How is financial aid amount determined?

Paying for College
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<p>to piggyback on cpt’s post</p>

<p>When applying for student financial aid from the federal government based on the information submitted by the student and their parent(s). </p>

<p>The FAFSA determines your eligiblity to receive federal aid : pell grants, seog grants (if applicable to your school) federal work study and federal student loans (subsidized/unsubsidized stafford loans and perkins loans). The FAFSA is required by all public colleges and universities and an overwhelming number of private schools require the FAFSA (some in addition to other FA forms).</p>

<p>Approximately 350 schools use the CSS profile to gather additional financial information in order to grant their own institutional aid.</p>

<p>If you attend a profile school, they use a combination of both the federal and institutional methodologies. </p>

<p>At minimum you file the FAFSA (at almost every school) to determine your eligibility for federal aid (Pell/ seog grants, stafford and perkins loans). Most public univeristies will just require the fafsa (the exception may be UVA, UNC- CH, Mich and a few others which may require their own forms)</p>

<p>The CSS profile is used at different colleges that distribute their own institutional aid (Many of these schools have much deeper pockets).</p>

<p>Many schools that use a federal methodology to determine EFC will require only the FAFSA. Schools that use an instutional methodology or a combination of the 2 will require the CSS profile or their own FA forms.</p>

<p>Differences between the IM and FM models are</p>

<p>IM collects information on estimated academic year family income, medical expenses, elementary and secondary school tuition and unusual circumstances. FM omits these questions.</p>

<p>IM considers a fuller range of family asset information, while FM ignores assets of siblings, all assets of certain families with less than $50,000 of income, and both home and family farm equity. Different schools look at home equity differently. some schools do not look at home equity, some schools look at home equity as a mulitplyer of income for example some s example if you have 150k in income, they may think that 1.5*150k (225k)or 150k * 2 (300K) of your home equity can be used to pay for college while still another set of schools may think at all home equity should be available to pay for college</p>

<p>FM defines income as the “adjusted gross income” on federal tax returns, plus various categories of untaxed income. </p>

<p>IM includes in total income any paper depreciation, business, rental or capital losses which artificially reduce adjusted gross income.</p>

<p>FM does not assume a minimum student contribution to education; IM expects the student, as primary beneficiary of the education, to devote some time each year to earning money to pay for education.</p>

<p>FM ignores the noncustodial parent in cases of divorce or separation; IM expects parents to help pay for education, regardless of current marital status.</p>

<p>FM and IM apply different percentages to adjust the parental contribution when multiple siblings are simultaneously enrolled in college, and IM considers only siblings enrolled in undergraduate programs.</p>

<p>The IM expected family share represents a best estimate of a family’s capacity (relative to other families) to absorb, over time, the costs of education. It is not an assessment of cash on hand, a value judgment about how much a family should be able to use current income, or a measure of liquidity. The final determinations of demonstrated need and awards rest with the University and are based upon a uniform and consistent treatment of family circumstances.</p>

<p>Except in the most extraordinary circumstances, Colleges classifies incoming students as dependent upon parents for institutional aid purposes, even though some students may meet the federal definition of “independence.”</p>

<p>The profile will take into consideration tuition for children attending high school. They may consider school expenses outside of high school for special needs children. They will consider unreimbursed medical expenses and taking care of elderly parents.</p>

<p>Students enrolling as dependent students are considered dependent throughout their undergraduate years when need for institutional scholarships is determined.</p>

<p>For institutional aid purposes a student may not “declare” independence due to attainment of legal age, internal family arrangements, marriage or family disagreements.</p>

<p>Your COA (cost of attendance) is tuition, room board, books travel expenses and some misc. expenses associated with attending college.</p>

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<p>@kelsmom: That’s awesome! Nashville sounds great! I also don’t plan to rush in college so I’m glad to hear that your daughter had a good time out of a sorority at Vandy. Also, I love singer-singwriter music too (it’s definitely my favorite style!) so it’s a relief that your daughter loved the music scene in Nashville! Thanks so much for the information!</p>

<p>@Slithey Tove: That makes sense. Although I hate to admit it because it makes me really sad, almost everyone here agrees that I should apply RD, or not at all, basically. I know it makes sense, and I pride myself on being logical, so I know it’s not the right choice to apply ED. It breaks my heart, but I’ll definitely be discussing it more with my mom whether or not to apply ED. I’m sure I’ll be happy wherever I end up, and if I don’t go to Duke for Undergrad, maybe I’ll apply for grad school (even though I know they have like a 5% med school acceptance rate). I’m not going to delude myself into thinking I could get in RD, I know the chances are quite slim. </p>

<p>@cptofthehouse: Thanks for that. I feel like that put everthing in this thread into one post. I followed the whole thing and I feel like I’ve put everthing together now.</p>

<p>Just another question: Do you think that I would get bad financial aid at Duke if my dad’s income was included? 110K before taxes? I’m not sure if that’s low or high or average compared to the majority of applicants at Duke, but if everyone applying ED had really high incomes (enough to be able to afford Duke without considering finaid) would mine still be considered relatively low, with my dad’s income included? I’m really just wondering, I know this doesn’t really mean anything and my family income compared to others’ family income doesn’t mean anthing/change anything.</p>

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<p>Run your numbers through Duke’s net price calculator, so that you can see what the EFC is going to be.</p>

<p>Run it 3 times; once using only your mother’s income, once using only your father’s income and once using their combined income (see if the combined income is more or less than the using the incomes of your parents separately (which will happen when you file the profile and the non-custodial profile).</p>

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<p>Duke’s NPC is pretty accurate because they guarantee to meet need, and give virtually no merit money. They also tend to be straightforward in how they dispense it. So play around with it.</p>

<p>You probably will do pretty well with two in college, and better yet with three. Also,find out if Duke is a no loan school, because if it is, you will be able to get the Stafford DIrect loans on top of what they give. Also, since PELL is based on custodial parent alone, you will be eligible for that. You might want to call Duke financial aid and ask if they integrate the PELL and the Staffords into their need or if that goes on top of it. </p>

<p>It’s difficult to try to figure out where you will get the best deals because even schools that say they meet full need, have their own definitons of need, different ways they meet need, and some give different types of packages to students with the same need with their top picks getting preferential packaging (no loans/work, or very little). The example I gave with the Staffords and PELL is just one example of how different schools will treat the same thing.</p>

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<p>The thing with ED is that the schools themselves want it to be a done deal, so if you have threads hanging like NCP waivers and other complications, they are likely to not want to deal with it at that time. The ED gives students a bit of a leeway at some schools but in exchange the student has to be in the position to accept. The schools do not want to deal with ED kids once that process is finished, as their big job is coming right up–the deluge of the RD applications. You are supposed to be a done deal by the time they start with them. </p>

<p>If you can get the NCP forms in as soon as possible and get some sort of green light before the ED deadline for it from the Duke financial aid office, that might be a way to try to go. Frankly, I see and read about situations like yours all of the time, and don’t see any reason why you should be given a NCP waiver. It just comes down to your father refusing to pay or not having the money to pay even with an income where he should be contributing, or refusing to fill out your forms. There are tens, no hundreds, of thousands of kids in that same situation. The ones who get NCPs are generally those whose parents are no where to be found, have not been in the students life for years, have documented abuse issues, and certainly not paying child support, court mandated or not. Sybbie deals with cases like this, and she can tell you that kids in far more dire straits than you are denied the NCP. A parents refusal to pay or cooperate is not reason enough.</p>

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<p>Madison,</p>

<p>It has been my experience as a person who writes a lot of 3rd party letters is that colleges have become more discerning as far as who and the situations that qualify for a non-custodial waiver. It is not simply you or your mom writing a letter talking about your situation. It is about 3rd party letters detailing from personal knowledge your home situation and providing additional documentation. </p>

<p>You will not get a waiver because your dad refuses to pay anything after his support agreement ends (this is his right), however, the school will not give you institutional aid because of his decision. If your dad has extenuating circumstances that limit his money (unreimbursed medical expenses, caring for your elderly grandparents, loss of income) he can state all of this on his non-custodial profile.</p>

<p>The waiver forms will ask the following information</p>

<p>Date of your parents divorce</p>

<p>Legal orders that limit your noncustodial parent’s contact with you (i.e. restraining order, police report, or divorce decree). </p>

<p>Has your noncustodial parent ever claimed you as a dependent on a federal tax return? If yes, indicate the most recent tax year that this occurred, Depending on your parent’s divorce decree, he may be able to file you as dependents in alternate years (not unusual with divorced parents.</p>

<p>How many times in the past year have you had contact with your noncustodial parent?</p>

<p>What was the nature of the contact (e.g., letter, visit, phone call)?</p>

<p>If no contact in the past year, indicate the date and nature of last contact with your noncustodial parent</p>

<p>They will ask Did your noncustodial parent pay child support in 2012? Your father is under a current support order and will still be paying for your younger sister after you and your sister turn 18.</p>

<p>If yes, indicate the total amount paid for you (the student) </p>

<p>For other children (your sisters)</p>

<p>If the support is voluntary, court ordered or paid by wage garnishment</p>

<p>The expected date child support will end for you (the student)</p>

<p>You have to also attest that the information is true (lying can have dire consequences ranging from being kicked out of school to having to repay all of the institutional aid granted to you, to having your diploma rescinded leaving your with a worthless piece of paper). The school can ask for a certified copy of your parents divorce decree, child support order, back joint tax statements or anything else when it comes to giving out their money.</p>

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<p>Hi! Thanks for all the information and sorry for being absent for a while. I can see that the NCP waiver form isn’t for me judging by the information you have given and the overall agreement on the subject. I will just have to rely on scholarships from my high school and university (in addition to pell grants and such) for most of my college funding. Thanks for the insight. I will continue thinking about whether or not to apply early and will make a decision after I visit in Sepember. Thanks to everyone for all the help throughout this and if I do decide to apply ED I will definitely have other schools I apply to EA as a backup and will have many hopes and prayers on my side. I honestly believe that what will happen will happen, and if it’s not meant to be then I will just be denied. Thanks for all your help and I wish every one of you the best!
-Madison</p>