How much will diversity count for my college application?

Student Lounge International Students
1

<p>Hello!</p>

<p>I am very new to this forum and thank you for looking at my post.
So, I'm a female rising Senior from Guinea Bissau (a really small country in West Africa). But my mother is from Burundi (small country in east Africa) I came to the US for the second semester of the 2011-2012 school year, but it was supposed to be my senior year in Senegal (Neighboring Country in West Africa) where I was Studying. So I actually repeated my Junior year when I got to the US because it was advised to me for language purposes (English is not the language in those countries). Now I am making a college list and I was wondering what my chances are of getting into those that interest me:</p>

<p>Reach:
Princeton or Yale (I'll only chose one, i don't know which one yet)
MIT
Northwestern</p>

<p>Others:
Northeastern (#1 right now)
Worcester poly
U of Illinois Urbana-Champaign
(there are some others that are less selective so i'll leave them out)</p>

<p>I want to study Chemical Engineering</p>

<p>Can you chance me taking into account my diversity (there are no people from my country, or from my mother's country in those universities as far as I know) and that I will apply for financial aid?</p>

<p>For the grades in africa, it's different. Students are grouped in classrooms and it's the teachers that walk in and out. we can have multiple 9th grade classes or 10th grade etc but over all:</p>

<p>Freshman year (in Africa): Top of the class</p>

<p>Sophomore year (in Africa): Top of the class</p>

<p>Junior Year (in Africa): Top of all the Junior classes</p>

<p>Junior Class (In the US): GPA: 3.86; 2 AP classes but I only took the exam for one and the results aren't in yet. </p>

<p>SAT (took it only once, will retake): 2050
Reading: 670 ; Maths: 690 ; Writing 640
ACT (only once, will retake): 28
I wasn't prepared at all so when I retake it I'm expecting at least 30.
Will take chemistry, physics, and maths subject tests</p>

<p>My School and Africa didn't focus at all on AP's, Extra-curriculars and activities like sports or experiences (Job, internship, etc) so I mostly started here: </p>

<p>Honors/Awards:
Junior Year (Africa): First Place in National German Contest
Was nominated for National english contest (they only select the best)
Junior Year (US): National french Contest (#1 in Nebraska, #5 in the Nation ; C-class
Senior year (US): I will be in the National Honors Society
A part from that I also for honor certificates from the school in Africa in 9th, 10th and 11th grade for academic performance.</p>

<p>Extra Curriculars :
Piano (8th-9th Grade Africa)
Gymnastics (8th-9th grade Africa)
Dance (HipHop) (9th-11th Grade Africa)
English Club member (8th-11th Grade Africa); Held office: Vice president of external relations in 10th Grade and President of external relations in 11th Grade
JV Basketball (11th grade US)
JV Tennis (11th Grade US)
Prom Decorations Committee (11th Grade US)</p>

<p>Career:
Internship in the International Union for Conversation of Nature of Dakar, Senegal</p>

<p>Volounteering:
In International Union for Conservation of Nature in Guinea Bissau- 40h
a United Nations Program to create a Natural Reserve in Guinea Bissau 30h
in International School of Dakar, Senegal where I work with gifted middleschoolers
Server in a buffet for teachers (10th Africa) 4h
Present Traditional Burundi clothes during an international exposition at church (10grade Africa) 4h
Concessions Stand during matches (11th grade US) 3h
Participation in a gathering in memory of the Rwanda genocide victims, decoration, serve food (10th grade Africa) 4h
Junior Volunteering organized by School (11th grade US): Teaching little girls to swim 2h
English Club assistant: Organizing the 2nd Prom ever in College Sacre-Coeur summer AFTER 11th Grade US)</p>

<p>I have signed up for many interesting classes and activities (mock trial, speech, managing sports teams) for my Senior year and am planning to do more volunteering. </p>

<p>I am on very good terms with my teachers. They know that I am an ambitious, determined and hard working person (though I had never had classes in English I managed to get all A's during my junior year in the US). they have congratulated me a lot and i am sure they will be willing to write me recommendations. </p>

<p>I have lived in 4 different Countries (Guinea Bissau, Portugal, germany and Senegal), have travelled a lot and speak 5 languages fluently (Portuguese,French, English, German and Kriol which is is African) and an other african language so-so. I love languages and am planning to learn Arabic and Japanese.</p>

<p>What do you think? What should I work on before sending an Application? What do my chances look like? Will it count against me that I repeated Junior year? </p>

<p>Thank you so much for your time.</p>

2

<p>Do you qualify for federal financial aid? (Are you a US citizen, permanent resident, refugee, …?) </p>

<p>If not, you might have to re-think your college list. Northeastern and Urbana Champaign are not likely to offer you much aid, for instance. The average financial aid award for international students at Northeastern is $14,000. (Leaving you upwards of $40,000 to pay on your own.) At Urbana Champaign you would qualify for privately-endowed departmental scholarships.</p>

3

<p>Yes, I did see that and I am actually looking at the scholarship list. My parents said that if I was accepted we might try and work something out since it’s a pretty good school but it depends on what other school’s responses are. That will definitely affect my list. Some of the less selective schools I have offer better financial aid so i might change my preference according to that (U of Iowa or kentucky; NJIT). </p>

<p>I do not have much experience with that so I’m very open to suggestions and advice please. </p>

<p>I am an International Student, so I am not permanent resident, refugee or citizen even though I have some family that have citizenship. But since I heard that many of those colleges liked diversity and that there are no people from my country in those Universities I was hoping that that could really help my chances. Also I’ve been in many places etc. What do you think?</p>

<p>Thank you for your reply :)</p>

4

<p>Being an international financial aid applicant will be a huge disadvantage. Your background might give you a slight advantage within that group, but as long as you need financial aid, you are worse off than any of your American classmates. Also, not to be mean, but your current test scores are below average in the competitive international financial aid pool. You want to score above the 75th percentile for the universities that you are applying to.</p>

<p>I recommend that you have an open conversation about college cost with your family sooner rather than later. How much money, specifically, do you have to work with? That information is crucial for you to assemble a reasonable college list.</p>

<p>For example, the highest scholarship for international students at the University of Iowa is valued at $13,000/year. The estimated cost of attendance is almost $40,000/year. If you don’t have at least an extra $25,000/year from other sources (e.g. your family or home government), it wouldn’t even make sense to apply because you wouldn’t be able to attend even in the best case scenario. And right now you don’t even meet the minimum requirements for that scholarship yet.</p>

5

<p>How would you feel about college in Europe, by the way? You said that you are fluent in French and German. Public universities in Germany are almost free (you might pay an administrative fee of $200/semester) and the same is true for many French universities. Except for the grandes ecoles, the most prestigious of the French universities, which charge tuition fees similar to public universities in the US.</p>

<p>If you want to keep the option of studying chemical engineering in Europe, be sure to take AP Calc, AP Physics and AP Chemistry before you graduate. Classes at this level are standard high school classes in Europe and the university curriculum will assume that you are comfortable with all three.</p>

6

<p>Yes I see. I’ll talk to my parents to see what they think about the Europe option, but aren’t the US better when it comes to job opportunities? </p>

<p>Do you know of any college where I would have better chances? It’s just so difficult finding one that offers chemical engineering AND help for international students. If you know one i’ll be glad to consider it. </p>

<p>I’m retaking the tests in september and am expecting better results. I was pretty badly prepared regarding the timing of each section xD</p>

<p>Right now they said that they could pay around 15,000/year</p>

7

<p>

That might be true. I think spending a few years in Europe has advantages, both academically and financially, but I wouldn’t recommend that you stay in Europe afterwards. </p>

<p>Consider the following option: Go to Europe, get a Bachelor’s degree in 3 years, and then enroll in an American PhD program. PhD programs have the advantage that they are fully funded: PhD students normally get a full tuition waiver, free health insurance and a stipend for living expenses. (I am getting $30,000/year.) And most PhD programs give you the option to drop out with a Master’s degree after 2 years if you don’t actually care about the research phase of the degree. </p>

<p>This path would get you a cheap undergraduate education, and a fully-funded graduate degree from an American university. You’d be in a good position to apply for jobs in the US with an American graduate degree, regardless of where your undergraduate degree is from.</p>

<p>

I know. I think that’s because universities with an engineering program attract enough full-paying international students that they don’t feel the need to offer discounts. (Heck, some universities have gone on record calling international students “cash cows” for their institution.) The most financial aid for international students is available at colleges with few “employable” majors: liberal arts colleges. Relative to their size, the selective liberal arts colleges give even more financial aid to international students than Harvard or MIT!!!</p>

<p>Here’s another question for you. I don’t know very much about chemical engineering, but I always thought of it as a specialty that practically requires graduate training. It seems that you’d need a graduate-level background in physics and chemistry before you could even start talking about high-tech chemical engineering methods.</p>

<p>If you are likely to need a graduate degree anyway, you could also attend an American college with no chemical engineering program (but strong majors in physics and chemistry). A strong science background with some practical lab experience should put you into a good position to apply to graduate programs as well.</p>

<p>I am not suggesting that you pursue this avenue exclusively, but it might be worth to apply to a few extra universities with no chemical engineering programs but plenty of financial aid opportunities as back-up. </p>

<p>To get you started, most of the top 50 liberal arts colleges (in the US News ranking) offer generous need-based aid to international students. Some of them even have cross-registration programs with nearby research universities that would allow you to take classes there. Wellesley students can take classes at MIT, Bryn Mawr students at the University of Pennsylvania, and Smith students at the University of Massachusetts at Amhest, for example.</p>

<p>I was a math major at Bryn Mawr myself. I went through the core undergraduate curriculum in my first two years, took 8 graduate courses at Penn in my junior and senior years, and now I’m a graduate student at Stanford. :slight_smile: I stayed in math, but I also had friends at Bryn Mawr who went to graduate school for bioengineering (at Cambridge), robotics (at the University of Pennsylvania), civil engineering (at UC Berkeley) and aerospace engineering (forgot where…). Another Bryn Mawr graduate is now researching superconductors at MIT. </p>

<p>Long story short: you can go to graduate school in engineering with a science degree from a liberal arts college. And pretty good graduate programs too!</p>

8

<p>Really? It would be perfect if that was possible! Are you still in contact with the one who did bioengineering? Do you think you could ask him a few questions (or put me in contact with him)?</p>

9

<p>I haven’t talked to her in a while, but I’ll see if I can dig up her current email address. I’ll PM you later.</p>

10

<p>Thank you ! :)</p>

11

<p>

</p>

<p>An admissions officer at CMU told us, they expect 750 or above in math II and an equivalent SAT Reasoning math score to be competitive. I mention this because my son had the same SAT reasoning math and PSAT math score as you, 690 in junior year. He will be retaking the SAT in Oct to score higher in math. I would think the other top schools will expect the same. Good luck.</p>

12

<p>Thank you @perazziman !!</p>

13

<p>Okay, I think you need to do some reality checks. I’m going to be completely honest and give you my opinion on your postings. Use this for your information to plan how you’ll approach your next steps:</p>

<p>First of all you’re asking for financial aid, as an international student, which at this time is extremely difficult and unpopular since the schools are tightening their budgets and don’t have lots of aid money.</p>

<p>Your stats, as previously indicated by another poster here, are currently not considered top-notch or good enough to get you into some of these schools. Even state schools are becoming extremely competitive and difficult to gain admittance. Your culture may be unique, but they have to look at your scores first.</p>

<p>You’re assuming that just getting into a school and graduating will automatically give you a permanent residency immigration status to work here. Once you graduate, your visa is up! Immigration is a big issue here with work visas. A company would have to be willing to sponsor your work visa, versus hiring another person who wouldn’t need one. </p>

<p>We’re in a bad economy, there aren’t jobs easily available for chemical engineers or many other occupations especially if the company funding requires American citizenship. My brother-in-law, a US citizen, has a Ph.D from Georgia Tech in Chemical Engineering and had an extremely tough time finding a job in the East. He was considered over-qualified for many positions. Chemical engineers are expensive on a payroll. He’s had to jump from state to state-California-Oklahoma, Georgia, Alabama, and Massachusetts looking for work </p>

<p>Think about why you think you have to get your education in the US. Make a list of pros and cons. Immigration shouldn’t be your top priority, education should be.</p>

14

<p>HI there ! i was kind of hoping you would help me i don’t seem to understand exactly how this works.
I’m studying at an engineering school (industrial engineering) in morocco and was hoping to go study at Georgia Tech or the university of michigan after my diploma to get a master degree.
so i was hoping you would tell me how to do it? do i just sign in there ? and what tests should i take ? what scores should i get ?
and does my country have to have a convention with these schools so that i can be able to aply there ?
and could you please tell me how do we pay for tuition fees (all at once or monthly…)
thank you so much for your help and time. any information could be helpful.</p>