<p>Selecting schools that are strong in a particular major:</p>
<p>Gourman Report undergrad rankings
Rugg’s Recommendations on the Colleges
NRC rankings for graduate programs
US News Best Colleges undergrad rankings for engineering and business
US News Best Graduate Schools
Baccalaureate Origins study
use IPEDS website to find schools with large programs in your major</p>
<p>To get a list of schools with your major that are a good fit.</p>
<p>This is complicated. Not for everybody.</p>
<p>Go to:</p>
<p><a href=“http://nces.ed.gov/ipeds/[/url]”>http://nces.ed.gov/ipeds/</a></p>
<p>under “Evaluate Statistics and Data”, “Tools”
click “Peer Analysis System”
click “Go To The Peer Analysis System”
click “Guest Level”
click “I Agree to the Terms Above” (if you do)
under “Institution Name”, type the full name of a school you know you’d like to go to
if it comes back with a list, click the school you intended to choose as your starting point
click “select”
click “Comparison Group”
click “add institutions by variable”</p>
<p>click the little box with a plus sign inside the box in front of “Institutional Characteristics/Admissions/Student Charges”</p>
<p>click the little box with a plus sign inside the box in front of “Admissions and Test Scores”</p>
<p>click “SAT and ACT test scores”</p>
<p>if you have SAT scores, click the empty boxes next to “SAT critical reading 25th percentile”, “SAT reading 75th percentile”, “SAT math 25th percentile”, “SAT math 75th percentile”</p>
<p>(if you want to use ACT scores, follow the same procedure for ACTs)</p>
<p>click the little box with a plus sign inside the box in front of “Institutional Characteristics”</p>
<p>click the little box with a plus sign inside the box in front of “Directory Information”</p>
<p>click “Carnegie Classification 2005: Basic”. By the way, LACs are referred to as “baccalaureate colleges” under the Carnegie classification.</p>
<p>if you want to limit to a certain geographic region(s), click “Geographic Region”
if you want to limit to certain state(s), click “State Abbreviation”
if you want to limit by urban/suburban/rural, click “Degree of Urbanization”
if you want to limit by public/private, click “Control of Institution”</p>
<p>if you want to limit by cost, go to a different section under “Institutional Characteristics” called ”Student Charges-Institutions reporting by academic year” , click “Frequently used price variables”, check the empty boxes in front of “Total price for in-state” and “Total price for out-of-state” (you should probably select the on-campus options if you are a freshman) IMPORTANT: You won’t really know the net cost until after you get your financial aid offer.</p>
<p>If you want to limit by size, click the box in front of the broad category “Frequently used/derived variables”. Click the empty box in front of “Institutional size category” at the bottom of the list.</p>
<p>If you want to limit to schools with a particular major, click the little box with a plus sign in it in front of the broad category “Completions”. Click the little box with a plus sign in it in front of the first option in the list “Awards/ degrees conferred by program”. At the top, click qualifying variable “First or second major”. Select “first major”. Click “save and close”. Wait a few seconds. Then click Qualifying Variable “CIP code classification”. A list of broad majors will appear. You can select a broad major or “expand” the category to get more specific majors. For example, Classics-Greek is under “Foreign languages”, then under “Classics”, then “Classics-Greek”. Make your selections, then click “save and close”. Wait a few seconds. Click Qualifying variable “Award level code”. Check “Bachelors Degree”. Click “save and close”. Wait a few seconds. Finally, check the box in front of “Grand total”.</p>
<p>Click “Continue” at the top. Several sections will appear, one for each type of information you are using, each with several years. Check the boxes for the most recent year under each type of data. Then click “Continue”.</p>
<p>Click the button “Go to the query form”. </p>
<p>Some of the variables have windows where you can highlight your selections. If you want to highlight more than one option within a window, hold down the “control” key on your keyboard. If you want to include all schools for a particular variable (you decide not to limit based on that variable), highlight “All Values”.</p>
<p>For the quantitative variable “Grand total” in each major you selected, fill in the box with the expression >1 which means “greater than 1”. This will select schools that had at least one graduate in that major. If you want to select schools with larger programs, increase the number to say >20.</p>
<p>Then find schools in your SAT range. For example, say you got 600 on both SAT subtests. For the SAT 25th percentile boxes, calculate the Critical Reading or Critical Math score that is 120 points BELOW your score (example 480) and type the expression in the box >480 (or whatever score is 120 points below yours). For the SAT 75th percentile boxes, find the scores for Critical Reading and Math that are 120 points ABOVE your scores (example 720) and type the expression <720 (or whatever score is 120 points above yours). Note that the sign for the 75th percentile boxes is a “less than” sign < and the sign for the 25th percentile boxes is a “greater than” sign >.</p>
<p>For the Total Price boxes, type in < whatever amount you are willing to pay in-state or out-of-state.</p>
<p>Click “submit”. You should get a list of schools.</p>
<p>If the list is too short, broaden your selection criteria. Hit the “back” button on your browser, re-do your selections, and re-submit. You can tweak it over and over. But, when your new list comes up, under “Do you want to:”, you should select “Disregard the previous set and keep this one”.</p>
<p>Sometimes schools will come up on your list that don’t belong on your list. It is not error-free. You have to follow up to verify the schools on your list. Sometimes, good schools are filtered out. But, this is a good way to get an initial list.</p>
<p>If you have problems, you will have to de-bug your process. I hope these instructions are accurate and sufficient to get you started. It works for me.</p>
<p>Also, regarding financial safeties, if there is anything unusual in your situation which would make you fall into a “professional judgment” review regarding FA, definitely apply to a larger number of schools. Don’t assume all schools will treat the situation the same. Don’t assume a school which overall has a better reputation for FA will be more generous than another.</p>
<p>collegehelp, thanks for posting the IPEDS instructions. We worked with that site too, and while navigating it takes some work, it is very valuable.</p>
<p>I find it surprising that students apply to schools where their scores would fall in the lowest quartile. I tend to categorize those schools as somewhere beyond a super-reach unless there are extraordinarily compelling elements elsewhere in a student’s application–some kind of exceptional accomplishment or a special applicaction status such as athlete, legacy, URM etc.</p>
<p>I’ve always subscribed to the theory that if your scores are in the middle of the 25-75 range at a selective school, it’s a reach; if your scores are in the top quartile it’s a match/target. Maybe I’m just overly conservative. And of course the super selective schools are sort of like lottery tickets where superior grades and scores are just the cost of getting a ticket in the bucket!</p>
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<p>That’s an interesting definition. </p>
<p>You go on to say, </p>
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</p>
<p>Yep. I don’t think for any of the top six or seven most selective colleges there are any guarantees for anyone.</p>
<p>I find it simply sad that in a “How to Build a College Application List” thread, a student’s proverbial ‘dream school’ is given such little weight! Goodness, it’s not all about scores. </p>
<p>There’s nothing wrong with going all-out on one, two, even three schools that have been someone’s childhood dream schools even if they’re reaches. Of course, I’m not saying someone with a 1200 SAT/2.5 GPA should rely on Harvard, but I’m sure (read: I hope) everyone understands the gist of this. </p>
<p>After all, you never know… :)</p>
<p>It’s just that I think that at the very selective schools, scores and grades in the mid-range are just what it takes to even get your application looked at. </p>
<p>Everyone has access to guidebooks, etc., that publish the ranges for each school. I don’t think too many people with stats way below the school’s published numbers apply–for example, kids with a 3.3 and scores in the the 500s generally don’t apply to Emory. So I assume that most of the applicant pool (not all) has the numbers to be a realistic applicant. Applications far below the general statistical profile can be easily rejected without there being some special circumstance, but since there aren’t going to be all that many, I don’t think those rejections really boost other applicant’s chances by much.</p>
<p>So my reasoning is that if a student is in the middle of a very selective school’s applicant pool, there is basically a 1-in-3 chance for an average applicant to get in. Which, to me, makes a school a reach in reality, even if a student’s stats are within the mid-range published for the school. I don’t mean a ridiculous, pie in the sky reach, but a realistic reach where the applicant has to realize that while very qualified, there is a good chance that he or she might not get in.</p>
<p>Some young people haven’t focused particularly on one “dream” college. (I did when I was a kid, but then never applied there. My son has no one college that is his “dream” college, although he does like some particular reachy colleges to which he will surely apply.) I certainly wouldn’t tell a young person NOT to apply to a “dream” college, but I’d tell the same young person to try to find colleges with similar desirable characteristics and apply to those too.</p>
<p>boysx3, don’t forget that the published stats are not that of the applicant pool. Usually, they are those of enrolled students. For some very selective schools–think Carleton, for example–that may well mean that the stats of <em>accepted</em> students would skew higher, since acceptees with higher stats may be more likely to be accepted at and choose to attend a school higher on the food chain. (Of course, this is also where that tendency for schools to wait list highly qualified students as a means of yield management comes in…)</p>
<p>when my s applied to school this year he applied to 7 schools. 2 reaches 5 very good matches and 2 very real safety schools. each and every school that he applied to were schools that he would have loved to go to . they all met his criteria and by the way ours as well. The notion that these kids are applying to 15 + schools is crazy no wonder there is a thread about schools wanting applicants to show “the love”. in reference to a “dream” school , if you really think about what you want and treat safeties with the same consideration as a reach school many more dreams would come true!</p>
<p>from DuckPond:</p>
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</p>
<p>from TokenAdult:</p>
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</p>
<p>I am far less sanguine than TokenAdult about this issue. It may well be that the vast majority of enrollees at super-selective universities manage to graduate, but at what cost?</p>
<p>Do the ‘marginal’ admits, however defined, have time to participate in out-of-class activities, clubs, organizations? Do they have the opportunity to really develop the broader skills that lead to personal and professional success if every day is a struggle just to perform in class?</p>
<p>Do they end up majoring in their preferred field? How many kids who love computers and computer science end up forced to switch majors to something a bit more ‘doable’ because the competition and the expectations at their extreme reach school leaves them at the rear of the pack in their preferred field?</p>
<p>collegehelp referred to the advantages of being a small fish in a large pond. Let us not forget what the role of the small fish in the large pond is: they are food for the big fish.</p>
<p>When it comes to figuring out what college is your dream college, remember that over-used but useful aphorism: Be careful what you wish for, because you just might get it.</p>
<p>This is all very well and good, interested1. What would you consider a very good match for a kid with these stats: 2310 SATs, 3 SATIIs all from 730-780, 8 APs (all 5s on tests taken so far), maximum and most rigorous courseload (including the big three AP sciences, AP Calc, and APs in two languages), state and national awards in two languages for 4 years, an unweighted GPA of about 95 (school doesn’t weight or rank, but definitely top 10%), 3-season varsity athlete all 4 years, plays instrument in regional youth symphony and at other selective venues, CTY 4 years, NHS, NMSF, Presidential Scholar nominee, great recs, wants a highly intellectual atmosphere in the humanities? Oh, and a very low EFC. Doesn’t want the South, or a very large school. Doesn’t live in a state with a well-known flagship.</p>
<p>How many schools should this kid apply to, and which ones?</p>
<p>Why is it ok to be in the bottom 25% at a school?</p>
<p>Because almost all of them come back for their second year and eventually graduate at top 50 schools. Top 50 schools have about 92% to 98% freshmen retention and over 90% graduation. I would bet that less than 50% of the attrition is from the bottom 25%.</p>
<p>collegehelp, the numbers are there for all to see. Yes, high graduation rates, good retention.</p>
<p>If graduating from a name school is your one and only goal, go for it.</p>
<p>If you want to make a name for yourself, get the attention of the professors who will be writing your recommendations, get first crack at research opportunities, graduate near the top of the class, make it in your chosen major–rather than an easier one–and still have time to be an active participant and/or a leader in campus organizations and even have time to just hang out and have a nice life, then maybe you want to make sure you are at a school that fits you well.</p>
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<p>What colleges do you have in mind?</p>
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<p>That’s a good question. Does such a student have a “match”?</p>
<p>^^^Exactly the problem, tokenadult. There certainly are many schools for which a kid with these kind of stats would be a “match,” if being in the top 25-35% of stats makes you a “match”–except for the problem that almost all of them have acceptance rates in the twenty-something percent range or lower, with a few around 30%. with those odds, the idea that one can pick two or three “matches” a couple safeties, and a couple reaches ceases to be so simple.</p>
<p>The reaches are easy: they are the schools that are reaches for everyone. The safeties and matches are the problem. Is a match a match if the odds are that low? How about the safeties? If the kid is solidly in the top 25%, but the school only accepts 32%, is it “safe”? What about “Tufts syndrome”? And what about going lower in the selectivity ranks? Conventional wisdom has it that many such kids will be waitlisted or rejected from such schools on the assumption that they would prefer to go elsewhere.</p>
<p>In the case of the
</p>
<p>It would be all about fit.</p>
<p>^^ I think that recognition of “fit” is highly overrated in this scenario. So the kid decides that 5 highly selective schools are more to his/her taste than this other 5. You’re still dealing with very poor odds.</p>
<p>consolation just about any school below the ivys is a good match. and all the ivys should want to take you good luck</p>