<p>fluffy, I was referring to the marketplace for the degree, not for consumers shopping for colleges. If employers “the world over” valued degrees from certain institutions more than others, they would pay more for their graduates. Perhaps this is true in rare cases, but for most employers graduates of fancy colleges are working side by side, and getting paid the same, as graduates of “lesser” schools. dumbo’s post above is a good example of this.</p>
<p>I am repeating myself here, but I think the take-home is that at Ivies and similar ‘full-needs" schools, most of the middle class does get aid. The upper reaches of it don’t. As oldfort says, it’s a donut hole, in the sense that they have too much income to qualify, but not enough to not feel it. I myself would say it’s not the colleges’ responsibility to make it painless; I’d rather see the money go to those who couldn’t pay no matter how much they tried, because their lives are downsized already. I think you can divide people into four categories:</p>
<p>Low-income to lower middle: will get a lot of aid
middle income to upper middle: will get some aid (that’s where we are now; and we got quite a lot.)
Higher reaches of upper: will not get aid, but will feel the payments (used to be in this category.)
rich: will not get aid, and can easily make the payments.</p>
<p>As I said above, I don’t know that it’s the colleges’ responsibility to smooth over that bump at my somewhat arbitrary third level. I don’t think it means they “don’t want” those students and families. I think it’s a decision that at that point, the money could be there and it’s then the choice of the family whether that’s how they want to spend it or not.</p>
<p>Which seems like a reasonable viewpoint to me.</p>
<p>“Perhaps this is true in rare cases, but for most employers graduates of fancy colleges are working side by side, and getting paid the same, as graduates of “lesser” schools.” <== That is patently false.</p>
<p>@sally305 Please, in your own words, tell me why hundred of thousands of kids every year apply to Ivies? If the exact same opportunities exist at cheaper, easier entry, less competitive colleges, what’s the point? Why are undergraduate colleges even ranked? Why are Ivies feeder schools into the most competitive positions? Do you really think a full ride student from Oberlin or Florida State U can get a Goldman Sachs or McKinsey interview? Breaking news: they can’t.</p>
<p>edison–I like how you added in Florida State after Oberlin. :)</p>
<p>You are fixated on the financial services industry, which does favor students from the Ivy pipeline. But many posters here can give you examples of students from a wide range of colleges who are also working on Wall Street. And there are many top-notch MBA programs that award degrees in specializations other than finance (i.e., marketing, marketing research, operations management, arts administration, etc.). These schools want students with a variety of undergraduate backgrounds.</p>
<p>Many of us work in fields other than the financial sector. We know firsthand that a student’s undergraduate origins are less important than other factors in whether he or she will succeed in their job and their career. Go to Target, Google, or any of hundreds of other notable companies and you will see employees with diverse educational backgrounds working side by side. You can try to find evidence that an undergraduate degree from an Ivy League university gives students an edge in every hiring situation but I am afraid you will come up empty-handed.</p>
<p>edison, </p>
<p><a href=“http://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/the-short-list-college/articles/2013/01/08/10-colleges-that-get-the-most-applications”>http://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/the-short-list-college/articles/2013/01/08/10-colleges-that-get-the-most-applications</a></p>
<p>Rank of schools by # of applications received. </p>
<p>
1: Bull.
2: Not everyone who goes to an Ivy is going to get an interview either. </p>
<p>“But many posters here can give you examples of students from a wide range of colleges who are also working on Wall Street.” Comments like this display your diminished capacity. For the most selective positions, there is a narrow scope of schools they grant interviews to. But hey, keep obsessing over schools you’re not affiliated with, massaging data and sharing anecdotes to fit your narrative. The rest of the world knows the elite go to Ivies and the other schools in the top 10. The less elite go to the next lower tier and so on and so forth. College sorts people out where they belong.</p>
<p>
Because $15k is somehow comparable to $240k? or $480k, or $720k? Seriously?</p>
<p>
Wow. Just wow.</p>
<p>So glad my kids are not going to a place that teaches this kind of carp.</p>
<p>“Because $15k is somehow comparable to $240k? or $480k, or $720k? Seriously?” <== How does an absolutely max of $65k per year turn into $240k-720k? Where do you people learn your debate tactics? Yes, I’d say a $15k vacation last summer is a lot…if the school asks you to kick in $20k or $30k this year. Just as those $12k in BMW payments are a lot…or the $40k you spent on the kitchen, etc.</p>
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</p>
<p>Wow, thanks for the diagnosis! I’ve been wondering why I misplace my glasses a lot lately.</p>
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</p>
<p>This is pretty funny coming from the person who has offered ZERO data to support his claim and whose first post on this thread started with “one of my cousins is currently at an Ivy league school. Her internships have come from friends of her new friends at school. Last summer she worked at a prestigious law firm where her best friend’s dad is a partner. And she’s always invited to cool trips.”</p>
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<p>This is good to know! Thanks for speaking for the “rest of the world.” Maybe someday we will all have universal identification cards that color-code us by our “eliteness rating.” And of course this rating will be based solely on where we got our undergraduate degrees. It will certainly help ensure that the most elite people get preferential treatment in the job market, as well as faster service in restaurants and potentially even VIP traffic lanes on our busy expressways.</p>
<p>The $240k-$720k spread encompasses those families with one to three kids from parents that are full-pay because of income. ($60k/year x 4 years = $240k for one kid. Multiply that by 3 for 3 kids.)</p>
<p>And thankfully, I’m only required to shell out $480k for my two kids. I’m doubly thankful that my family is not going to Europe this summer. Because goodness knows that could totally make a difference!</p>
<p>Oh, one last thing… How long does the kid named Edison96 get to insult folks here? I get that this is a young person with zero life experience, but really? Diminished capacity is an acceptable insult here?</p>
<p>This is getting surreal! Just heard from Purdue – $0 merit scholarships. My son has 36 ACT, 1600 SAT, 4.2 GPA, APs out the wazoo, Eagle Scout, etc. Who exactly is getting the merit scholarships??? </p>
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</p>
<p>To make money for USNWR and the others.</p>
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<p>Comments like this display your immaturity.</p>
<p>“To make money for USNWR and the others.” <== So nobody knew there was a difference between Yale and Stanford and say…DePaul and Boston U if there weren’t for-profit rankings? Ha, ok.</p>
<p>“The $240k-$720k spread encompasses those families with one to three kids from parents that are full-pay because of income. ($60k/year x 4 years = $240k for one kid. Multiply that by 3 for 3 kids.)” <== Yes, there are SO many struggling families out there paying full rate at Harvard x3 kids. A world class education costs money. If you’re expected to pay full rate and can’t, well, then you are mismanaging your income and net worth.</p>
<p>Edison, you’re just yanking our chains right? You can’t be for real.</p>
<p>I worked for a guy who went to Colorado State and work, on Wall Street, for Goldman Sachs (and always told that story that Goldman told him they didn’t hire from the great unwashed but he got an interview and the job, and he was not from a wealthy family and had no connections).</p>
<p>He was still a jerk. He just would have been even more of a jerk if he’d gone to Harvard. Another partner in this company had gone to Princeton. Also a jerk. General Counsel had gone to Nebraska. Nice guy.</p>
<p>“I worked for a guy who went to Colorado State and work, on Wall Street, for Goldman Sachs (and always told that story that Goldman told him they didn’t hire from the great unwashed but he got an interview and the job, and he was not from a wealthy family and had no connections).” <== You know you just proved my point with “Goldman told him they didn’t hire from the great unwashed,” yes? So they let in a couple of outliers. Cool story.</p>