How important is Calculus for college admissions?

Pre-College Issues Home Schooling and College
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<p>My daughter is currently a 9th grader and math is not one of her favorite subjects! She does well in it, but doesn't like it (go figure!)</p>

<p>We use Teaching Textbooks and here's our plan so far:</p>

<p>9th grade - Algebra I
10th grade - Geometry
11th grade - Algebra II
12th grade - Precalculus</p>

<p>Should I have her do one of these over the summer so she does take Calculus in her Senior year? Or is this enough do you think? </p>

<p>She hopes to major in Biology. She isn't planning on any ivy league admissions, but she <em>does</em> have William & Mary and the University of Virginia on her list -- both of them only accept about 35% of their applicants, so they're rather tough to get into, even if we <em>are</em> in-state.</p>

<p>Thoughts? Opinions?</p>

<p>Thanks in advance!</p>

<p>Kelly</p>

2

<p>How funny Kelly--I've seen your calculus post all over today--we hang out at the same places! ;-)
I think it depends on the major and the college. Since it's biology you're talking about, I think that a good solid grounding in trig and precalc would be more useful. Since she's not that fond of it, I would allow her to spend more time loading up on science courses. One drawback I DO see--she won't be that far into trig when time to take the ACT/SAT. Both have trig on them... You might think about getting half a year ahead--do half of geometry in the summer... My oldest never took calculus until college, but she's a music major. My 17yo is currently taking at our local college, but she wants engineering.</p>

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<p>hsmamainva, I would imagine it would be a good idea to get the calculus in if she's interested in pursuing a science major in college. </p>

<p>My daughter was also good at math but didn't like it. She ended up skipping pre-calc and going right into calculus. She had to scramble a little, but had no problem with it and wonder of wonders - she came out loving calculus! </p>

<p>You might want to get the materials for the AP Math 2C (I think that's the one - it's the less intensive of two math AP tests) and just aim for that, or find an AP calculus class in your community or online.</p>

4

<p>There are two SAT II math tests, the 1C and the 2C, with the latter going into more advanced math. Neither contains calculus. Then there are two AP calculus tests, AB and BC, again with the latter going further.</p>

<p>I don't know about the new SAT, but the ACT has only limited trig on it. There are only a few questions each time and you can answer them by learning a few identities that will be covered in any prep book. Since your daughter is not a math lover, she might find she likes and does better on the ACT.</p>

<p>Advancing the math a bit could make an application more competitive. But doing so with someone who doesn't like math that much may be setting yourself up for problems. Have you checked with potential colleges? Perhaps you could ask on the boards here for specific schools and see what the admitted students say ...</p>

<p>One way I can see you might accelerate things is by doing algebra 2 immediately after algebra 1. This makes the subject hang together better and you also spare yourself all the review of algebra 1 that is built into algebra 2 courses (because they assume over a year break from the material -- a summer, a school year, then another summer).</p>

<p>How wedded are you to Teaching Textbooks? We did Videotext Algebra in a little over a year and it contains both algebra 1 and 2. Now Videotext is coming out with modules for their combined geometry/trig course. If you did it this way, you could spend 1 1/2 years on each course and be ready for calculus in 12th. Of course, if you really like TT, it might be foolish to change, particularly because VT is so pricey and not everyone likes it. (We did.) You still might accelerate things by doing the TT algebra courses sequentially.</p>

<p>Another possibility is to accelerate geometry a bit by doing fewer proofs and then use the "extra" time to get through a text that covers both algebra 2 and trig. Since I see you asked this question on the Well-Trained Mind board, you could well be planning on doing logic as well. You can get lots of proofs by doing symbolic logic, in addition to informal and formal.</p>

<p>I believe there are texts that cover both precalculus and calculus as well. You could use one of these in 12th grade.</p>

<p>Decisions, decisions. Perhaps the best thing would be to have your daughter do the research and decide for herself if she wants to accelerate her math. By the time my daughter was in high school I was giving her a lot of say about what courses she would take and with what resources. I would help her research and frame the choices to be made, but the ultimate decisions were hers. The education was hers, after all. Having her make the decisions made it far easier to keep her plugging away on unpopular courses, which in her case were math as well. She was aiming for a particular Ivy League school (which she is now attending) and so knew she needed a year of math beyond precalculus. Rather than AP calculus, we did a semester of applied calculus and one of applied statistics (using popular college texts for nonscience majors). </p>

<p>But that's another issue -- with a planned science major your dd will need calculus. Fortunately, my daughter's college has no distribution requirements so she doesn't have to take any math there!</p>

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<p>two things</p>

<p>I am a sr in hs (homeschool of course) I and not very fond of or good at math........I flunked math in 8th and had to retake it in 9th that put me behind a year. In 10th I took pre algebra and in 11th took algebra just barly passing. I was taking geometry this year but I was doing horrible and I was only going to lower my GPA ....... I am going to be a writing major so even with my poor math skills I was accepted to my first choice in colleges.......</p>

<p>But when it comes to the college testing (I took the ACT) I wish I had done better in math......... I scored a 25 out of 36 overall........ I would have done better had it not been for the math........ that is my only regret..... I forgot what exactly I got in math but it was some where around a 17.... thats not good ....... </p>

<p>College testing is important for homeschoolers.</p>

6

<p>Frankly, I would say she has had enough. I am a Biology major and didn't take Calculus at all. The highest Math in high school was Alg. II.</p>

<p>The only advantage about your daughter taking the Calculus is to raise her SAT scores. This can help into getting scholarships.</p>

<p>However, I'd just let her go on to college without it. This is my opinion.
Mom of four sons.</p>

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<p>hello....send your daughter to real high school!</p>

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<p>Hello....that post was neither helpful nor productive.</p>

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<p>Thanks for your help everyone!! (Well, except one of you...lol)</p>

<p>We've decided to go ahead and have her take Calculus. Now that she's added Duke and Emory to her college list, it's no longer 'optional' if she wants to be competitive for admissions!</p>

<p>Kelly</p>

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<p>Calculus is cool!</p>

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<p>Calculus is...interesting...</p>

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<p>So far, so good for calc. But that's not saying much as we only did limits and some derivatives so far.</p>

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<p>Those of you taking calculus (or who never quite got it or understood what it was actually for) might enjoy Berlinski, A Tour of the Calculus. To read in your abundant free time LOL ...</p>

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<p>I liked differential calculus. Integral calculus suck $(%#%#@$</p>

15

<p>Stanford has decided to require economics majors to take multivariable calculus / linear algebra as a prerequisite to economics courses after the beginning two quarter sequence. This includes the econ policy types, not just the mathematical economics types.</p>

<p>Of course, its possible to take the BC-level course as a first term freshman and not be behind, except that you may be in a course with sandbaggers who have already been exposed to BC or didn't get a high enough grade on the AP exam.</p>

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<p>I'd just like to jump in here, but not from a homeschooling perspective (I hs two boys) but from a used-to-be-a-science-major's perspective.</p>

<p>I was at a great college and I wanted to be a science (Biology or Chemistry) major. I had taken AP Biology and done well in high school (this was about 12 years ago when I started college). I dual-enrolled Trig and aced it.. no big deal for me. </p>

<p>But what I found was that upper-level classes ate my lunch, specifically Physics for science majors, and the Calcs that came along with being a science major. So I had to change majors, because I made it through Calc I and II but after that, no more. There was no way I could go on. It was just too much for me. </p>

<p>So what I wanted to say was that if your daughter is really, truly going for the science major, it is ESSENTIAL that she is able to do well in upper-level maths (Calculus, etc.) when she gets to college. This is the stuff that weeded me out. One way or another if she is a science major, your daughter and all forms of Calculus are going to have to be close friends. </p>

<p>I hope this makes sense. I ended up majoring in Political Science instead. You want fries with that?? :) I guess what's good is that now that I am homeschooling my boys, and they are math and science guys, the classes I took in college that didn't end up counting toward my poly sci major give me confidence to homeschool math and science loving guys. It always shuts up anyone getting bratty about my homeschooling: "Yeah, well, I have a B.S. in political science with a minor in criminal justice but I also took Chem I, Chem II, Biochem, Organic Chem I, Biology I, Biology II, Anatomy & Phys. I and II, Botany, Zoology, Trig, Calc. I, Calc. II, Physics for Science Majors I.... just what are you saying I'm not qualified to teach my boys???" LOL!</p>