<p>Flagship is UVA.The schools were not ivy but rather top 20 schools with lower admit rates than UVA. Student was in top 3 of class at competitive HS. It happens.</p>
<p>Miami, I am very happy for your D, but one of the points made in this thread is that not every student with high stats gets merit aid. D’s stats far exceeded the middle range for admitted students at her school and she got nothing. I am OK with that because others need it more, but I am just saying…</p>
<p>As for the statement made to me regarding finances, it was unsolicited.</p>
<p>*And my parents are very bright, well-educated people who had just always heard the myth that money will, somehow, be out there for “good kids.” *</p>
<p>The problem is that many don’t understand that merit money is only offered at some schools. And some of those schools only “pick and choose” are few from a pool of qualified students. </p>
<p>Maybe if GCs handed out lists of schools that do NOT give ANY merit money, parents would get clued in.</p>
<p>Top student to me means #1, the one at the top. I am sorry, if I misunderstood, D’s school did not rank, we knew her rank based on her GPA and class profile, they used “top student” label at graudation when she got awards. They did not use label “valedictorian” or any other either. Couple top kids from her school go to Ivy every year. D. went to state because of trmendous opportunities (in addition to $$). It is amazing that #1 would not get into State Flagships. But times are changing, D. has graduated 3 years ago.</p>
<p>I use the term “top student” to refer to the top 10. Our local public schools are competitive, have large classes and the class ranks come down to 1/100th of a point. So not a lot of difference between them. </p>
<p>robin is correct, UVA and Wm. & Mary are not shoo ins, even for top students.</p>
<p>It’s amazing how bad of a job so many GCs do to educate both parents and students about merit schools and FA-only schools.</p>
<p>The GCs in our area (from both private and public high schools) attend monthly meetings where they exchange info to share with their students/parents and to post on their GC websites.</p>
<p>“It’s amazing how bad of a job so many GCs do to educate both parents and students about merit schools and FA-only schools.”</p>
<p>I have pointed out before, do not rely on anybody, do your own research. All councelors are interested to put a kid in the most competitive college, because it reflects on councelor’s “good job”. Keep that in mind and the same goes when they transition from UG to Grad. school. You will be paying, not councelors. They are not bad, they have different goals from your goal. It is very evident at every level.</p>
<p>Re “top student”: In any case, status of valedictorian is no guarantee of admission to an Ivy or to a flagship university in many states. Admissions can be very competitive and there are a variety of reasons a top-ranked student at a high school might not get into their particular state’s top university. At least here in California, I think most UC applicants check one or more of the less-selective campuses as a backup.</p>
<p>calmom said: “status of valedictorian is no guarantee of admission to an Ivy or to a flagship university in many states.”</p>
<p>e.g., Brown rejects 3/4 of valedictorians, 3/4 of those scoring 800 on verbal SAT, 80% of those scoring 800 on Math; Princeton rejects 3/4 of those with SATs in the 2300 - 2400 range</p>
<p>I guess a top student would need to apply to four schools like Brown then.</p>
<p>How about having 10 APs?</p>
<p>Niece was salutorian, had high though not perfect SATs and 9 or 10 APs and got in. A coworkers son wasn’t even in the top ten at his high-school and got in without a lot of APs. Maybe there is a large element of crapshoot in admissions.</p>
<p>Totally agree with Calmom. The admissions to the UC’s this year were brutal. I have three children and my youngest was applying this year. This was by far the most difficult year to gain admission to the UC’s. Even though my son was class rank #1, National AP Scholar with 14 AP’s, scored a 35 on his ACT, CSF/NHS member, 4 year Varsity tennis player (two time captain with many honors) and was a nationally ranked tennis player, he put UCSB on his application just in case. He did get accepted to UCSD, UCLA and UCB but he was waitlisted at MIT and Columbia. He will be going to Berkeley. That being said, I don’t think anyone can make any sense out of admission decisions. I just told all my kids to just be themselves on the applications and that they would end up where they were supposed to end up. The bottom line is the top kids in California can no longer assume they will be accepted into UCB or UCLA. Everyone should have at least one safety school on their list, especially in these current times.</p>