I honestly have no idea where to go and I'm desperate for help. WARNING: Very long.

Paying for College
1

<p>Hi CC, I’ve reached a dead end and I need your help.</p>

<p>I've been a member of this website for almost a year now and I've been browsing for even longer. College Confidential has helped me a lot with understanding what I need to do to get into a good college and I credit a lot of my academic success and motivation to the information I've found on here. I mainly browse the HSL and AP/SAT forums and try to avoid thinking about the financial aspect of college because I know it's going to be a huge problem for me and thinking about it only makes me depressed. I like dreaming about what colleges I can get into and comparing my stats to others that were accepted to certain colleges and reading about how awesome colleges that I'm interested in are.</p>

<p>Before I dive into the problem, I’ll give you guys some background info. Straight up, I’m not a happy person and I haven’t been for much of high school. My home life is absolutely horrible. My relationship with my parents is awful and, despite all of us hating each other and barely surviving living with each other, they refuse to help me get out of here and go on to college and discourage me from even trying. Before high school, I didn’t have a lot of motivation to do that great in school but I got pretty good grades regardless. However, ever since sophomore year, I’ve really kicked it into gear and my academics have been my number one priority. My parents’ discouragement for me to succeed has been my motivation to do amazing in school and get a magical scholarship that would send me off to a great college without any of their help. Throughout the past couple years, they have constantly told me that the hours I spend on homework and studying every night is pointless because I’m still just going to end up at a community college or commuting from home to a local state school that 99% of my school ends up at and that I have zero interest in. I’ve ignored them, though, continuing to work hard and get good grades. </p>

<p>This year, I took four AP classes and one honors class, which is probably something that, a few years ago, I could never see myself doing, let alone succeeding in. However, I managed to finish my first semester with five As and one B. There have been some rare occasions where my parents have acted proud of me and one time they even went as far to say that, if I actually got into a school like UC Berkeley or UCLA, then they would have no choice but to co-sign the loans and help me in attending. Unfortunately, 99% of the time, they have told me that it’s all for nothing and there is still no way anyone can pay for me to go away to college. I always liked to think that there was going to be some way that it would all work out, that if I got into a great college then they would accommodate me in attending somehow, that other people share my financial troubles but they don’t let it limit where they spend the next four, crucial years of their lives. Well, I’m starting to lose hope. The truth is, even after all of my hard work, I’m still average. I’m white (half-Jewish if that helps for anything) so I don’t have a shot at any ethnic scholarships. My mom doesn’t work, but my dad makes ~$100K a year so I doubt I qualify for any financial aid, even though this income isn’t enough to contribute anything to college (or at least they aren’t willing to). </p>

<p>Merit aid is my last shot, but my stats are still probably average compared to other applicants. </p>

<p>By the time I apply next year, I should have a 3.8 unweighted GPA, a 4.4 weighted GPA, a 4.2 capped UC GPA and a 4.3 uncapped UC GPA. I don’t know about SAT scores yet, I’m still waiting to see what I got in March but I’m not expecting anything great, probably like a 1700-1800. I’ve been experiencing a severe lack of motivation this semester and I just couldn’t bring myself to study for it. I do think that if I can just sit down and focus for an extended period of time, breaking 2000 is definitely a possibility. Getting a 2100 would make me so happy as I feel like that would put me in the running at my dream schools, UC Berkeley and UCLA, but this isn’t the kind of score that would get me merit aid if I even was lucky enough to get accepted. So I guess I would have to deny my acceptance, commute to Cal State Fullerton everyday where I can see 99% of the kids from my high school graduating class and fall into depression while living at home for at least two more years. </p>

<p>My extracurriculars are pretty average as well. By the time I apply for college, I’ll have three years on the tennis team (two of them on varsity), two years in JSA (one year in cabinet), two years in FBLA (one year as an officer, also made it to state in a competition and, depending on how I do, maybe nationals), two years in Math Club (took the AMC 12 but bombed it) and I’m planning on getting a job this summer that I’ll hold throughout the school year. I’m pretty sure none of this stuff is special in any way and I don’t see how I’m going to stand out as an applicant. I think I could write some good essays about how strong-willed I am but what good is that going to do for me? I could spend countless hours senior year writing essays for scholarships and maybe win a couple thousand dollars but that hardly makes a dent in a $30K per year college education.</p>

<p>Ever since the beginning of my extensive college-searching career, I’ve pretty much eliminated the possibility of getting to go out of state for college. I always read posts on here of students planning to apply to 10-20 schools, many of them out of state, money not even being a factor into where they decide to go. Their parents encourage them to try as hard as they can and go to the best school they can possibly get into. I can’t help but feel envious. Today, my mom said that we wouldn’t even have enough money to apply to colleges. I seriously have no idea why she’s acting like we’re dirt poor because my dad has a pretty good job. </p>

<p>I wasn’t even planning on applying to many schools; I’ve limited my college list to a few in-state public schools: UC Berkeley, UCLA, UC Davis, UC Irvine, and Cal Poly SLO. It’s too bad that California state schools still cost over $20K a year to live at and attend and UCs are around $30K. It’s also too bad that my choices for colleges are so slim but I am still entirely content with California schools. I would kill to go to Cal or UCLA and UCD, UCI, and SLO all sound like a blast attend if I don’t get into the top-tier UCs. But like I said, as of now, none of these are even an option as I have no way of paying for any of these.</p>

<p>I have looked into other options, trust me. I know that University of Alabama pays full tuition if you get a 3.5 GPA and a 1400 CR+M SAT score. Assuming I can do this, I still can’t even afford the few thousand it would cost to live there. And my parents are entirely against the idea of me living in Alabama. They’re super snobby and think that it would be redneckville, even though I’ve read that it’s a nice college town.</p>

<p>So, that’s the jist of it. I apologize if I come off as whiny, but I just feel so depressed right now. I don’t know how many people can relate to me but my parents have no idea how much it hurts me to hear them say that, despite all of the time that I have devoted to my academics and all of the socializing and fun I’ve sacrificed for my schoolwork, I’m still going to have to live in my miserable household and attend an undesirable college while all of my friends, most of which’s parent make less than mine do, go off to college and experience the college life that I’ve been looking forward to ever since I was a kid. </p>

<p>Do I have any other options?<br>
If I do get into the UCs, will they help me out even if my parents refuse to co-sign loans? <--- This is the main one.
Do I have any chance at significant scholarships or are there any others I could try for?<br>
Are there any schools out there that I could potentially get a full-ride scholarship to given my average profile and stats?</p>

<p>I really appreciate anyone that takes the team to read this and share their knowledge. I know my thoughts are jumbled and if you followed everything then you deserve an award.</p>

2

<p>(1) Get your SAT score up. Or try the sample ACT that’s available on the ACT website, and if you think you like it better, take that test instead. Take the time to PREP, whichever test you take!!! If you can be ready in time to take the test in June, that would be great - then you’ll know which colleges you’re eligible for. If not, take it as soon as you can in the fall (October for the SAT and September for the ACT). (Go to the SAT/ACT forum on CC, and see about finding old copies of actual tests - that’s the best and cheapest way to prepare for either test.)</p>

<p>(2) Get a job over the summer. If your parents aren’t going to help at all, you’re going to need money to pay for all the things that won’t be covered by financial aid, even if you get a full ride somewhere.</p>

<p>(3) Look at the [automatic</a> full tuition/full ride scholarship thread](<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1348012-automatic-full-tuition-full-ride-scholarships.html]automatic”>Automatic Full Tuition / Full Ride Scholarships - Financial Aid and Scholarships - College Confidential Forums). There are lots of options for full ride scholarships. In other words, you CAN afford school, even if your parents aren’t willing to help.</p>

<p>(3) Look at the [competitive</a> full ride scholarship thread](<a href=“Competitive Full Tuition / Full Ride Scholarships - Financial Aid and Scholarships - College Confidential Forums”>Competitive Full Tuition / Full Ride Scholarships - Financial Aid and Scholarships - College Confidential Forums) also. One or more of them might be worth a try.</p>

<p>(4) Look at the [Work</a> College Consortium](<a href=“http://www.workcolleges.org/]Work”>http://www.workcolleges.org/).</p>

<p>(5) If you’re a girl, look at the [Women’s</a> College Coalition](<a href=“http://www.womenscolleges.org/]Women’s”>http://www.womenscolleges.org/).</p>

<p>(6) And here’s an old list of [tuition-free</a> colleges](<a href=“http://images.businessweek.com/ss/10/01/0121_tuition_free_colleges/1.htm]tuition-free”>http://images.businessweek.com/ss/10/01/0121_tuition_free_colleges/1.htm) - but be aware that many of these will cover tuition only, and not other expenses, so they might not work for you. (And some of them are already in the list of work colleges I have you.)</p>

<p>(7) If application fees are a problem, check out this guide to schools that have [free</a> applications](<a href=“http://www.porcelina.net/freeapps/listings.html]free”>Free College Applications).</p>

<p>(8) About outside scholarships - those might help, especially to give you some extra money your first year of school, but your first focus should be on finding schools that will give you a free ride . . . so do the college applications first, and the scholarship applications afterwards.</p>

<p>(9) Talk to your guidance counselor at school, and see if he or she is able to help with any of this - from college applications to your problems at home. That’s what the guidance counselor is there to do!</p>

<p>(10) Good luck!!!</p>

3

<p>The other piece of advice I have for you is to look in the archives for what MomfromTexas has written on full ride scholarships. Her situation was such that for her sons to go away to college, that is what they needed, and they were not superstars in their stats. She has come up with some methods of coming up with little known schools that are looking for students with stats in the upper echelons of their range.</p>

<p>I am truly sorry that you are not getting the encouragement at home and that the atmosphere is so tense and down for you. You’ve done very well for yourself, and ironically, that adds to the feeling that you are deprived because you are probably with a lot of kids who are looking at the very options you want for yourself, but without parental support, are going to be difficult if not impossible to achieve. </p>

<p>Dodgermom has some good solid suggestions for you. Do keep your grades up and work at bringing up your test scores as that does increase the options you will have. </p>

<p>The fact of the matter is that your parents are probably living to every dollar of their income, maybe more and are not happy with where they are and what they have. Though a six figure income sounds great, in reality, I have no idea where it places them in the category of families with college aged kids living in a high cost area. It probably does not give them the type of luxurious living one would think and they had hoped to have. There are a lot of disappointments in life, and as you can see, it is very easy to let them turn a person bitter. You don’t want this to happen to you.</p>

<p>And yet, you are embarking on going down that path, as you look at those options that are luxuries and feel that this is what you DESERVE. Yes, schools like Berkeley and UCLA are wonderful to dream of having, just as owning BMWs and Mercedes are. One can wish to live in a more luxurious neighborhood, but be so constrained by budget, shop without so many constraints, go on nicer vacations, oh, the dreams we can have if only we had the money. </p>

<p>The fact of the matter is that most people get through college bit by bit, commuting from home, working full or part time. They do not go to colleges that are known outside of their locale. Just like they live life, paying their bills, working a job that is not exactly what they had hoped to be doing, and having relationships and famlies that are not quite what they had wanted, maybe not at all what they had wanted. Those happiest are those who find a way to make things work no matter what the path is and what the situation is and look for the opportunities in that situation. </p>

<p>I know a young woman, a friend’s DD who was, like you a very good student, and in a different family probably would have been aiming for the top UCs. Family blew up her high school years and she ended up commuting to Chico State. You probably know the school better than I do. But she had wonderful college years, did well, had a great time, got her degree, has a terrific job that pays more than most people her age are getting, a SO that she adores and a life she is so, so, so enjoying. Because that is the type of person she is. She went to Chico early in the morning and did not get home till late, with jobs on campus, an active social life, college life, and studying. She milked every ounce of what she could get in those precious four years she was at college. She got very little, if anything from her parents as they were undergoing a bitter divorce from which they will never financially recover. So she did it herself. </p>

<p>If you really want to get away from home, you need to research colleges where you are at the very top of their range and so they will pay for you. You can try some true lottery ticket schools too, but getting big merit money is difficult even for top students at those schools with name recognition. Why should they pay for students when they are lined to begging to pay to go there. Those are not the schools you should be considerings, but schools with names that you don’t even know right now. Look at what scholarships they will offer. Small Catholic schools, schools in Montana, South Dakota. If you know the school, it’s probably not going to make the list. You are asking a school to pay for your upkeep as well as give you a free education, so you have got to be some hot stuff for them. This is a business for the schools, so they are not going to pay for something unless it is something they want that they cannot ordinarily get. That is what you need to do if you don’t want to take the local route.</p>

<p>The fact of the matter is that the only loan you can take is $5500 in Stafford loans freshman year. That is in your name only, so your parents will not be involved. The interest rate is about 7% a year and the money starts cranking up the interest the minute the funds are distributed. It is highly unlikely you will get any other loan offers yourself, unless they are part of a financial aid package at one of the higher priced private schools and then what is left to pay out of pocket would be about what the UCs would cost. So, without your parents cosigning, or another credit worthy person, no, it is highly unlikely that you can take out more than that in loans. Cosigning puts your parents primarily on the hook, by the way, and the interest rates are usually no bargain. Not a good option for a lot of families who are taking this option, by the way. Those smiling parents of some of the kid whom you so envy may be signing loans to disaster as they encourage their kids to take options that the family cannot afford. As cruel as it may seem to you, your parents are doing you a favor not going down this path. Please trust me on this one. I don’t like the attitude that you have described that they have, but the loan route is often deadly. One of my kids is 30 years old, so I am seeing what a lot of his peers and families have done in taking out this loans. They do double in 10 years at that interest rate and paying them back in this economy has been difficult and often not doable. There are many who predict this is going to be the next disasterous bubble to burst.</p>

<p>You are not alone. A lot of kids in your shoes here in NY too who have the stats to get into what they consider their dream colleges, but their parents can’t and won’t pay. So they commute to the local SUNY or some school that gives them merit. This is a high income/high COL area, so $100K isn’t enough to comfortably support sending a kid away to college unless the family has been planning on it and saving for it over a long period of time,and willing to take out some loans, which with the way things have been is often not a viable option. Believe me, there are many, many kids like you.</p>

4

<p>Followthereaper - Don’t lose hope. Things will work out. This world is a great place especially because of people like dodgersmom and cptofthehouse who took the time to read your long post and gave EXCELLENT suggestions. Keep studying hard and you WILL win.</p>

5

<p>I’m not an expert in California public universities, but I know there are plenty of good ones. Apply to many of them. </p>

<p>It sounds like the most critical thing for you to do is to get out of town and live on campus, without needing co-signing of debt. With a summer job, a state grant, in-state tuition, federal Stafford loans that DO NOT need co-signing, and maybe a work study job, you should be able to do it. </p>

<p>If your test scores come in high, then I’d add a bunch of private colleges that provide great merit aid. They can often end up being cheaper than an in-state university, if you are at the top 15% of their applicant pool.</p>

6

<p>Charlieschm, where the issue lies is that for the OP to go away to school, she will need more money than the $5500 Stafford loan she can take out. She will get no financial aid for the cost of going to a California state school and any private school aid is still going to leave a gap. Her parents have made it pretty clear, that though they will provide a home for her while she commutes to college, they are not going to pay for her to go away for college. Maybe they will relent, maybe they will cough up what it would cost to have her home and what they would pay for the local Cal State, maybe not. So she might want to put some chances on her list.</p>

<p>However, most importantly she needs some very likely and sure shots that are affordable, and for her, that means merit aid. A lot of it. Like close to a full ride which is not easy to get. Most merit awards are undr $5K which is not going to put much of a dent in the cost of most schools, and for the OP, if she wants to have some options she can exercise without her parents help, she needs a full ride or very close to it. Even with a full ride, there will likely be travel costs and other expenses that she will have to come up with. But to get that kind of money, it’s more like the upper 1-5% of the applicant pool that she would have to be. That means looking for colleges that are not well known at all.</p>

7

<p>1) Research schools that meet full need without loans (or few loans).
2) Take a year off (gap year). Move out, get a job, support yourself, and become “independent”.
3) As an independent, your EFC (expected family contribution) will be based upon your earnings (which are nil) and not your parents.
4) Consider going to school part time and working.
5) Move to Alabama and take the year to establish residency there. If your research shows other public colleges/universities that meet full need without loans, consider moving there. If you are supporting yourself, it doesn’t matter what your parents think, especially if they are not going to help you pay for college.</p>

8

<p>OperaDad:</p>

<p>1) Full need isn’t going to cut it for OP as parents are not going to pay the EFC or any likely contribution that will be required at their income level.</p>

<p>2) A gap year does not make a student independent for colleges. One needs to be age 24, married, have a dependent, be a veteran or be a ward of the state prior to turning 18. Also, moving out, finding a job, getting on one’s own is a tall order for a high school grad. </p>

<p>3) EFC will continue to be based on parents due to 2) as student will not be independent for financial aid purposes for college</p>

<p>4) A local commuter school is already an option and parents seem willing to support this. OP does not want to go to the local college is the problem, and does not want to live with parents</p>

<p>5) Same issue that were brought up in 2) and 3)</p>

<p>The OP is lamenting fact that options are limiting to local state schools and commuting when stats put OP in line for possible acceptance at selective school. Parents make too much for financial aid at state school but have said they are not going to pay for OP to go away to school. Private school awards will put cost around state school levels if need based and parent contribution would be needed to make this happen. OP has good stats but not good enough for full or close to full merit money at selective school.</p>

9

<p>Point #1 in dodgersmom’s post is the most important one. Merit aid is your ticket to a situation that will satisfy you, and SAT/ACT scores are the most important criteria for merit aid. There is a lot of information on the SAT/ACT forum of CC for methods to improve scores.</p>

10

<p>These are great replies, so I will only add - look at schools more broadly. In CA, Oxy, Whittier, Scripps, and Pepperdine all have very strong/full ride scholarships for students like you. You can do it, and 100,000/yr does not rule out all financial aid. Make sure you apply for it.</p>

11

<p>I just want to reiterate what cptofthehouse said in post #8 above:</p>

<p>Independent status is NOT an option (and won’t be for many, many years)</p>

<p>Trying to establish residency in another state is also NOT the solution. Getting a full ride scholarship (using the methods suggested above) does NOT depend on where you live!</p>

<p>Schools that meet full need are also not the answer. The OP needs to focus on applying to schools where he or she is eligible for full ride merit awards.</p>

<p>And I’m going to add one more piece of advice: Try to find an adult in your community who will give you some moral support as you go through this process . . . if not your school guidance counselor, perhaps a teacher, or the parent of a friend. They don’t have to be expert in the college application process - they don’t even have to know anything about it! They just have to be willing to help. Keep looking until you find this person - it will make a huge difference!</p>

12

<p>Take both the ACT and the SAT. They are very different tests. For whichever test had the best score, take that test a second time. </p>

<p>Once you know your test scores, and have a better idea of your major/interests, come back onto the “College Selection” part of this website, and I’m sure people can provide some more specific advice about colleges worthy of a closer look.</p>

<p>I don’t know the system in California, but I know in PA. there are plenty of private colleges who are happy to offer half off their tuition per year with merit aid for scores that are very good but not spectacular. However, that just brings their tuition down to the most expensive in-state public choices in PA. </p>

<p>PA. offers some state college grants to students with upper middle incomes, if those students attend an in-state public or private college. The original poster should take a close look at the types of state grants that are available in California, and whether they are available for out of state colleges.</p>

13

<p>Too long sorry- I barely skimmed.
Apply to NCCC.
[AmeriCorps.gov</a> > AmeriCorps NCCC](<a href=“http://www.americorps.gov/about/programs/nccc.asp]AmeriCorps.gov”>http://www.americorps.gov/about/programs/nccc.asp)
Take a year off volunteering around the country, and come out of it with a strong resume and an education grant to pay towards loans.</p>

14

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</p>

<p>Even if the OP were eligible for Cal Grants (and parental income suggests that he or she would not be), Cal Grants are not available for out-of-state colleges.</p>

<p>I also disagree with the suggestion to sit for both the SAT and the ACT. The tests are quite different, and require different preparation. Also, sitting for both tests costs money and takes time. The OP can assess his or her preference just as effectively by making use of the practice tests available online. One that determination is made, the OP should practice, practice, practice - focusing on the chosen test.</p>

15

<p>“independent” is also: "At any time on or after July 1, 2012, did the director of a runaway or homeless youth basic center or transitional living program determine that you were an unaccompanied youth who was homeless or were self-supporting and at risk of being homeless? "
[Will</a> I need my parents’ information?](<a href=“http://www.fafsa.ed.gov/help/fftoc02k.htm]Will”>http://www.fafsa.ed.gov/help/fftoc02k.htm)</p>

<p>With “youth” being age 21 or younger. As self-supporting youth flipping burgers, you have a chance at Director certifying you at risk of being homeless (which includes living in a motel).
<a href=“https://faaaccess.ed.gov/fotw1213/help/fahelp67.htm[/url]”>https://faaaccess.ed.gov/fotw1213/help/fahelp67.htm&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>All she needs is “received a determination at any time on or after July 1, 2011, that he or she was an unaccompanied youth who was homeless, or self-supporting and at risk of being homeless.”</p>

<p>Once she is Independent, then she will have a low EFC, and a school that meets full need will be her ticket.</p>

<p>Regarding part-time and working: That is not just for community colleges. A lot of people go to Flagship State Schools on a part-time basis and work their way through. If there is one she wants to go to, that also has good financial aid, then move there and establish residency.</p>

<p>OP needs ideas that are outside the box. So what if she can live at home and go to a local school? That isn’t the only option to work and go to school. She said she didn’t want the local school. Now, if she is not willing to work, that is a different issue.</p>

<p>BTW: If it takes you 8 years to get through college, while working part time, you get to experience college life for twice as long.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Don’t tell her what she can’t do. Let her figure out if it is doable. My D moved to LA and is waitressing to support herself so she can try to break into Hollywood. She doesn’t need to buy a house. Just pay for a room, food, and transportation for a while. BTW: I left home after HS, and found a job to support myself before college.</p>

<p>If she wants it bad enough, she will find a way to make it work.</p>

16

<p>^ Where the heck is this coming from? The OP is not homeless. The OP comes from a family making $100K. The OP has alternatives including merit aid rather than being told to live on the street on the off-chance someone will code her as homeless.</p>

17

<p>

</p>

<p>Actually, he or she doesn’t. Acceptance to any school where he or she would qualify for a full ride merit scholarship would do quite nicely. There are many students whose parents are unwilling to support them in college. For a student who’s able to qualify, merit scholarships are the solution.</p>

<p>Additionally, the definition of “homeless” provided by OperaDad above applies only to a student who is living in a motel, car, with friends, etc. “because the student had nowhere else to go.” It does NOT apply to a student who moved out of his or her parents’ house voluntarily.</p>

<p>And given the abundance of schools that provide generous merit scholarships, why go to these lengths just to apply to a “meets full need” school? :confused:</p>

18

<p>Dodgersmom - that was my point - for each student to find out if you are eligible for any state grants and whether they can be used out of state. Many students overlook that factor, and unknowingly miss out on state grants because they go out of state. Even a $1000 a year state grant for an upper middle income family (if available) can be helpful in closing a gap in funding. For moderate and lower income families, the state grants can be a major factor. In my state, for example, many middle income families receive $4k a year in a state grant, and nothing or almost nothing if they go out of state.</p>

<p>The standardized tests are not only about preparation - they are also about aptitude. Generally, students who do better in science than math will do better on the ACT. My daughter also personally preferred the order, logic and timing of the ACT. The costs of one more standardized test is worth it to increase chances of aid. Also, for lower income families, they can get one free ACT and 2 free SAT test days.</p>

19

<p>If you do gain admissions to a UC, but cannot afford it, perhaps you could live at home and do two years at a community college, maybe even take out the maximum Stafford at the end of each year to save toward funding years 3/4. Then apply to transfer to the UC.</p>

<p>Also, at each UC there may be an Alumni scholarship, check it out and apply for it, now. You might ask your high school if you are eligible for the Byrd scholarship (is that still funded?) and also ask your High school guidance counselor about any other aware. The Blue & Gold or Cal grants are your best opportunity for funding tuition, but living expenses are high. In most UCs, you will find living off campus can be much much cheaper than dorms.</p>

20

<p>The Byrd scholarships were killed in a round of federal budget cuts 3 years ago. A couple states may have continued to fund them with their own dollars, but most didn’t.</p>