<p>Yes, most colleges in eastern PA. are full of students from New Jersey. Penn State main campus is now 1/3 out of state, and many of those students are from New Jersey. Even some of the lesser known PA. public colleges (such as Bloomsburg) are full of students from New Jersey. At Villanova, the parking lots are full of NJ plates.</p>
<p>My understanding is that you can only use NJ state college grants within New Jersey. A number of other states do allow their grants to be used elsewhere, although sometimes the amount is greatly reduced. PA. will not allow their state college grants to be used in NJ because NJ will not allow NJ grants to be used in PA.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, one of the best public colleges in NJ, the College of New Jersey, is 97% New Jersey residents.</p>
<p>Tens of thousands of New Jersey residents moved into eastern PA over the last couple decades, fleeing high taxes and absurd housing prices. Many continued to commute long dstances to higher paying jobs in NJ.</p>
<p>I gave the tuition plus R&B numbers because estimates of other expenses by schools can vary widely. My numbers are more comparable. They are the base costs.</p>
<p>In both schools, add about $5,000 to $6,000 for the other costs, though travel costs for a California resident to Wisconsin will likely be higher.</p>
<p>Regarding the ongoing expansion of the Big Ten. Nice to have something so desireable- but it’s too bad everyone wants to get in on it and does so through athletics. Until recently I never knew it was about the superior academic possibilities, not the superior sports. This has destroyed the college rivalries and distorted the football season- lost regional flavor.</p>
<p>At UW-Madison had a NJ college friend and one from WI who ended up in NJ. Totally different perspective- WI HS students typically look no further than the flagship, unlike those from NJ, then and now. Location in the Midwest versus the heavily populated NE with very small states. I guess there are advantages to living away from the epicenter of the US (based on the huge numbers populating the east coast).</p>
<p>There are three basic reasons, I think, having lived here all my life (and, yes, I went to UG and grad school out-of-state).</p>
<ol>
<li><p>NJ is an affluent state; lots of people can afford to go elsewhere.</p></li>
<li><p>NJ offers no bargains for college – even a state directional costs $25,000 per year for an in-state kid, living on campus. Aid does not abound. Being an out-of-stater in some other places is cheaper than being an in-stater in NJ. NY and PA directionals are often at parity. Admissions standards are a related concern. Kids at the lower end of the academic spectrum, seeking for four-year residential schools, might more readily gain admission out of state, whether it’s public or private. This is particularly true if they’re seeking suburban or rural surroundings. And the urban experience in NJ . . . even those who prefer an urban campus might not wish to be in Newark or Camden. Most people who want cities, want restaurants, museums, the arts, which are limited in our cities. Newark has more to offer along those lines than people may realize, but it can’t realistically compete with Boston or DC or Chicago.</p></li>
<li><p>People here have some sort of a state inferiority complex, or (stated more positively) a level of exposure and sophistication derived from their proximity to NYC and Phila (along with Boston and DC, for that matter). They often have a level of experience with travel. So they do not tend to grow up with a strong emotional assumption that their home state is best. They’re not provincial about it. They seem willing to explore, to venture elsewhere.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>We were not anti-Jersey when we started looking for each of our kids. We have a decent private about an hour from us that we thought for sure our D would choose for many reasons. When we did an official tour (we already were very familiar with the campus, but wanted to hear about it from admissions’ point of view), D (and we) were completely turned off because of the attitudes of the administrators who addressed us, the tour guide, and some of the other people (parents) on the tour. There was a totally different culture than we expected. D did not even apply. She had no desire to even look at the state schools as she had a lot of experience dealing with a few of them through a program she had been in and was tired of the bureaucracy. She chose an out of state private that gave her enough money to make it competitive with our state schools. Plus she had a NJ scholarship that had to stay in NJ. She explained that to her choice school, and they matched it with their own funds.</p>
<p>S did choose to look at a state school that had a very good reputation for the program he was considering at the time. We went to the open house, got a look at their equipment, and immediately after he said no and never applied. He said the equipment was quite old and out of date - the equipment in his HS was far more current than that at this university. He was also going to look at a NJ private, but when I called to set up a visit, the admissions person was so rude to me on the phone that I never called back. I had apparently asked to visit on their new freshmen acceptance day of which I had no knowledge and she went off on me. S also chose an out of state private.</p>
<p>So for us it had nothing to do with them wanting to get out of NJ. Our family has lived here all our lives. Both would have willingly stayed if there was a NJ school that worked for them. But I am glad they went out of state. It has given them a different perspective.</p>
<p>I tried to get my D to go out of state, I thought as an only child she needed to get away. She was accepted at every school she applied but I could not convince her (or her mother) that she should go away to school. She did enjoy her 4 years and has landed a nice job so it worked out. She has said looking back she should have gone away. My D was a good student but her SAT’s were average by CC standard she had 1800 basically 600 on every section so the top schools were out but her scores and grades got her into almost every other school around. There was no money coming though. 4 years at a NJ school living on campus was $100k and we found many other schools that we could be oos and face the same cost. She applied to several publics in NC and was accepted and the cost would have been close. Not NC-CH but NC- Asheville and NC-Wilmington, she also looked at some of the western schools Montana for example. There are plenty of oos schools a NJ kid could go to for a very similar cost.</p>
<p>any kid from nyc or nj (entire state) would benefit greatly from going to school in the south or midwest. you can always go home when you graduate but, most of the kids that leave for college will realize the world does not revolve around them and will find themselves happier some place else be it winston salem, des moines , indianapolis, or austin…</p>
<p>Why would you say this? There are many parts of the south and midwest that do not offer anything close to the economic opportunities, cultural amenities, or socioeconomic/ethnic diversity of NYC and NJ. Would there be some kids for whom going to a different region of the country is a good idea and would open up new horizons? Of course. But “any” kid?</p>
<p>I agree with Fieldsports’ comment. NJ public higher education is no bargain, and there is so much institutional competition within the region (both private and public) that NJ kids have little reason not to consider out-of-state options.</p>
<p>@NJSue: If you had gone to college outside NYC or NJ, you would realize the many other parts of the country do offer all the amenities and opportunities available in your narrowly defind NYC/NJ world.</p>
<p>Having grown up in NJ, and fled for out of state schools it felt like there really was no option for instate for me, nor did I want to stay in state. I wasn’t getting into Princeton and sorry, Rutgers to me looked like a dump. This was the mid-80’s - maybe it’s gotten better.</p>
<p>My parents wanted me to explore a different culture, and I worked really hard at losing that accent over the years! Except when I’m there for awhile, you wouldn’t hear my accent now.</p>
<p>I go back now and I can’t imagine between the taxes, the overcrowding that I would ever want to live there again. I’m guessing I’m not the only one. </p>
<p>I get amused though when talking to friends of my family how they’re of the mindset that nothing good really exists outside their little world. They actually told me they heard there were good schools outside the tri state area, though they all agreed there was no better medical care - lol.</p>
<p>re post #49- economics, culture, diversity. </p>
<p>Students from the NYC area need to discover there is a lot of life away from their area- and it can be BETTER than what is in NYC. It is provincial to think that other areas can’t offer something NYC does. Obviously experiencing a different lifestyle is an education in itself. Most people can visit the big city for the times they want to see specific museums and events. On a day to day basis so many colleges offer so much more there is no need to leave campus to fill one’s days, including weekends. NYC is a nice place to visit, but I certainly would not want to live there, even to attend college.</p>
<p>Some of it could just be a combination of anything-but-local colleges and a need to get away.</p>
<p>Understandable considering that was the prevailing mentality at my NYC urban public magnet in the early-mid '90s. </p>
<p>Few people wanted to stay in the same city unless it was Columbia…and even then, it was considered a safety by many in the top 15-25%. </p>
<p>SUNYs weren’t considered very highly and the CUNYs were to be avoided at all costs back in the early - mid-'90s as they were perceived as being academically marginal to subpar considering the high numbers of remedial students in the 4-year colleges and the institutional prioritization favoring them back then. </p>
<p>Some HS classmates who went to CUNYs for financial or academic reasons(really low GPA) ended up transferring up to more elite private colleges including Columbia after 1-2 years because they needed a more rigorous academic climate. </p>
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<p>Depends on which part of the US and which type of student. For instance, in the part of the Midwest where I attended college…while the academics were great…the drive-by racist epithets/threats I experienced from local ne’er do wells, being harassed in public for speaking a foreign language by the same types, sexist drive-by catcalls I saw my female classmates received from…you guessed it, and frequency of DWB traffic stops a few African-American/Latino classmates experienced was such that I am understanding and even sympathetic if some from the urban NE or the West Coast are leery of ever going back to NE Ohio. </p>
<p>Have several racial minority friends who aren’t going to be heading back to mostly White rural areas of the US…especially in the midwest and south after their dubious experiences which include a former supervisor/friend who had to flee from a rural Georgian gas station because of a “Good ole’ boy” who pointed a shotgun at him and said “Lookee here, Chinese food!” in a threatening manner. Local cops just didn’t seem that interested in dealing with the matter…even in the mid-'90s.</p>
<p>I just wanted to point out that not all of NJ is like the urban/suburban areas. There are still some beautiful, less crowded regions, which is where we live now. Dairy, horse and Christmas tree farms are still numerous. Yes, auto insurance rates are high and our property taxes are high (although the property taxes where we live are not as high as those in suburban areas). But within an hour and a half drive, we can be in NYC, at the Jersey shore, at a ski resort, or even more rural PA. And we don’t have the massive traffic problems as in the more populated areas. Depending on the day, I can go 5 miles before passing another car.</p>
<p>On my way home from work my route takes me up one side of a hill to a breathtaking view of the valley below with its farms and wooded areas. It always reminds me how much I like living where we do.</p>
<p>We moved here from a very crowded NJ county and have no desire to move back to that area. If all of NJ was like that, we would have left. But there are still some very nice parts of NJ.</p>
<p>I did. I was born in Missouri, raised in Minnesota, and went to college in Massachusetts. I was responding to the fairly silly notion that every kid in NYC/NJ would benefit from leaving the area. Clearly not the case. I am against regional provincialism in all its forms.</p>
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<p>Not sure they NEED to discover this any more than students from any other region. Why is it more important for students from one region to discover life away than it is for students of another region? I knew plenty of people growing up who believed there was no oxygen east of Chicago.</p>
<p>*Quote: Originally Posted by barrons
I gave the tuition plus R&B numbers because estimates of other expenses by schools can vary widely. My numbers are more comparable. They are the base costs.
*</p>
<p>That does make sense even if it’s not a perfect scenario. when looking at COAs of various schools, some hardly put anything for transportation and personal expenses, while other schools will put several thousand. For a student coming from OOS, having a COA list $300 for transportation is ridiculous. And only the most thrifty student only spends a few hundred per year on personal expenses.</p>
<p>That said, some schools (like my kids’ undergrad) include the R&B cost for the most expensive dorm and most expensive meal plan in its COA (for borrowing purposes), but that can scare away a budget-worried student or parent.</p>
<p>Wow. Lots of generalizations here. Not sure if anyone has been to the Rutgers campuses lately, but you will find on the 2 New Bruswick campuses look like typical college campus w academic buildings around a quad (College Ave) and a farm (Cook) with the largest goat herd in NJ (120+), over 30 horses, lots of cows, sheep, pigs & chickens. The Cook Campus has a surprisingly rural setting tucked between Rts 1 & 18. </p>
<p>Yes, the in-state COA is high, but it has a great reputation for many majors, including pharmacy, engineering, business, agricultural sciences and sociology. I’m not sure I would suggest students who is undecided and leaning towards liberal arts to go there.</p>
<p>In response to a comment above, I’ve mainly seen colleges list the cost of their freshman dorms in the cost of attendance. The problem arises if: a) the college doesn’t have much housing for upper classmen, and the off-campus housing is very expensive, or b) the upper class on-campus housing is much more expensive than the freshman housing. I know of one public college where the freshman housing is $5k a year, but the upper class housing is $9K a year per student for a double and doesn’t even include a kitchen. </p>
<p>If you have a kitchen and are willing to cook, a student can save a couple thousand a year.</p>
<p>Rutgers is a fine school but more kids from NJ would rather go to another State U than can be said of kids from other States and their State University. There are a number of reasons for that.</p>