<p>My D is being recruited by an Amherst coach who says he wants her to go there. When she sends stuff to admissions she is to send an additional copy to coach who will also bring it down to admissions. Apparently her file is “flagged” as an athlete he wants. She could probably get in at Amherst on her grades, SAT’s, and ECs but as we all know the acceptance rate is low and they turn away plenty of qualified applicants every year so she might not too. Just wondered really how much the coach wanting her makes a difference.
Of course it only might help her get in but it won’t help us pay for an Amherst education if she does get in!!</p>
<p>Being an athlete, even a desired one, isn't a slam dunk but it's one of the best hooks an applicant can have. As a percentage of the student body, the number of athletes at Amherst is very high (smallish school, many teams).</p>
<p>Thanks for the info - I know it is certainly not a slam dunk - she is a pretty good applicant anyway so I can certainly hope. We looked at the school almost a year ago and really liked it a lot.</p>
<p>My son is a freshman and also an athlete. I mean, it's hard to really know how it factors into any individual decision since we can't be flies on the wall, but it's certainly a plus. Good luck to your daughter! My son really loves the school.</p>
<p>I believe Amherst reserves about 60 slots for recruited athletes who they believe will be impact players in various sports. In some sports, like cross country, they get enough top runners who are academically qualified without even needing to use slots for recruited athletes. In other sports, like hockey or football, they may need to use more slots to field a competitive team, and they typically need to bend their admission criteria slightly to get the athletes they want. My question is how much of a tip is being an excellent athlete who is non-recruited? My son is captain of two teams in his high school and plays on a high level club team in his sport. He would like to play in Division III but may not start at a place like Amherst. I would imagine that coaches must have a second group of students they are interested in but cannot officially recruit who will make up the remainder of their team. Would be curious how this works at Amherst and other LACs.</p>
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My question is how much of a tip is being an excellent athlete who is non-recruited? My son is captain of two teams in his high school and plays on a high level club team in his sport. He would like to play in Division III but may not start at a place like Amherst.
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<p>This describes my son exactly, but I wouldn't expect him to start as a freshman wherever he might go to school. Amherst's coach told him that they wouldn't slot him because his grades are such that he wouldn't need that, but they would still support his application in admissions. I am not sure what that means and when he might know if they are still going to do that or the extent of their interest. I think at this point it has something to do with DI signing day and they're waiting to see how those dominoes might fall. But since he is our first kid to go through something like this, I really don't know.</p>
<p>I am not sure my D is being "slotted" because she pretty well fits the profile of an Amherst student. I do know that her particular skills fill a niche for that coach so I think that is why he is recruiting her. I think if your child has good grades, scores, and ECs AND is being supported by a coach that is probably the best of both worlds. Good luck to both of your sons. I visited Amherst last Feb with my daughter and it was cold and snowy and we still loved it. I can imagine how beautiful it is there in October - wow! I think she was really impressed by the small class sizes, the opportunity to get a top notch education, and the possibility of competing at the college level. The coach has done a GREAT job of keeping her interest in the school up even though it has been a year since her visit.</p>
<p>It helps a lot.</p>
<p>If a coach isn’t slotting you, I actually doubt that athletic skills matter much at all, except to the small degree that any good extracurricular counts. From what I’ve seen, the vast majority of varsity athletes were recruited or are legacies. There just aren’t many walk-ons. I know several people who were stellar high school athletes but couldn’t find room on a varsity team… they don’t mind too much, though, since they all play frisbee or row crew now!</p>
<p>I was nosing around on the William’s forum (D did not apply there) but there was something on the Williams site about NESCAC schools allowing 66 “tips” (I believe these might be kids that are slightly below the norm for that school) and more (I cannot think of this word) slots for athletes whose GPA, SATs etc… are actually within the norm but are just getting a little extra push from the coach. Can somebody elaborate on this further?</p>
<p>Williams has around 150 recruited athletes in each freshman class. These are athletes that have been evaluated by the coaches and projected by the athletic department to be likely 4-year contributors to a varsity team at Williams.</p>
<p>These 150 break down as follows:</p>
<p>TIPS</p>
<p>66 students with below average academic stats who would have had no chance of acceptance without being designated as a tip. These range from far below average to somewhat below average according to a distribution formula worked out by the school, i.e. so many this far below average, etc.</p>
<p>PROTECTS</p>
<p>30 to 36 students with average academic stats who are admitted based on a push from athletic department. This is a category seldom mentioned when talking about how the number of tips is limited because it is really the same thng, just for kids with somewhat better stats. This is really just ruse for getting around the limit of 66 tips.</p>
<p>OTHER</p>
<p>The remaining 50 or so recruited athletes have above average academic stats and receive zero push from the athletic department, even though they may be told by coaches how much they are wanted and “supported”. The reason is pragmatic. Coaches don’t waste tips and protects on students who might get admitted without athletic help. These recruits come for varsity visits, talk to coaches, and many probably believe that they are getting a boost. The athletic dept puts their names on the list of 4 year contributors, but not on the lists to receive admissions priority from the athletic department.</p>
<p>It’s virtually a certain bet that Amherst has corresponding categories.</p>
<p>Well… based on the above criteria, my son’s grades don’t fall into the above protect or tipped categories as his stats are above the 50% as outlined by the school. Of course, it probably would have been better had he a clearer idea of where he wanted to attend school and apply ED. But it seems a little ridiculous that you end up with a BETTER chance of getting in if your grades are such that the athletic department protects you.</p>
<p>There are lots of things about college admissions that seem ridiculous!</p>
<p>It’s really important for a recruited athlete to understand these categories and to pay very close attention to what the recruiting coaches are saying. Something like “you’d be a big addition to our team, we really want you” doesn’t mean bupkis. “You are my number one impact recruit and I’ve gotten your name on the final tip list”. Now, that means something!</p>
<p>The final tip and protect lists are basically in, unless a felony manslaughter charge turns up at the last minute. At many schools, applying ED is part of the package for tips. Coaches don’t want to waste tips on an athlete that might not enroll.</p>
<p>BTW, all things being equal, I’d probably rather have the academic rating to get accepted without the tip or protect and have athletics be the “plus” factor on my application. Tear an ACL freshman year and you are still at a school where you are a comfortable fit in all regards.</p>
<p>In this day of “crapshoot” admissions even though your stats are amazing, I’d rather have a tip or protect to get into the school of your choice. My D2 stats are right in there but I’m sure that without the tip (or protect - we don’t know which one was used) she would not have been admitted. The odds are stacked against admission to elite colleges and universities even with the “right” stats/ECs/gpa etc.</p>
<p>It would seem logical that being a recruited athlete on the “supported” list would be a plus factor in admissions, given that these colleges turn away many kids who fit in the top 25% stat-wise. I’m assuming the coach actually submits a list of kids he wants to support. Does support work as a sort of tie-breaker, even if not as strong as a protect?</p>
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<p>That’s tough to answer and will probably vary from school to school. The admissions office is aware of the full list of recruits designated as likely varsity contributors by the athletic department. However, the admissions office is also aware that it has, essentially, handed over 60 to 100 slots in the freshman class to the Athletic Director. Some admissions offices are going to feel institutional pressure to enroll even more athletes; others are going to feel institutional pressure to enroll other types of students (future physics PhDs, diversity students, musicians, and so on and so forth). You almost have to consider that question school by school.</p>
<p>An experienced coach will only support a student who s/he expects can thrive academically for four years, and has the athletic skills needed for the team. They aren’t going to waste the few supports they have on someone who won’t be successful.
That said, look at the roster for the past few years. If the coach can support/protect only 3 to 7 students (rough numbers), and there’s 12 freshmen most years, then there’s a few each year who the coach thinks will make it in on their own merit and will are still great assets to the team. So coming in to the application process, the coach has to figure out who is in what category. It’s a card game - you know what hand you played, you know what the coach played to you, and you don’t know who else is playing or what cards they have!
Any contact from the coach during the application process (before the acceptance packages go out) are one more card the coach plays to you. That’s a good thing.
If the coach doesn’t support you but says ‘let me know when you are accepted and I’ll invite you to pre-season’, then it looks like the coach took the risk that you didn’t need support to get in, and s/he still gets you on the team!
Every year and every coach recruiting approach may look a little different, depending on what the team needs and what the coach finds. Even though for some sports there’s an abundance of athletically talents and amazingly smart students, for some sports it’s a real struggle to find athletes who are academically qualified for the more rigorous D3 schools.</p>
<p>There are indications, from time to time, of coaches indicating far more support than that to a recruit who is in actuality not on any protect or tip list. I think it’s best for recruits to be very specific in their questions to coaches. For example, “Coach Lombardi, are you using one of the 66 TIPS on me?”</p>
<p>I guess we’ll know soon enough. D is, according to college board, above the middle 50% with math (780) at the 25% line for CR (670) and somewhere in the middle 50% for W (690). GPA is 4.67 weighted before senior year and just below 4.0 unweighted (has had only one A- in high school no Bs or Cs). SAT IIs are 800 and 710. 6 AP classes (our HS only offers 7) and a 4 and a 5 on the two AP tests she took. All other classes honors since 9th grade and 5 years of honors Spanish. Varsity Captain of FH, BB (X2 years) and track (X2 years), President of NHS and class vice president for 3 years. So is this a “tip” a “protect” or neither? She could get in on her own but, like everyone else qualified that applies to A, only about a 15% (18% I cannot remember) chance. She may actually be a little “underqualified” based on her CR and W scores. Got the impression it was probably a “protect” even though coach has never used that word. He seems to really want her for a special skill she brings to the table and 15% may not be a high enough chance for him so maybe he is protecting her. I think what the athlete brings to the team might be more of a factor in protecting a student or not, because even great students with great stats and ECs get rejected at colleges like A. As I said we’ll see in just about 30 days! If she doesn’t get in then I guess he has indicated far more support than he was actually giving!
Plus we are from MA which probably does not help!</p>
<p>He may be giving her as much support as he can and then some. Admissions has to balance lots of things, including quite a few coaches with quite a few requests… not to mention other class balancing that has to happen. I hope your D gets admitted, and she very well might! … but if not, I wouldn’t lay that at the feet of the coach.</p>