<p>My son struggled through Algebra 1, but got an A; sailed through Geometry, and is struggling miserably through Algebra 2 (but still managing a B). He is so SICK of math. (And really, who can blame him?) Now he's finally looking at his schedule for his senior year, and his advisor is recommending Trig/Stats. My question is, how important is it for him to have four years of math? </p>
<p>Cal State University Long Beach is his college of choice. I looked at their website today, and the requirement is for THREE years of math, while four are recommended.</p>
<p>Currently he's signed up for Trig/Stats, but he's lobbying HARD against it. And he feels so strongly about not EVER taking Calculus that he's decided not to major in business simply because he doesn't want to fulfill the Calculus requirement. Instead, he's decided he'd rather major in marketing. </p>
<p>From my standpoint AP English, AP Gov, AP Econ and Chemistry is quite enough. I have a hard time, as an adult, comprehending the point of more math at advanced levels. Unless one is pursuing a career in math, science, engineering, or technology, there is no use for Trigonomics, Statistics or Calculus. What do you all think? Do you have a different point of view about this?</p>
<p>And also, would it impede his chances of getting into college if he didn't take Trig/Stats or Calculus? If he fulfilled the mandatory three-year math requirement, and opted out of the RECOMMENDED fourth year?</p>
<p>Uh, it’s hard to say. You don’t want to limit your options, whether it be choosing a college or major, because of one class. Most colleges want four years of math, the only exception being if you were very advanced.</p>
<p>First of all, trigonometry is useful for the math portion of standardized tests, isn’t it? I thought it was–maybe I’m wrong. So if he takes the GRE down the line for B-school, it could be useful now. </p>
<p>As far as calculus, he might be able to fulfill that at a community college, and therefore, would still be able to major in business.</p>
<p>The point of the liberal arts is that they are supposed to stretch your mind. Math is easy and enjoyable if you can reason abstractly. Maybe your son is trying to memorize equations, and this is why he hates it. If he learns to reason abstractly, this can add a dimension to his thinking in other fields.</p>
<p>Basically, if he does not take the high school math needed to be ready for calculus in college, he will have to take it anyway as a remedial course in college before taking the calculus course required for the business major. This can delay graduation, leading to extra costs of attendance.</p>
<p>I would personally have him take Math. You do not want to limit admissions options early in the game. Also many colleges require math as part of the degree. To me it is a form of literacy and a core competency- most HS students have survived trig As a rite of passage.</p>
<p>Missed your marketing comment. Math is a fundamental skill for that major. The marketing folks I work with spend much if their time with models and stats.</p>
<p>In the world of college admissions, “recommended” is really “required”. Have him find a tutor if necessary. A B really is NOT a bad grade. Also, what other schools is he considering? They may require 4 years of math. The only time 3 years of math is acceptable is if there isn’t an offering for the 4th year, but typically that happens when kids take Calc BC junior year.</p>
<p>I think it really depends on what your sons interests are, and what he’s planning to pursue in college.</p>
<p>Probably the most practical high school math class is Statistics – your son might want to research how tackling this class now can help him as he move forward.</p>
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And this is why the US does so poorly compared to the rest of the world in math. Math is fundamental to so many fields. If he quits now he’s going to have to catch up if he ends up in one of them.</p>
<p>That math aversion could limit his choice of major and career, even if it doesn’t prevent him from going to the college of his choice. I’m not familiar with CSU-LB, but at my D’s college both statistics and calculus are required for marketing majors (not the full calculus series, but Calc for business and social science). At least at our HS, Trig/Stats is not a particularly difficult math class. I think it’s important for your son to stretch himself academically, even in a subject he doesn’t like. Many colleges have math gen ed requirements, and taking math senior year of high school would keep his math skills from getting “stale” before he has to take that math course. I know a young woman who struggled with math in high school (she has a visual spatial LD that makes some math quite difficult for her). Although she has a liberal arts type major, it turns out that she needs a stats course to graduate. She put it off and put it off, and now is struggling mightily with it in the last semester of her senior year - if she doesn’t pass it, she doesn’t graduate from college. If this was my child, I’d be encouraging him to take math whether it’s an absolute requirement at his college or not. I’d be trying to build his confidence in math, and certainly not saying things like “and really, who can blame him?”. If he needs a tutor, so be it. And if he doesn’t get a stellar grade, I still think it’s better to have tried.</p>
<p>Leaving aside all of the excellent advice above, I find it difficult to comprehend why a person who is so averse to math would even think of majoring in business or marketing.</p>
<p>Sometimes an A does not means a “mastered” subject, specially if it came with difficulty. Math requires practice. Everyday. Short periods of 15 min a day, everyday can make a HUGE difference. My daughter always struggled in Math in elementary school. She would start the year well and slide. I tried tutors and they helped a little when she was going to start Algebra I got concerned, so I’ve heard of a Japanese method called Komon (actually a knew about it for 20 year). They took a look at her and they make her start do what? Additions. Additions??? I said to the lady thar my child was going to ALGEBRA 1. She said that she had to ADD. She did. The trick was that she had to make additions everyday for 15 min and they were timed. As she got better the additions got bigger until they were three digit. The same happen with subtraction, multiplication and division. In a year she was able to multiply three digit numbers by memory and would finish a test 5 to 10 min ahead of her friends. She will be a senior next year going to AP cal 2. Sometimes the biggest problems with algebra and math in general are Arithmetic mistakes, lack of organization ( need to have your work well written) and finally poor knowledge of basic concepts. My son also did the same course and has finish all Math AP courses available in is HS and is going to major in Engineering.</p>
<p>Our school district requires 4 years of math to earn HS diploma. It seems to me that a well rounded schedule should include math each year just as it does English.</p>
<p>Even though I am a math teacher, I will admit that there are plenty of adults who live happy, productive lives without understanding trigonometry. I still think a serious, college-intending high-school student should take it.</p>
<p>I will not say the same about statistics. Every educated person, ideally every consumer, should understand a little bit of statistics. Advertising and newspapers are filled with so many misleading statistics, and so many statistics that do not say what they’re claimed to say, that anybody who doesn’t learn basic statistics is just asking to be duped and swindled.</p>
<p>Why is this aversion to math so common? Collegealum314 said it best -</p>
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<p>Granted, I may be a little biased, since math is a fundamental part of my job. But think about this the other way around, would it be reasonable for me to say I should not have to take multiple years of English, or History? I don’t use them to earn a living, so why waste the time. After all, AP Calc, AP Physics, AP Chem should be enough. Sounds silly when I put it that way, doesn’t it?</p>
<p>BTW, a fundamental part of trig is proofs. These teach logical methods to prove a point based on a given starting point, based on bit of knowledge learned prior.</p>
<p>I’m not really sure. My eldest is a junior and has chosen not to take math her senior year. She just hates it… good at it… but hates it. In her case though, she was on an accelerated path so took algebra 1 in 7th grade. She opted out of Calculus and took a college Statistics (and LOVED it BTW.) Most schools will count a year of high school math that she took in middle school so technically… still has 4 years and high math scores on SAT. She is instead doing 4 years of science, social studies and foreign language and hopes that will even things out a bit. As a parent, I don’t think it’s ideal but it’s also not my life. If he’s done… well, he may be done. I’d guess doing well in his other classes would be better than taking trig and suffering across the board.</p>
<p>DS sounds like the OPs son. He was SO done with math after algebra two. But he took statistics one semester and economics one semester when he was a senior. No trig (precalc) for him.</p>