I can get my stepson into my top 15 alma mater, he and wife say no

Parent Cafe
41

Depending on your son’s ambitions, you might gently point out to your wife and him that he might actually find the T15 school to be much less competitive - and dare I say, “easier” - than the state flagship. Particularly if he (or she) has any ambitions for him to be towards the “top” of the college class. State universities can be brutally competitive because admission alone is not so strong a signal to employers and graduate programs that the student is in fact elite.

I’ll say that based on personal experience, the more elite a college the less academic pressure there seems to be, and the more interested the college is in having all its students look like superstars (what is the percentage of kids who graduate with “honors” again at Harvard?).

42

@twoinanddone - I agree with your point that fit is important and individual.

I just want to challenge the comment in your example that Williams “does not have much diversity.” 42% of domestic students are persons of color. 8% of students are international, from all over the world. 20% have Pell grants. 17% are first generation. Half receive financial aid, and the aid is generous (need blind, 100% need- met school), and 17% of students pay nothing at all to attend. Subjectively, it certainly seems diverse, as so far my kid is interacting daily with kids of all different races, nationalities, backgrounds, etc.

43

I went to one of those top LACs. I received an excellent education from the school, but didn’t like the size. When time came for D1 to apply, she also thought the school was too small, but did apply and was accepted. If she didn’t get into other large private Us, she would have gone to my alma mater. I am weary of public schools because they are always beholden to the state budget, even at a top school like Berkeley.

I don’t blame OP for wanting to get his stepson into his alma mater with more resource and stronger alumni network. At the same time, I would make sure the stepson can handle the academic rigor of his alma mater. It may have opposite effect if the stepson should do poorly at the LAC.
As others have suggested, I would have the stepson visit the LAC, speak with adcom and alum from the school and have him apply to the LAC. May is a long time from now. The only thing is if OP thinks the only way he could get the stepson into the LAC is by applying ED then a decision would need to be made very quickly.

I had very strong influence over my kids’ college application process, but I wouldn’t force my kids go to any school they do not want to go. I would have had this discussion sophomore/junior years.

44

I was not joking with my comment about counseling. Things can be hard to negotiate when a step parent is involved. The attitudes in the OP do seem to be demeaning, and present the wife and son as sort of a unit pitted against the seemingly wiser, more worldly step dad. I really do think there are deeper issues that need to be addressed, mainly issues of power and control but also mutual respect, the role of the step parent in the family and so on.

45

I concur with everyone who has asked the OP to question his assumptions and aims in this process.
The OPs attitude comes across as arrogant, condescending and controlling to me. It may put the stepson off further off the college that turned him out.
OP, presumably you once cared about your wife’s opninions enough to want to marry her, and are generous enough to provide for your stepsons education. Don’t use this for control.

46

@MYOS1634

Around here, one can request an additional day off of school for college visits. But one additional day to visit four schools might not work…we don’t even know the geographic locations of a couple of these colleges.

Also, if they want to get an official tour on that Columbus Day weekend or days near it…get scheduling now…because those days fill up quickly.

47

Why does any of this matter? None of it makes you more qualified to decide what type of college is the best fit for him. Your elite education seems to have failed you in several key ways. Perhaps that’s what your wife and son are trying to avoid.

Pushing your Alma mater doesn’t seem to be working, and if your wife and son sense your low opinion of them it’s no wonder they aren’t eager to talk with you. You may want to adjust your attitude to see if that helps you have some real conversations.

I suggest you quit talking and start listening. Take him to visit several types of schools and listen to what he likes and dislikes. Encourage him to apply to a variety of places. Ask (don’t tell) him to send an app to your Alma mater just to see what happens, but make it clear you won’t force him to attend. When he gets all his acceptances he can compare majors and opportunities.

48

Recognizing that we don’t have a full view of the OP’s situation, I have few thoughts to offer. They may not apply to the OP but might be useful to someone else in a similar situation.

At many schools like the OP describes legacies only really have juice if they apply ED. If the OP is extremely well known to the public or is on a first name basis with the school’s VP for Development the stepson may be able to apply RD. Otherwise the boat may have sailed before Jan 1.

It tends to take less $$ to become a development admit at a top LAC than a top private university but those LACs expect students to show interest. They certainly don’t want to be anyone’s fallback plan. A LAC would typically expect such a kid to interview on campus unless they live so far away that a trip to the school would be very difficult.

Like @Thumper, I have seen many great legacy kids turned down by their parents’ schools. A classmate who had been a consistent donor and volunteer dropped off our 25 reunion committee after her daughter was denied ED. The daughter was accepted RD to the school’s rival, a school with a slightly lower acceptance rate. These were both NESCAC schools.

It’s possible the stepson knows more about these school than his stepdad thinks. Sometimes kids play the college stuff pretty close to the vest. The SS may not feel he can win in a debate with stepdad or may not want SD to feel like he’s putting his beloved college down.

Sometimes kids feel an intangible about a college that’s hard for them to put into words. Perhaps the SS feels he won’t find his tribe in a socially savvy environment and senses from what he’s seen and heard that that’s what he’d encounter at the OP’s alma mater.

Some large public U’s have priority enrollment, meaning if the SS applies and/or enrolls early he’ll have a better choice of housing or class schedule. If this is the case at the school SS wants to attend it would argue for letting him apply early. Unfortunately if he gets into his choice early it may destroy any incentive he could have to apply to the OP’s school.

I would advise the OP to ask the son to tour his school but to be prepared for a sullen kid who walks on campus and immediately declares he hates it. If that’s the case the best thing to do will be to accept the SS’s decision and support it. It’s his life. On the flip side the OP should agree to tour the SS’s choice of schools. Who knows? Either SS or SD may surprise themselves and change their mind.

A final note:

@stepdad2022, your school may be a better fit than the local RU but if it’s not are you prepared for your stepson to blame you? Scratch that. If your stepson is unhappy for any reason, whether it has to do with the school he attends or not, are you ready for him, and perhaps your wife, to blame you? If he feels boxed into attending your alma mater he may always feel like it was your decision, not his. Please recognize that successful people come out of all sorts of schools. We tend to overvalue what we know and love and undervalue what we don’t.

49

Both schools sound very good. An R1 university vs another good school.

I would very much encourage both mom and son to visit the OP’s school just for the experience.
I’d just push the “keep your options open” angle. What is the possible harm?

If neither wife nor son do the research then you do it for them. Get the brochures, etc. for both schools (and any others on the list). Be proactive in this regard.
(The only thing that seems off to me is comparing a large university vs very small LAC graduation rate)

BUT the OP should also consider that size of school, proximity to home, and having instant friend group at an university are all very valid reasons to want to attend the public and may trump everything else.
And the OP’s school may be preppier these days than he realizes. :slight_smile:
Even very large universities have alum networks that are extremely active where good connections are made…

50

@stepdad2022 if only I had had this opportunity. I went with friend to UF with 36k ugrad and would have thrived at a better, smaller school. I’d show them data - class size, post graduation income, opportunities such as professor relationships that are easier in a smaller, private school. I’d take private any day over large public.

OTOH, if he doesn’t have the natural talent to succeed, he won’t be happy so make sure he is a match at your alma mater. Would you feel good about supporting him with a compromise? I Tier 2 school that is a fit for him, but still private?

51

My alma mater is not a SLAC, I’m not sure what gave anyone that idea. It’s top 15 on US News. And I used 15 so as to not tease out who I am or bring in biases about the college. That does not necessarily mean it’s in the 10 to 15 range. Maybe it is, maybe it isn’t.

@Sue22

If he fails out of the huge public university or takes a year or two extra to finish will I get to blame him and his mother for an ignorant, ill-informed decision? I wouldn’t. And the thing is, maybe he graduates from the R1, maybe he has a nice modest career. I still think it’s an awful idea, with unnecessary risks, and throwing away all the upside of my alma mater. A once in a lifetime opportunity.

52

I’m not talking to two adults (he’ll be 18 shortly) who have exposure, experience, or a knowledge base. It is in fact wholly over their head. If they could share mere pros and cons of both universities I wouldn’t have this level of frustration. They know very little about the big public university and nothing about my top 15 US News (outside of maybe the school colors). For example, if the young man told me he wanted to be an engineer (he doesn’t), and could tell me X Y Z about the flagship’s top engineering dept., I’d fully respect the decision. That is not the case. This is blind leading the blind with no grasp of the opportunities on the table.

53

It is also possible that he goes to the t15 school, hates it and doesn’t end up availing himself of any of the fabulous opportunities you want for him. My guess is that if you looked up the alumni from the R1 school, you will find a large number of very successful, even prominant graduates. I bet there are also failures from the T15 — people who couldn’t hack it, people who managed a degree but could never really find a life path, people who “broke” under the pressure. I bet you know people who graduated from your alma matar and went nowhere in life. I bet you also know lots of people who are perfectly happy with nice modest careers. Of course, the percentage of prominant alumni from your t15 will undoubtedly be high. But how much of that is because most of those students started with funding, experience and connections that the masses at the R1 don’t have? Your stepson has those things. You can still help him and give him the benefit of your connections and experience even if he graduates from somewhere else.

54

@stepdad2022:
If you haven’t yet, go on a tour of your Alma Mater, the flagship, then two safeties. Don’t speak in terms such as ‘it is stupid to throw away such a chance’. However do point out that it is something you’re taking to heart, that really matters to you, so please accept to apply to humor you.
Make sure the tour is not conducted by an uppity preppy :wink: and arrange for him to eat lunch with students, perhaps meet with professors, etc.
There may be some foot dragging but take it in stride.
(Make sure admissions don’t know about his reluctance :wink: )
And be true to your word: if he applied, gets in, and STILL doesn’t want to go, he can go to the flagship.

55

It would be helpful if you revealed the “huge public university” in question.

Why ?

Because you have preconceived notions about this school which may or may not be accurate. Also, much has changed in the last 15 years regarding large public universities. Posters can share information about the large state school which may surprise you.

Also because if you want your stepson to consider & learn about your school, then it would be very kind & effective parenting to lead by example.

56

To be blunt, this is really a thread about self image–both yours & his.

@stepdad2022: What if, even with your connections and influence, your stepson was not admitted to your Top 15 alma mater ? Would you blame him ? His mother ? Yourself ? Would your stepson feel like a failure?

57

My best guess is that OP’s alma mater is either Duke or Vanderbilt based on the preppy rich kid stereotype mentioned by OP.

58

R1 covers a broad range of research universities, including most (if not all) state flagships. See here for the list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_research_universities_in_the_United_States

59

Then the OP is doing both himself & his stepson a disservice by not revealing the name of the “huge public university” in order to learn more about it.

@stepdad2022: Based on your reluctance to learn more about your stepson’s choice of school, and based upon your demeaning attitude toward both your wife & stepson, what makes you think that your alma mater is so great ?

60

Whatever you do, don’t show them this thread!

Go see the local university with him. Be honest about everything that’s good about it. You said it’s an R1 school so it’s not shabby by anyone’s standards. Don’t say anything negative.

Go see your old college. List everything that’s good about it also.

Ask him what he wants to do.

Write the pros and cons of each school down.

Ask him which school he thinks will let him achieve his aim and why.

The friends attending the university thing probably feels really big to him right now. It’s a shame as this is probably the least important part of the equation.

If you’re full pay explain to him that you wouldn’t spend that kind of money on him if you thought he wasn’t up to it and wouldn’t excel.

If he would get financial aid explain to him that the college wouldn’t give that kind of money away if they didn’t believe in him.

If you’re somewhere in the middle you are still committing a sizeable amount of money to his education and obviously believe he is capable.

Don’t run down the university or his reasons.

I also hope he has more than just this one university on his ‘list’. Nothing is a given in the admissions game.

I feel your frustration but sometimes things are out of our control as parents.

And if it doesn’t work out send me a message, I’ve two kids you could help me get into a T 15 college.

Good luck to you all.
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