<p>I think my problem isn’t so much processing the info, but more the actual writing part.
When an instructor starts introducing a concept, it can be hard to see whether this is going to be one of many concepts, or one of 2 or 3 key concepts that we will discuss, or the main point of the class that we will develop and scrutinize, or a big element that will be covered through multiple classes. In HS, things were presented with a clear outline, and I knew that we were covering Chapter 1, Section A, paragraph b, so my notes would look like:</p>
<p>TITLE</p>
<p>A) Sub-title
b) paragraph title</p>
<p>(Material)</p>
<p>Any digression or side-remark was actually announced in HS. But in college lectures, I’m confused about the relationship between the various elements of the class, and what outline I’m supposed to write down. Especially in humanities classes with a lot of class discussions, I’m confused about whether the professor is making a concession to get the student to say more about their point of view, or if they don’t want to completely disregard their opinion, or if they are actually teaching concepts that I should be writing down. Even when I get past my note-organizing problems, I’m still confused about whether or not the material I’m writing down is important or even accurate.</p>
<p>I’m thinking I would be MORE confused if I didn’t attend the class given this description. </p>
<p>I think a key element for you will be to make good use of the professor’s office hours. My kids found that their professors were very willing to clarify class information for students if they somehow were confused.</p>
<p>CooperU - have you tried looking at the required readings and structuring them in the way you describe (major/minor/incredibly important concepts)? If you can do that before each lecture, that might help you identify what the prof is focusing on - it becomes a matter of familiarity and might help you organize your notes afterwards.</p>
<p>Cooper- go to the tutoring center at your college (it may have a different name) and get help with your note taking skills. I have new grads working for me who are proud of the fact that they are terrible note-takers-- and guess what- they are terrible employees as well. When we sit down for a staff meeting I don’t post my notes online (apparently if you stop going to class at some colleges you can just get an online summary); I don’t have a textbook; I don’t hold office hours. My employees are supposed to show up at the meeting, take notes which explain what they are responsible for and when they’re supposed to have it done, and make notations about possible difficulties or challenges that colleagues raise during the discussion.</p>
<p>But no. They like participating in the discussion; they like the free food; they even like that they’re responsible for accomplishing something after the meeting ends. They just don’t like having to write it all down. One of them said to me recently, “isn’t that why we have secretaries?” Uh no, when you watch Mad Men Don Draper doesn’t need to take notes. But 10 years ago we went from 1 admin for 5 employees to 1 admin for 12 employees and he or she doesn’t get paid to take notes for you.</p>
<p>You will have great difficulty in the working world-- even if you have trouble with auditory processing and need to see things in the print- if you cannot master the process of sitting in a lecture, organizing what you hear, and then writing down the pertinent “must remember” ideas. That’s what you will do in a job- even in the most free-wheeling, creative environment where everyone is brainstorming all the time and you’ve got white boards and fancy technology… at some point, you will sit down in a room, someone else (your boss, the head of engineering, the CEO, a visiting scholar, someone from the Venture Capital firm about to invest 5 million dollars in your company) is going to speak, and you will need to capture the salient points on paper or on your laptop.</p>
<p>Go to the tutoring center and get help. Don’t let this hold you back.</p>
<p>I’m not an engineer so YMMV , but in my experience of work, taking good notes in meetings, on conference calls, summarizing a conversation via email etc, are all necessary requirements - especially for entry level roles where the junior may often get given a lot of admin and support tasks for the team…</p>
<p>therefore, although you may get through your degree with using textbooks, problem sets etc, it may hit you when you start work. I encourage you to follow the advice given above re office hours and college tutor centre …</p>
<p>Depends on the professors and the classes. If you’re taking a class where attendance isn’t mandatory and all your professor(s) does is read off of the lecture slides that they post online word for word, I’d say don’t waste your time coming to class.</p>
<p>Cooper, as I read through your post, I found that you were making excuses for yourself. For example, you say you are a late night person. Well, if being a late night person doesn’t fit the schedule before you, you have to adjust. And I say this as someone who used to be up until 4am virtually every night. You don’t know the professor’s motivation. If you don’t know then ask the professor what his or her motivation was for asking the question that confuses you. You can’t deal with deviation from an outline. Life is a deviation from an outline. We are always hit with unexpected events. You are no longer in high school. It’s time to become an adult. And I am not saying that in a mean way. That is part of the reason for going to college.</p>
<p>OK, this will sound obnoxious, but it’s true. My son is an engineering student at a large CA flagship school known for its rigorous, competitive engineering program. He skips classes routinely. The professors don’t care (there are 500 in the class). He’s never gotten below an A in any STEM class, and occasionally gets close to the highest test grade in the class.</p>
<p>He’s smart enough to work the system and to use his time to the best of his needs. Believe me, he is driven and focused and doesn’t blow off a class because of a hangover or whatever. Maybe the OP is the same way. As long as it works for you, and you’re learning and succeeding, why not? However, I have no idea if this method would work at a private school.</p>
<p>yes, generally if the classes have hundreds of kids then there is no attendance taken. That said, some large classes at my school, especially science classes, require students to buy a “clicker” so that quiz questions can be put on the board and each student can submit their answer by clicker, which obviously checks attendance and gives missing students a 0 for that assignment.</p>
<p>I know that one of the best ways to be successful in college is to attend class regularly. If you are not interested in attending classes, while not go to college online. I have known professors with large classes who look for opportunities to embarrass students who attend class infrequently. I have also known professors who will share certain information with students in attendance that can be very helpful on upcoming exams. Those who don’t bother to come to class lose out. As a parent, I certainly would not want to pay for my child’s education if he had no interest in going to his classes. Skipping classes is a real turn off to most professors. If you need a recommendation down the road, you may be in trouble.</p>
<p>I teach high school lab classes. Attendance is a big deal. But, what about Dr. Paul Farmer, founder of Partners in Health? In the book Mountains Beyond Mountains, Farmer, while an undergrad at Duke and in Harvard med school, would purchase the required books and then spend most of his time in Haiti serving the poor, and then would return back to take tests. Seems unorthodox, and kind of a “skipper”, but he was serving a much higher good. Dr. Farmer is my hero. </p>
<p>I guess it (your attendance) comes down to intent. What are your intentions?</p>
<p>From personal experience, class attendance has absolutely no correlation to grades. For example, I ranked all of my classes last term in terms of how often I attended class, and voila, the marks were ranked in the exact opposite direction. Or even last year, I’ve had classes in which I’ve literally attended 1.5 hours of lectures the whole term (out of 36 hours in total… so that’s 4% of classes) and got a 4.0 in that class. On the other hand, the 3 lowest marks I have right now are the 3 exact courses I attended every class. </p>
<p>You just have to be smart with which classes you skip. Period. </p>
<p>As for prepping for future employment, that’s a totally different thing. You pay for school, but you get paid for work, and I would definitely not be late for work.</p>
<p>Actually, there ARE places in the “real world” which do want workers to show up for later shifts and perhaps OP will thrive in such environments. There are many studies showing that teens and young adults really are NOT naturally early morning people. This is why some folks do SO much better when they are allowed more flexibility in scheduling in college. I know it’s helped both my kids immensely. They’re happiest when their classes start at or after noon, EVERY DAY. Most of the time, they have done this successfully.</p>
<p>Most clearly state on the syllabus what they expect from their students and give you x-amount of days you can miss class otherwise they either penalize you, drop you from the course or give you an F. There are some that don’t care, but many can be strict. </p>
<p>Dr. Farmer and Haitians aside, what is the point of going to Harvard, never attending, learning it all from a book and then taking the test for a class (besides having that Harvard piece of paper upon graduation)? Couldn’t you have done that at any much cheaper university in the land?</p>
<p>I’m sorry inthink it’s a cop out. Many people young people manage to get up early go to work, classes, interviews, go to war, etc without sleeping away half the day. How do all of them defy nature? so if they don’t go to class till noon what do they do all morning? How did generations of humans survive? How do so many college athletes train? What about all those that have to work so theyntake early classes? I think these studies are often excuses. Internships, training programs, seminars, require getting up before noon usually, and while some jobs allow flexibility, it’s not the norm.</p>
<p>ellemenope,
I so recommend the book Mountains Beyond Mountains! From page 108; “Farmer received his Ph.D. and M.D. simultaneously from Harvard. His thesis won a prize…Farmer’s absences from Harvard hadn’t hurt his educational standing. For his graduate work in anthropology, Haiti had been a better site than Boston, obviously.” </p>
<p>His story is inspiring, though most of us (I’m speaking for myself here) don’t have the moxie or intellect to pull off what Farmer did. College students tend to miss class because of self-involvement, Farmer missed class because he was building a hospital and treating the needy in the poorest place on earth. </p>
<p>I don’t miss work or school unless my eyes are bleeding, it’s just me…BUT I’d make an exception for the Dr. Paul Farmers of the world!</p>
<p>"In the real work world showing up at 2pm won’t cut it. Time to learn how to adjust to world then expecting it to to you. "</p>
<p>In the REAL work world, there are plenty of people who don’t play by the rules (Wall Street anyone?) It’s the little worker bees who show up by 8 every morning and do as they’re told until the CEO, who probably hasn’t played by the rules since he was in college, hands the little bee a little pink slip.</p>
<p>Bill Gates/Steve Jobs famously didn’t even finish college, much less skip a class or two that was a waste of their valuable time. It’s the people who bend the rules and use some common sense who rise to the top.</p>
<p>depends on the professor. none of mine this semester care, mostly because they know we’ll fail if we dont attend anyway lol. seems to be the Gen Ed classes that are strict about it (im in engineering).</p>