Aside from the fact that this scenario seems pretty farfetched, I certainly don’t think it’s bad information for future classes to have that scores aren’t everything. Knowing that Stanford accepted the legacy and sports star with low scores and none of the high scorers was useful information. (And yes I do know who those students were since in 6 years Stanford has only accepted two kids from our school - while Harvard has accepted at least a dozen.)</p>
<p>While I agree that school shouldn’t be fining kids, what would happen if they refused to send your transcript out unless you divulged the information? It just seems to me this is a two way street - schools go to considerable trouble to help kids get into colleges from writing letters of recommendations, sending out mid-year and final reports. Surely the least the students can do is tell them the results of all the work the school has done on their behalf.</p>
<p>SoozieVT…I don’t think that anyone is questioning that there is a value. The question is can the release of personal information be mandated. I do think you are missing the point.</p>
<p>I so much agree with you, mathmom. I think students owe this information to their guidance counselors. The GC did things to enable the process for the student and surely has a vested interest in the outcome and knowing it. I can’t imagine telling my kids not to let their GC know the results. Even on a personal level…forget about the reasons already listed as to what the school uses such information for.</p>
<p>To me, if this is a public school, the issue of imposing a “fine” raises a red flag.</p>
<p>Services at public schools are supposed to be free to students, so you need some sort of authorization to be imposing fines. Obviously a fine for lost or damaged property (such as failing to return a text book) makes sense – but I don’t know where a public school would derive the legal authority to fine a student for failing to provide personal information. </p>
<p>Since the OP didn’t identify the state or district, then maybe there is some sort of law that governs. But I don’t know of one.</p>
<p>Which is why I suggested that the OP write a letter to the school district and ASK. If the school district has legal authority for such a requirement, they ought to be able to cite it.</p>
<p>Does your school also announce who the bottom 10 students are and say what the future plans of the bottom 10 students are? Probably not.</p>
<p>The OP situation is the school wants information on where ALL students are going, not just those going to elite colleges. Some students may not wish the GC to know that they are attending the local community college for financial reasons even because they expressed interest in going to Stanford when at school.</p>
<p>solodad, I cross posted with you and was responding to mathmom. </p>
<p>However, aI have not missed the point. I have already stated that it should not be mandated and that no consequences should ensue if the student doesn’t comply. I have not seen anyone here agree with the fines or consequences, myself included. </p>
<p>But since some people are saying they don’t think they should give the school such information, some of us are providing viewpoints on the notion itself of supplying such information to one’s HS.</p>
<p>Nobody here, myself included, is talking about public announcements about where each kid is going to college. We are talking about a compilation of all acceptances for the school profile (that is not by name of student). As well, some schools have naviance or use similar information when providing guidance, and that also is not announcing college results per students’ names.</p>
<p>As an aside…the top ten kids at our high school often are NOT attending “elite” schools, just to respond to that point.</p>
<p>My point about the graduation announcements for the top ten kids was that nobody gave the school permission to disclose where they were going to college. But I have never heard a complaint about it either.</p>
<p>You may be basing that on your school, but the OP likely doesn’t go to that school.</p>
<p>At my school, GCs did absolutely nothing to help me into getting into college except they provided a repository of scholarship applications. So not all GCs have a vested interest and not all GCs do things to help every student get into college.</p>
<p>Well, that is an interesting and unusual example that someone who got into Stanford ended up choosing community college. But in any case, I know lots of kids who chose a less selective school due to financial reasons and I don’t see them keeping a secret where they are going to college. Many would simply tell their GC…“I got a better FA package or I got a scholarship to X and so I am picking it over Y even though Y is more selective and I was interested in it if I could have attended, but I can’t.”</p>
<p>No, I didn’t say they got into Stanford. I’m saying that, in front of all of the other students, they said they wanted to go to Stanford. But inside, they really knew they were going to go to a community college or not go to college at all. </p>
<p>I know of tons of students like this, and not all of these students want to tell the GC that they really never applied to Stanford or they only got accepted at a community college.</p>
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<p>And I know kids that were embarassed all they could afford was community college and didn’t want to tell people that. We’re not talking about the loudmouth students here. We’re talking about the introverted, shy, and perhaps embarrased students who don’t really want to go around advertising where they are not going to school.</p>
<p>I never said the GC at our HS helped with the admissions process. But at a min. he did write a rec and send in required infomation and package up the teacher recs to send out in one package. Was he being paid to do it? Of course. This is his job. But I do believe that given that the person did something to assist the student in the process, even if he/she was required to do so, should elicit the student letting the GC know the outcome. I don’t view our GC as a servant. Even if he did not help that much, he still did something for the student (just like the teacher rec writers) and deserves a “thank you, here is how it turned out for me.”</p>
<p>Bigtrees, the GC would know the kid applied or not to Stanford as the GC has to send a school counselor report and transcript. At a lot of high schools, the GC doesn’t send that stuff unless the kid has actually applied.</p>
<p>Bigtrees, what do you call the counselor report the counselor writes on behalf of a student? That is not helping the student? Yes, it is their job to do so, just like a teacher’s job is to teach. But it is still something to thank them for and provide the outcome. You might not call that “help” but I do.</p>
<p>Um, most state colleges in the west do not require a counseler report, and probably few community colleges anywhere require a counseler report. You’re operating under the assumption that the GC does a counseler report for every student that applies to college. I don’t think that’s the case for the OP.</p>
<p>In my case, I did not need a counseler report to go to my state college. No recommendations were required to apply.</p>
<p>But the policy is being applied to all students at the high school. Certainly there are some students who did not use GC services in getting to college. And those have no ethical obligation to repay the assistance since none was given.</p>
<p>Even if they are obligated to repay, a simple thank you note would be sufficient. There’s no ethical obligation to repay someone by providing personal information that you’re uncomfortable providing, unless the person said upfront that his help was conditional based on receiving that information afterwards.</p>
<p>As an example, I took a professional examination for my field a couple years ago (like bar exam, engineering exam, medical doctor comprehensive exam). I had a couple people sign recs for me in order to take the exam. I’m ethically obligated to thank them for their services. But I’m not obligated to tell them my score after I take the exam, or even whether I passed or not. I happened to pass, so I let them know. But had I not, I didn’t need to let the world know that I failed.</p>
<p>All the more reason to leave a small town. People actually sit there and memorize or remember what other people’s kids had on test scores, so that a year later they’ll realize that the green dot on the Naviance must have been Emily with the 1900? Blech. Leave those people far, far behind.</p>
<p>I think when you tell your GC in confidence your admissions results, they are not telling the world. The information will be used anonymously, such as on a School Profile. </p>
<p>It is true that one is not obligated to let GCs or rec writers know their admissions outcome. But I happen to think it is the right thing to do and it also helps the school have an accurate school profile, as well as helps counselors be on top of how kids are faring from the school in order to help other kids. Nobody can make you do this. I’m just saying I can’t see NOT doing it.</p>