I really need some advice

Parent Cafe
41

<p>Maybe my solution is not so farfetched - you can attend the Univ of South Alabama for $13740 plus the cost of bus tickets back and forth to home. I'm sure they would accept you, not as sure that they still have dorm space.</p>

<p>My realistic point is I find it hard to believe that every state school in Ohio will require you to take out $20000 in loans to attend? Are you not a state resident? Are you ineligible for scholarships/grants because it is too late? What does Kent State cost these days????</p>

<p>I'm kind of conservative, but I feel that for a young person in your position, a loan of $10000 to finance education is PLENTY (total potential debt $40K). Now, if you knew for certain what your financial situation will be next year, OK, maybe the $20000 would make sense, if you would have near 0 EFC after this year. It just doesn't sound like your financial situation will be that settled even next year. My worst case scenario for you is run out of money next year, mountain of debt and only one year toward a degree. I guess the focus of most of us is how can you get through to next year with one year of education, and little to no debt - that leaves you with many more options for next year.
As for community college - there are a number of community colleges down here that have dorms, do you have those in Ohio? That would solve the housing problem.</p>

42

<p>I suggested you post here and there is a lot of great advice but I imagine it's getting confusing. Here's an effort at rounding things up.</p>

<p>There are many colleges where you can get good financial aid. Many mentioned women's colleges like Smith and Bryn Mawr. They have the prestige you seek. There are many good schools, and I know the folks here will help you put together a list.</p>

<p>So what to do for a year? You need to do something that involves your living away from home so community college is not a possibility unless you find a live in job. Again, a job as nanny or a live in aide for the elderly will provide you with room and board. You can do this in many places so maybe you can fulfill your NYC dream or maybe California or some other place appeals. The salary takes into account that you are being provided with the basics, so your salary won't effect EFC that much. If you would like to know about agencies that place people in these jobs, PM me. Others have given other things to check out. It seems like the most important thing for you is to have something to do and somewhere to live for a year. You can find that.</p>

<p>Also, you should ask your counselor to talk to your state Us. It doesn't sound right that none would offer you any aid. Make certain you don't have options there.</p>

<p>You have a list of colleges that are still taking applications. Start emailing them to see which are still offering aid.</p>

<p>Ashley, there's a good reason the parents here are telling you not to take a $30K loan even for one year. It will effect your future. It might seem like all lawyers make a lot of money, but really most do not. If everything goes right maybe you will, but counting on it is unwise. </p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

43

<p>Ashley, to second the sound advice from Zagat.... it sounds like we're trying to crush your dream, but as 40 and 50 something's all of us parents know people like you who at 40 or 50 aren't where they thought they'd be in life. It's either because of a bad choice in a spouse/significant other ; debt; or that they never finished college.</p>

<p>We can't help you with the first, except to tell you not to marry a drug abuser or someone who is violent. We're trying to help with the second two where we actually can be helpful. I'm sure between us we could describe to you dozens of our peers.... siblings, neighbors, cousins, the nice guy who runs the xerox machine at Kinko's, who have as much on the ball as you but couldn't get their arms around a four year degree to get their life launched.</p>

<p>You've got two strikes against you right this second.... a less than ideal family situation (losing your dad is tough enough... the rest is insult to injury) and a misguided notion that the only option to you right now is NYU, however you can make that happen.</p>

<p>We're all trying to eliminate the second strike. If you can be in a position next June 2007 where you've got some college credits (which are transferable) under your belt and your financial situation is no worse than it is right now, and you've gotten yourself some independence, then all of us think you've got a huge chance at launching yourself. If you end up next June with one year at NYU, a pile of debt, and no good options for September 2007 since you'll be an even worse candidate for loans once you've got the Campusdoor liability on your credit record.... we're all concerned that that's the end of the road for Ashley. At that point, the nanny job with free food and all the tV you can watch is going to look a lot more palatable than some of your other options.</p>

<p>Please, please find someone-- your pastor, your principal-- who can help you develop some other choices for September 2006.</p>

44

<p>I wasn't suggesting that she take out the loan. I was answered Marite's question about what bank would possibly loan that much to an unemployed student.</p>

45

<p>Ashley, I hope you will consider the Otterbein option. My daughter will be attending there in the fall, and we have found them to not only be reasonable, but also very easy to deal with. No, Otterbein doesn't have a name-known-on-CC (except for those in the know about musical theatre), but they have many, many reputable programs and degree options. In addition, I believe their arts department is moving to a new facility next year (double-check on this), so it's an area where there are assets and the college's commitment. Finally, when Otterbein talks about "the Otterbein family", it's not just marketing; they have been amazingly supportive and kind in all their dealings with my daughter and our family.</p>

46

<p>
[quote]
I do not need to take all 30,000 out. I have saved up a lot already and plan to work two jobs this summer. It would be 20,000 either way so I see why not go where I want to, even if for only a year, when it costs the same.

[/quote]
You should not be borrowing $20K to attend any school for one year. It is reasonable for you to be in debt $20-$30K after four years, when you graduate -- it is not reasonable to take on that amount of debt for 1 year. It simply is too much. </p>

<p>The problem for you is that you are already trying to get away from an untenable family situation -- essentially trying to claw your way out of poverty or near-poverty. The only way you can do that is to conserve resources -- otherwise the debt you take on now will weigh you down the rest of your life. Rich people can afford to take on debt, but usually don't need to; poor people never can. It's the modern-day equivalent of earning one's living as a sharecropper -- the harder you work, the farther behind you get. </p>

<p>Keep in mind that Zagat's nanny-option can also be combined with attending college -- that is, you might be able to attend a less expensive college and arrange a live-in job that provides you with housing but also lets you go to school. Getting a position as an apartment manager, or a caretaker of property or housesitter are other options that provide you with free or almost-free housing without necessarily tying up all your time.</p>

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<p>I may be in the minority here but I think Ashley is the perfect candidate to attend a school where she is eligible for MERIT aid...not need based aid.She just has to get over the "prestige"stigma and do some digging and inquiring.I see her being able to attend somewhere debt free. Perhaps that place wont be in NYC but it could be in another great locale.What she needs is some time,and space and expert advice to get it all worked out. Ashley please,please don't lock yourself into those loans.</p>

48

<p>Ashley, I must add my voice to everyone else's here and say to you that you must NOT take on the debt related to NYU. There are more considerations than just the initial expenses; you also must factor in the "soft" costs of clothing, transportation, food, supplies, books, computer, software, tech support - and then even the expense of furnishing a dorm room or whatever housing you will have. Plus that location is expensive period. </p>

<p>In addition, you'll be faced with registering for sophomore year before you know it - you'll almost be in the position of having to apply to transfer somewhere else or scramble desperately for more money as soon as you get there. You won't even be able to truly enjoy your first (and likely last) year of college because you will be under such considerable stress. Last, having a $30,000 commitment on your credit report could impact your FICA score significantly and you might not be able to get MORE loans, and then you'll be in the position of (1) no college degree and no way to get to one, and (2) debt that you will be forced to try to repay at the average wage for a high school graduate, and (3) credit challenges - and inability to get more credit for the things you will need as your life progresses - such as a car, auto insurance, a home or even a place to rent, etc. </p>

<p>But just on its own, that is far too much debt for a student to take on - and - the school just simply isn't worth it, and, quite frankly Ashley, with what you've accomplished already for yourself in very trying circumstances tells me you're worth far more. NYU is of course a very nice college but there are so many other equally and even better colleges that have been recommended here, and where you will not need to take on this kind of meaningless debt. </p>

<p>Ashley, if you take on this debt, you will be crippling yourself for a very, very long time, and you haven't even had a chance yet. Please consider the first rule of holes: if you're in one, stop digging. </p>

<p>Many excellent suggestions are already in this thread and I cannot possibly improve on them, but I rush to urge you to not consider this loan. I strongly agree with whoever posted (Marite???) that this is a predatory lender.</p>

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<p>Can someone tell me where the "prestige" of NYU comes from? I understand Tisch and Stern, but when I was in school, NYU was a safety for those who couldn't get into City College or Brooklyn College or Queens College, and had some extra money and didn't want to go to Hofstra or SUNY Binghamton. Mostly populated by folks coming from Missouri and the like (I think that's still the case.) It's not like they have a raft of new programs or new buildings or attracted Nobel Prize winners to the faculty, or anything like that. They haven't had a decent basketball team since Barry Kramer and Happy Hairston. So what's it all about?</p>

50

<p>Mini, NYU is way over-rated, but it has improved since when you were young. What happened is that they engaged in massive fundraising and then used all funds to improve infrastructure and academics: more buildings, more equipment, more profs hired - all of which makes NYU very expensive to run. They also use merit aid to attract strong students and skimp on aid to the rest -- their entire fianancial aid system is leveraged, so that funding levels are based on perceived merit rather than the extent of actual need. And NYU also spends a lot of money on PR, which you know if your kid's name ever ended up on one of their mailing lists. </p>

<p>NYU has an excellent range of course offerings, so it can hold its own with any large research university -- but I do not think that it is better than any flagship state U. The irony in this case is that Ashley is a GSP admit -- NYU follows the practice of referring its less preferred applicants to the 2-year general studies program. As NYU has gotten more selective, the quality of students going into the GSP program has also risen -- a typical GSP'er probably would qualify for honors programs at most other universities. But that doesn't change the fact that GSP is a 2-year, general ed program which offers little leeway to its students in terms of electives and course selection. Among the NYU schools, GSP is on the low end for prestige. One more reason why it makes so little sense for Ashley to go into debt. </p>

<p>I agree with those who say that Ashley would be a candidate for a full merit scholarship at many colleges - if only we could all be advising her last September!! We would have collectively created a marvelous college list for her. Whoever allowed her to apply ED anywhere needs to have their head examined -- she has been hurt tremendously simply by being denied the array of choices she would otherwise have had. But unfortunately we can't go back and fix that now.</p>

51

<p>"Mini, NYU is way over-rated, but it has improved since when you were young."</p>

<p>But so has virtually every university I can name, beginning with the City University (formerly City College) Graduate Center. The Zicklin School of Business at Baruch is astounding! </p>

<p>There's a whole bunch of schools in this category that I can't figure out. Georgetown (for example) used to offer night-school courses to low-level diplomats, fired any faculty member who got a divorce, and then along came Patrick Ewing and you-know-who. Might be great today for all I know - but my question was where does the "prestige" come from, not how much money they spent on the place.</p>

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<p>Well, the prestige comes from the fact that they now have better facilities, higher-paid faculty with better credentials, and are much more selective in terms of which students they accept. Many schools have similarily improved... and others have faltered. For example, Antioch college used to be much more highly regarded than it is now -- for various reasons it has become weaker, with a much smaller enrollment, than it once was. Things change.</p>

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<p>I think a lot of the prestige is related to NYC being an amazing location (and Washington DC for Georgetown and Boston for BU). Sure the cost is greater, but its easy to forget that when you think about everything thats in those cities. So as more and more people apply and don't get in, the prestige goes up (along with improving other things).</p>

<p>I'm another Ashley here and also a hs senior and I also would advise you not to take the loan. I've been reading up on financial stuff and you really don't want that kind of debt on your shoulders. Try every option you can, looking for colleges with openings and money to spare (especially with your stats/circumstances) sounds like a good one. I hope everything works well for you. NYU looked good to me too but knowing their financial aid leads much to be desired kept me from realisitically looking at it. It's sad what's happpened but I'm sure you can find a college that you will enjoy and learn and grow from without having to worry about huge loans to pay for.</p>

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<p>Well, Marymount and Pace are also in NYC, and lack the prestige--so "amazing location" is only part of it. But the bottom line is that, with the exception of the top 5% of its applicant pool, NYU financial aid really sucks, and they package it in a very misleading way. So students who seriously need aid really should not apply there, unless they have the sort of stats that would put them in the running Presidential scholarships.</p>

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<p>Ashley, You've gotten some great advice here. Note that no one has urged you to take the loan! I will add to the chorus of folks advising you to forget about NYC for the moment. My husband and I lived in Manhattan for almost 2 years when our older son was very young, in heavily subsidized faculty housing. Even with two professional salaries, it was shockingly expensive to cover even the basics in NYC. Forget about attending the wonderful plays, ballets, operas, musicals, that may be part of what's attracting you to NY. Take a look at ticket prices. </p>

<p>My advice is the same as many others'. Call the schools (NYU and Ohio State?) to which you've already been admitted, and explain that your financial situation will be different next year once the SS funds disappear. I would imagine that most schools would be willing to re-calculate aid packages, and you don't want one that won't. What you're trying to do is extremely difficult and you need a supportive atmosphere. The unanimous opinion seems to be that NYU is heartless. I would also beat the bushes for good colleges that are still accepting applications and try to find one that can offer you an aid package. Your best option is to find a good school for September '06 that you can afford (meaning no or minimal debt). If you can't find a reasonable arrangement, I like the Americorps idea. You'll get out of your current bad situation, your expenses will be covered, you'll have an interesting and productive year, and you'll have the chance to start from scratch with the college application process. I agree with calmom that you should qualify for merit scholarships/honors colleges at many schools. I think that if you take a year to catch your breath and consider all the possibilities, you'll be in the position next spring of picking and choosing among several attractive (and low-cost) options.</p>

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<p>A couple of you have brought up things I've been thinking about this afternoon. What exactly is campusdoor, and why are they willing to loan an 18 year old large amounts of money with no cosigner? Is there a catch? Are they preditors?</p>

<p>Second, how does everyone feel about what NYU does? We all know Ashley is not alone. They encourage families making $25K and $50K to take out $120K loans! That is of course in addition to the student loans. While families certainly have options, it seems clear that kids/families who do not have financial backgrounds are much more likely to borrow this than many far more wealthy. Who goes to NYU, is it mostly the wealthy?</p>

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<p>In Pennsylvania, there's a for-profit college that is currently being sued for making it seem as though their degree is worth a lot (prestige, career placement, networking) and which encouraged its students to take out huge loans from shady operations. Students are discovering that they are $200,000 in debt by the time they leave and have no way to pay back the loans because employers don't respect the grads the way they were led to believe. As I've been reading the NYU stuff on CC over the past few months, I've concluded that NYU, while not as shady and certainly more prestigious, is playing a similar kind of game. They aren't doing anything illegal, but they are playing on students' hunger for the cachet of an NYU degree. Why else the GSP?</p>

<p>In answer to Mini's question about NYU and its relatively new-found prestige, I suspect it has less to do with its new facilities than the excellent reputation of the Tisch and Stern schools, both of which have produced notable alumni (although I can't name anyone off the top of my head!) The rest of the school has been brought along by those reputations. </p>

<p>NYU is overrated. It's a good but not great school. I wouldn't advise anyone to take out these kind of loans to attend MIT or Yale. Then again, someone in Ashley's position might actually be given reasonable aid to those schools if she had been accepted to them.</p>

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<p>Thanks for all the advice. </p>

<p>Right now here is what I have been thinking but I'm still not sure. </p>

<p>OSU (without room/board/books/etc) is 8,000. Ohio State University is a good school that would allow me to study what I want to with enough recognition from better schools that they should not be turned off when I apply as a transfer. I could cover that with government loans (5,000 then 4,000 unsub. due to denial of plus loan if needed) but that would leave me with some debt (that would NOT have been there had I planned to go OSU before. I would not be able to live on campus, which is the main problem. Now, I was going to look at the apartments down on campus that a lot of second, third and fourth year students choose. If I can find one that I part time job would allow, I could manage. This however, if very unlikely. I will still give it a chance though. </p>

<p>It just leaves me with, do I want to take out close to 10,000 of loans for a school that I don't even want to be at?</p>

<p>(I also don't know if this was mentioned but I did not get fin. aid from OSU because I did not submit my FAFSA with their code on it, on time due to my already planning on going to NYU. They gave me a trustees scholarship with left over money for 1000. That's it. They won't budge in the least which sucks because my school district gives out a 1500 grant each year as long as the school processes your fafsa. So what I'm getting at is I very well could have gone to OSU for free. My friend, with lower stats than I, is going to pay nothing and recieve personal expense money.)</p>

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<p>Ashley, are you talking about taking out $10,000 in loans in ADDITION to the subsidized loan plus unsubsidized student loan that OSU will give you?</p>

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<p>I am going to go out on a bit of a limb here and suggest one of the great bargains; the Harvard Extension School. The courses are often taught by the same professors that teach during the day. Classes are held at night right on Harvard's campus. It will cost you around 2k per semester for a full course load, but of course you could take less and work more. Finding a job is pretty easy and shared housing in Cambridge/Somerville could be had for around 500 per month. Plus, Boston/Cambridge is a great college town.</p>