paying full tuition as your roommate is paying half or none! I would advise upper class men to get real comfortable talking about and thinking about money. It is a money game…AND a game of passion. They are not mutual exclusive….imho.
Amazing thread. Thank you so much for starting it and I do hope that folks will keep adding to it as their kids graduate from music college and make their way sustainably and hopefully thrive in the music world.
My son is a jazz piano player, sophomore in high school, and we just started looking at college options this week. We do wonder and worry about how he’ll make a living. We know this is his path and that all we can do is support him 100%.
For those who have posted about your adult kids making a living in music, I’d love to know where your kids went to UG. It seems important to go to school in a big jazz city if you’re a jazz player, right? It also seems important to pay as little as possible for UG, which makes nyc and Boston schools tricky. We are in the NE.
My self supporting freelance musician got his bachelors at Boston University when it only cost $40,000 a year. He also got a decent merit award which helped too.
What does he do for a living? Plays is two small bands. Teaches at a non-profit. Owns a recording and mastering studio. Teaches community college courses. Has private students. Plays in larger ensembles. And has a small part time job doing book keeping.
Certainly there are some advantages to going to school in a city where there are jazz resources outside the school as well as within. My son grew up in NYC, was going to jazz clubs and jazz jams in high school, and stayed in NYC for college (he was in the Columbia-Juilliard joint program). He probably did as much music outside school as within. Having all the cross pollination with the other music schools allowed him to continue to build his network in New York. He still plays primarily with musicians who went to the New York area schools - which includes not only Juilliard, MSM and New School, but also SUNY Purchase, William Paterson and CCNY - all of which have good jazz programs and access to the New York scene.
That said, there are many places and programs across the country where a jazz student can develop, and New York City can be overwhelming if you’re not used to it. There are vibrant jazz scenes in a number of cities and towns around the country, and for any given student, those places maybe a better choice for undergrad years. The main goal is to be somewhere where your student will find inspiration and continued joy in the music. And NYC remains an option for grad school no matter where you go for undergrad. When my son was at Juilliard, there were great musicians in the graduate jazz program there from a variety of schools, including Hartt, Indiana (Jacobs), UNT and UNC-Greensboro.
Or your son may get integrated into the jazz scene wherever he is and decide he’s comfortable there. The kids of a couple of long time posters here come to mind - one who went to UNT and is now working professionally in the DFW area, and another who is finishing up at Peabody and doing a lot of gigging in the Baltimore area. NYC is definitely not for everyone.
If your son is still in 10th grade, I would also encourage you not to get locked in or overly focused on any particular city or school at this stage. Your son will change a lot over the next two years and it’s best to stay flexible. Even during the application process. Let him find his own way. Usually the path becomes clearer the closer you get to the decision point.
Hello, Friends. S’s status as posted a year ago just several posts up from here is mostly the same (UNT, jazz bass, BM, now 24 y.o.). He has swapped some students for others, gave up a distant church gig to get a nearer one. Left the Music Academy to get more hourly pay privately, but then returned there later at the updated pay, keeping the private students, too. So he is just shoring up. The Year of Efficiency as it could be called. He also is discovering more groups of cool cats, expanding the gig network.
@GoForth, great to get an update on your son. It sounds like he’s doing well!
For those not familiar, GoForth’s epic “GoForth Journal” thread was the original journey thread started back in 2015, tracking his son’s application process over the next year and a half. It spawned the annual journey threads that have tracked the application process for so many since then. He is one of the posters I referenced in my last post, whose son went to UNT and stayed in the DFW area, where he is clearly thriving. I had the pleasure of meeting up with GoForth and his wife IRL a few years ago when my son’s trio did a show in the Chicago area. GoForth is a great resource for anyone with questions about the terrific jazz program at UNT, or really about jazz programs in general.
The snowball keeps snowballing. Son just got signed up to tour with one of my wife’s and my favorite artists. Son grew up with her music in our house and now will be performing with her. This “music thing”, as some referred to it pejoratively when my son was applying to colleges and music schools, seems to have some staying power.
Congrats to your son…and you and your wife. That’s fantastic. And yes, that silly “music thing” your “kid” is doing. I recently read an article on the show Seinfeld…and of course his real life. How no one knew if or how he made money (before he was famous) bc he didn’t work a traditional job. It’s incorporated into the show a bit…I never really noticed this when the show was running. But thinking back on it now, it did give me a chuckle of recognition.
If your kid will be in the Twin Cities on tour, let me know.
My father was a classically trained musician. He had played in a variety of professional settings in NYC in the 1960s and did a variety of studio work before starting a family.
At that point to make ends meet he did anything and everything as long as it allowed him to be around what he loved.
He taught music and was a band leader in our local public schools for 30+ years. He also taught drivers ed to make a little extra. This provided union benefits and a tenure path.
Pretty much one night every weekend he would play some sort of gig including bar mitzvahs, weddings etc. He ultimately worked at a local multi event catering hall and was part of their “house band” so that the income was steadier and more predictable. This was how he scrapped together the deposit for my childhood home.
He also taught a never ending stream of private lessons. Some kids were reluctant participants while several went on to become professional musicians.
As he got older he started doing band arrangements for several elementary music publishing houses and ultimately had some original works published. This was his summer gig.
I remember some nights in our very humble house when he would have friends over and they would jam for hours. Studio musicians, members of a few well known bands, a few of his students it didn’t matter they would play and hang around.
When he died I got to realize the extent of his impact. Many of those same people he had played with or taught showed up at his funeral (we encouraged them to bring instruments) and played an impromptu version of the Doobies song “listen to the music”.
It was a tough financial slog at times I suspect but thanks to his music in retrospect he might have been the richest person I have known.
For those of you in NYC, son is doing a FREE show with Rickie Lee Jones on Saturday at the bandshell in Prospect Park, Brooklyn. I went to a couple of their shows last month and they were great! Rickie Lee Jones | Thornetta Davis | Chris Pierce | BRIC
