<p>My dd will be graduating in 2013. I just started reading these forums yesterday and feel totally overwhelmed, especially since she wants to go to a pretty selective college. I'm pretty sure she will have the grades and SAT scores, but from what I was reading, there is a lot more involved in deciding admissions. Can anyone give me a summary of what all we need to be doing? She is taking honors classes, is set to take precalc and ap calc ab next year as they are on the block system and she can take 2 maths a year. The school doesn't have a lot of ap classes - calc ab, English language and composition, English literature and composition, biology, and chem. She can't really fit all of those in with the required classes she has to take. Also, what's this SAT II thing? We didn't have those back in the 80's...are they required or optional? I see students posting about service hours? She does stuff with church and scouts, as well as through school. Is she supposed to be keeping track of all of that too? She is thinking about majoring in math, or journalism, or maybe going to physician assistant school. Yes, she is all over the place right now but math and writing are her passions.</p>
<p>Thanks for the help. I think I might go do some breathing exercises now....
Krista</p>
<p>We had them (at least in the 1970’s). They were called SAT Achievement tests then. She will likely need 2 for a selective school, but every college has its own policy on these exams.</p>
<p>Yes, they are each one semester long so she can do 2 each year. She took Alg 2 and Advanced math this year and plans to double up again next year. I think she will try to take some math at the local college after that, or would it be better to focus on some of the other AP classes? She loves math.</p>
<p>It’s great that she is aiming high. Now she needs to find some match and safety schools that she loves and would happily attend.</p>
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<p>One of the key things to remember about admissions to selective colleges is that they are building a class, not just admitting individuals. Our family referred to the highly selective colleges as “lottery ticket schools” because that is all an application is for those schools. In other words, you cannot count on admission to them with rare exception.</p>
<p>A great place to start is the college counseling office of her high school.<br>
They can give you a copy of the school profile that is sent to colleges along with the HS transcript. The school profile will indicate whether her HS ranks, and what the typical GPA distribution is for the current senior class.
They can also talk to you about typical results for her HS over the past few years. They may have a system like Naviance, which plots student results by GPA and SAT scores. Looking at this data will give you a sense of how competitive her HS is, which is much more useful to understand than national generalizations.</p>
<p>Your D should also look at her target schools for their specific list of admission requirements. She may have already done that…</p>
<p>Peek in on the Parents of the Class of '12 thread in this forum. They’re talking about SAT/ACT and all of the tests that your D will be taking. Our kids are getting ready for the onslaught of AP and SAT/ACT tests this spring. </p>
<p>First of all, relax! I didn’t discover college confidential until the fall of my D’s senior year (two years ago).</p>
<p>SAT subject tests: depends on where you are; we are in the midwest and found that almost every school accepted the ACT with writing and she did not have to take SAT subject tests. However, that was 2 years ago so that may have changed.</p>
<p>Also, depending on your high school, your counselor’s office may/not be exceedingly helpful. My children attend a diverse urban public high school with a very low hs graduation rate, so they mainly focus on helping students graduate. Most students from their school, if they go on to college, stay in-state and attend public schools so they were not helpful or knowledgeable with out of state private schools.</p>
<p>Besides taking challenging courses in high school and following her passions, you could encourage pursuing some unique experiences/activities that will help her stand out in the application process. Some of these would probably happen even if you didn’t know about college confidential. For example, my D produced a documentary on a subject she was passionate about. She did it “just because” and having it as an admissions strategy wasn’t even on her/our radar.</p>
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<li><p>Find match and safety schools she can live with. This means financial match and safeties too.</p></li>
<li><p>Know she will change her mind 10 times before the pen has to hit the paper in Fall '12. </p></li>
<li><p>If a highly selective college is really, really important to her, she will need to find the room for the upper level APs. Without them, her counselor will not be able to mark her transcript “most rigorous course load.” And for most top 20 schools, that could be a deal breaker.</p></li>
<li><p>Make sure she begins to seek leadership opportunities in her current EC. ECs matter, but leadership in ECs matter more. Also, make sure she is in a/the EC for the right reason. Passion, love for whatever, is the right reason…looks good on college app…no so much.</p></li>
<li><p>Make sure she is keeping her grades up. All the APs in the world can’t mask average marks. It goes to old question of what is better…high As in honors courses, or high Bs in APs classes…the answer…A’s in APs.</p></li>
<li><p>Don’t put her under any pressure right now. The pressure will build…whether you like it or not, no need to start now.</p></li>
<li><p>Use this summer to start a few college visits close by. Try to figure out what she might want (like I said…this will change) Urban, big, small, cold weather, warm weather, close to home, far away. All of these things matter and to some students they can be deal breakers.</p></li>
<li><p>Determine if a “highly selective” college is important when choosing a major. Sometimes it can be a better choice to be in a State University that has great honors colleges so that there is flexibility if a mind begins to change. One can argue that it might be worth Ivy League $$ for a student that wants to pursue a life a surgeon, vs a student that wants to be a physicians assistant>>in other words>>Make sure you look at the financial equation when making that decision. A student who successfully goes through UG, Med School and onto the world of surgery, has a much better chance to pay back high student loans vs those loans having to be paid back on PA salary.</p></li>
<li><p>If you can, try not to let her buy into the idea of dream school. My heart breaks for the talented, high achieving kids on this board who get serious self esteem hits from said dream school uttering the dreaded two letter word…NO.</p></li>
<li><p>DO NOT LET HER APPLY TO SCHOOLS YOU CANNOT AFFORD. This to me is the most important. Don’t be the parent who comes on here in Spring of 2013 searching for help on how to tell your wonderful daughter that she can’t go to her dream school because the financial aid package sucked. Plan for the worst and hope for the best. Can’t afford the worst case option? Then put your application dollars on a different school.</p></li>
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<p>OP, we’ve all been in your shoes. It’s rather like drinking from a fire hydrant to read here at first. You’re reading the financial aid forum, right? The money piece is very, very, very important to understand early on. </p>
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<p>Yes, she should be keeping track of service hours, any honors or awards, and any activities she’s involved with. This will be of enormous help when she is filling out applications. Journals also have their place. My HS senior daughter was required to keep a journal for a summer program last summer, and she ended up quoting from it extensively in her application essays. </p>
<p>The important thing about the SAT IIs is to take a subject test at the end of the class if your child has finished the highest level of that subject. For example, the Math 2 SAT II covers math through trig and precalc, but not calculus. Your D should plan on taking that SAT II shortly after she finishes precalc, which will be halfway through her junior year. Another random example would be a student who takes regular chem in 10th grade and AP Chem in 11th. That student should wait till the end of 11th grade to take the Chem SAT II. A student who took AP Chem in 10th grade (such people do exist) would take the Chem SAT II at the end of 10th grade.</p>
<p>Krista, I was also very overwhelmed when I first came upon this site and felt like my children were so behind in preparing for the admissions process. But once you are armed with information, I think that you will feel a bit more settled. </p>
<p>You read so much about colleges wanting to see passion in their applicants and I believe that your daughter is at an advantage with her love of math. Sure she could sign up for a math class at the local college, but there are other (more convenient) ways of immersing in math. One of our favorite sites is Artofproblemsolving.com. She could sign up for classes, meet other math lovers and just explore various math subjects. Also, there are a series of competitions administered by the Mathematical Association of America which many math-loving students participate in and are recognized by colleges. </p>
<p>I think that if she pursues what she loves, it is a bonus in admissions. Good luck.</p>
<p>There is a longtime poster named “jonri” who compares selective college admissions to the challenge of casting a high school musical. It makes so much sense! Read it here (scroll down to find her post #12):</p>
<p>You’ve jumped in to learn at a revealing time in the admissions cycle. Stay tuned from now 'til May as colleges announce their decisions and students decide where they’re going. In addition to following the Parents forum, you might also zero in on the forums for a couple of colleges that are likely to make your daughter’s list–you will pick up a lot. </p>
<p>You will hear two sad refrains…if you can learn how to avoid these laments, you will be far ahead of the pack!</p>
<p>(1) I didn’t get into any of my “dream” schools and {I don’t have a safety} or {I hate my safety}.</p>
<p>(2) I got into my “dream” school, but I didn’t get the merit or financial aid I need to attend, and {I don’t have a financial safety}, {I hate my financial safety} or {my family and I are going to incur massive debt so I can attend}.</p>
<p>-Apply to a wide variety of schools…what they think they want as Juniors may be very different than what they ultimately decide. </p>
<p>-Even if she has all As in high rigourous APs AND test scores over 2250 there are no guarantees with highly selective schools, in fact I agree with poster that called them “lottery” schools - those stats just let you buy the ticket to play the game, not necessarily win the jackpot.</p>
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<li><p>There is one parent on this board that coined the phrase “Love the kid on the couch” and I couldn’t agree more with that statement. This process can stress all the relationships in your family but if you just remember through all the excitement and disappointment to “love the kid on the couch” then all will be well.</p></li>
<li><p>Apply early - by early I mean scramble and get everything in by Oct 15 which means you need to complete testing in the junior year and finish essays over the summer.</p></li>
<li><p>Pick at least one rolling admissions school that is a match/safety that they like. It takes the pressure off the holidays if you have an acceptance under your belt - in fact, what started off as a safety for my D is turning into her #1 and she has been accepted into every one of her schools so far.</p></li>
<li><p>Try not to ride your child’s “rollarcoaster” They will be emotionally high, low, and frustrated at times. They are under tremendous pressure during their senior year (unlike the good ole days!)</p></li>
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<p>cyclone, it’s really not as bad as you think. You are ahead of the curve.</p>
<p>If you have a Feb break, Junior year is an ideal time to look at a couple of nearby colleges - that’s when we determined that my younger son had to have a well defined campus and did not want a campus in the woods. For my older son the first visit confirmed that his first priority was the academics and he didn’t care about size or location. (Later he said no hot climates, and he clearly liked colleges with a techie vibe.)</p>
<p>I’d sign up for SAT in March, ACT in April and see how the scores play out for retaking one of them in June. May junior year is usually a good time to take SAT 2s. For most schools 2 is enough. My kids each applied to one that wanted three so they took three in one day. Most colleges don’t care what you take, but some engineering schools will have more specific requirements. If you can have all testing done by the end of junior year that’s ideal. That way you know what score and GPA you’ve got in the hand for picking out colleges.</p>
<p>Oh and make sure your child takes PSAT October of Junior year.</p>
<p>As for picking out colleges, I can’t emphasize enough that having a safety your child likes is critical. For many this can be State U., but if you’ve got a child with special interests you may be able to do better than this. For both my kids the state options for safeties were not nearly as good as either a small tech school for the older one, or a medium sized university with an excellent program in the planned major for the younger one. I think the best safety is the college you’ve already been accepted to by December - so look for colleges with early action programs, rolling admissions or some other early notification program that isn’t binding. Getting into one of these is great - and if they don’t get in, it may be a sign that the list needs rethinking.</p>
<p>Some parents got their kids to start applications before school started senior year. Neither of my kids did this, but they both did do the hard work by October when those Early Action applications were due.</p>
<p>Finally all that stuff about community service and extra-curricular activities. Don’t over-worry this. A few activities in depth is much better than being spread too thin. For both my kids the major service activity they had was some summer hours at the senior center. They each did activities there that corresponded to their interests. My older son helped out in their computer lab and did some other computer stuff for them. My younger son gave violin concerts and taught an origami class. Both my kids only had two or three extra curricular activities at school and both of them actually ended up writing their essays about outside school activities.</p>
<p>Too true that both rigor and grades count. When someone in the audience at our school’s college night asked whether it was better to get an A in the regular class or a B in the honors or AP class the Vassar admissions officer said “It’s better to get an A in the honors or AP class.” There were nods and chuckles from the other admissions officers present. That said, both my kids had a number of B’s or B+'s on their transcript. At least from our high school, that didn’t keep them from being accepted from some very highly rated schools.</p>
<p>cyclonehome…i to did not discover this sight until my son was a senior in HS. I wish I had discovered it when he was 9th grade. just get a cup of coffee and read this sight for two hours everyday and you will catch up in a month LOL</p>
<p>Your student should be keeping track of the number of hours that they participate in community service. It would be helpful to create a spreadsheet or hand written list with the activities they are in, number of hours per week (or month) that they participate in, and any leadership positions they hold. This will be very important when filling out college and scholarship applications.</p>
<p>Went to college in the EARLY 70’s and it was basically if you were super bright, and had the $ or found a ton of scholarships (not so easy back then) you went to an elite school. If you didn’t have the money, you went to a state U and lived at home and if you could get some scholarship money, and were fairly bright, you went to a private somewhere in state. We only had one AP class offered in HS. I took ACT and SAT, but no other tests. D just graduated from college a couple years ago, and wish I had found this site as early as you have. College admission has changed dramatically. Suffice it to say that most of the kids rejected from elite schools could actually have done very well there, and were qualified. There is so much more involved in a school creating a class - assuming all things are equal (and thousands who apply to elites schools are fairly much that) and everyone has high SAT’s and high grades, then are you the trombone player they need? Are you the kid they need on the Quiz Bowl Team because all the seniors graduated? So your extracurriculars can certainly make you stand out. Or they can be your downfall - you are a cellist and they have 6 in three levels, so they don’t need another. And you won’t know if what your child specializes in is what is needed. Diversity also comes into play - and that can be racial, geogrophic or socio economic. Anyway, it is much more complicated than that, but this is it in a bare bones nutshell. It’s a crapshoot, and that is why other posters have said your D needs to find schools that are safeties, matches and reaches. Good luck! I am SO happy we arent’ starting now.</p>
<p>Don’t worry! I didn’t find CC until a year ago when my second was waiting for his college acceptances to come in. Ignorance can be bliss! What I learned from going through the application roller-coaster twice is that everything really does work-out in the end.</p>
<p>cyclonehome – Good advice so far in the threads, but YES, she should be keeping track of what extracurriculars she does, whatever those might be. If she has the opportunity (and the real interest in) running for a leadership position in one of her groups (either in scouts, or youth group or whatever) she should definitely do that. Selective schools like to see that kids are really involved in their activities, whatever they may be, and that they are leaders in those activities. Being the Captain/President/Vice President/Membership director etc. is a big help, as is taking the helm of a large project and leading it to successful completion (planning and executing scouting projects, maybe organizing a service project with church). </p>
<p>At any rate, it will be extremely helpful down the road if you start keeping track now of any and ALL achievements she has earned in extracurriculars and at school. Any awards she gets, however small, should be listed on her application, and you should try and recount how many hours she spends at each activity. Our high school guidance counselors always encouraged us to list EVERYTHING we possibly could think of, but by senior year it can be difficult to recall it all. </p>
<p>Don’t fret if she can’t take every AP at her high school. What matters is that she’s taking the most challenging curriculum possible for her (i.e. what she can realistically take) and that she is doing well in those classes. Selective colleges tend to get to know the high schools in their area, and they’ll be evaluating her based on how she does relative to her peers and how rigorous her academic load is. Sounds like if she’s doing Calc as a junior, she’s on a good track.</p>