If you want a top job, go to HYPS & Wharton. Not MIT or a lower Ivy

College Search & Selection
1

<p>So says the following new research paper. {Please note, I'm not saying that I agree.}</p>

<p>
[quote]
If you want to get a job at the very best law firm, investment bank, or consultancy, here’s what you do:</p>

<ol>
<li>Go to Harvard, Yale, Princeton, or (maybe) Stanford. If you’re a business student, attending the Wharton School at the University of Pennsylvania will work, too, but don’t show up with a diploma from Dartmouth or MIT. No one cares about those places...</li>
</ol>

<p>What’s surprising isn’t that students from elite universities have a leg up; it’s that students from other colleges don’t have a chance, even if those colleges are what the rest of us might consider elite. Here’s what a top consultant had to say about M.I.T.:</p>

<pre><code>You will find it when you go to like career fairs or something and you know someone will show up and say, you know, “Hey, I didn’t go to HBS [Harvard Business School] but, you know, I am an engineer at M.I.T. and I heard about this fair and I wanted to come meet you in New York.” God bless him for the effort but, you know, it’s just not going to work.
</code></pre>

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[/quote]
</p>

<p>Brown</a> and Cornell are Second Tier - Percolator - The Chronicle of Higher Education</p>

<p>
[quote]
According to a forthcoming paper written by Northwestern assistant professor Lauren Rivera, recruiters at top law firms, consulting agencies and investment banks are interested only in students who attended Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Stanford and the Wharton School Business at the University of Pennsylvania. Columbia grads might make the cut, but some recruiters told Rivera that they consider the school to be "second-tier" or "just okay," the Chronicle of Higher Education reports.</p>

<p>And MIT grads don't stand a chance

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Memo</a> To Brown, Cornell And MIT Grads: You're Not Good Enough</p>

2

<p>sakky, already being discussed here:
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/1068825-brown-cornell-second-tier.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/1068825-brown-cornell-second-tier.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

3

<p>Ah yes. How did I miss that?</p>

4

<p>Hahaha. Tell that to my Cornell grad D2 working as a first yr analyst at a top BB ( after two summer internships at top BB’s) and her two Cornell roommates also working in Investment Banking at top BBs.</p>

5

<p>^ I am so sorry…</p>

6

<p>^And why is that??</p>

7

<p>Eh, I’m one of those kids who still deludes himself into believing he’ll be somebody when he grows up.</p>

8

<p>This is hilariously false. Top BB definitely recruit at other schools–even non-ivies. And not in something like “operations” but in IBD (Investment Banking Department). Firms like Goldman Sachs, Deutsche Bank, UBS, etc.</p>

<p>I have actually seen this first hand for recruiting this year.</p>

9

<p>Good thing I never once considered working for any of those companies.</p>

<p>My office is next door to a glacier. Sure beats some random skyscraper cubicle.</p>

<p>“Top job” is in the eye of the beholder.</p>

10

<p>I’m sure Dartmouth, Caltech and Harvey Mudd grads couldn’t care less. After all, according to Forbes’ payscale, their grads make more than what HYPS+W grads make, on average.</p>

11

<p>In addition, that article didn’t separate undergrad from grad programs. It shifted between the two.</p>

12

<p>Utter nonsense. Fifteen percent of Princeton’s incoming class are athletes. Lower SAT scores and gpas. They would never have gained admission to the university based on academics. Athlete in, Athlete out. Most of those athletes major in business. It is questionable whether they are the brightest minds.</p>

13

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<p>But nobody is talking about the ‘average’. The research paper explicitly mentions that not all HYPS+W grads will obtain top job offers. </p>

<p>The question at hand is who do the most elite consulting and banking firms prefer to hire? With regards to Caltech and Mudd, those are precisely the types of jobs that tempt away even the best students from engineering/science. For example, before the crash, nearly half of all MIT students who entered the workforce took jobs not in engineering/science but rather in consulting or finance.</p>

14

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<p>But that’s actually the point: those firms are not looking for the brightest minds, and in fact were explicitly found to give strong preference to athletes who at least had some modicum of intelligence. Hence, Princeton having a strong concentration of athletes only adds to its recruitment desirability.</p>

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<p>Yes, the paper explicitly states that those firms heavily recruit at Stanford, which is not an Ivy. </p>

<p>But more to your point, nobody has ever argued that recruitment is deterministically restricted to only the very top schools. In fact, the paper explicitly states that some people from other schools will be hired, and indeed, elaborates on strategies on how such students could maximize their chances. The paper is regarding which schools are more heavily recruited, from a probabilistic standpoint.</p>

15

<p>Duke, Dartmouth, Notre Dame, Willams, Colgate, Holy Cross do extremely well in the business community(CEO’s) and on Wall Street.</p>

16

<p>why are we discussing this? How hard is it to look at he 1st year Associates at BB banks and see that over 50% (or whatever the actual number is) did not come from HYPS+Wharton?</p>

17

<p>

I can confirm the athlete part… just don’t know exactly how intelligent my Northwestern recruited athlete relative is – who was hired last year at GS.</p>

<p>I have read about the Athlete/BB thing for 30+ years, the first time I believe it was in the book about how Sandy Weill brought American Express and Shearson together, and one member of the deal team had been a collegiate wrestler… and how that wrestling tenacity and endurance had proved itself in round the clock negotiations. </p>

<p>It makes sense. Anybody who can bang out mostly A grades in a top 20 University while devoting approx. 30 hours/wk to their sport for six months during the school year must have a lot in reserve – physically, emotionally, and intellectually. Those reserves are drawn upon often in very demanding jobs.</p>

18

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<p>Yes; but the point still stands. What is there to worry about if you graduate from say, Dartmouth College, and (allegedly) won’t get the top jobs that are only reserved for HYPS+W grads when you will still get a great job after college and make as much, or maybe even more?</p>

19

<p>What elite job in finance can you get from being an undergrad at Yale that you cannot get from being an undergrad at Dartmouth or Columbia or MIT? Name one.</p>

20

<p>^ I know you’re a Columbia grad, IvyPBear, and I don’t want to get personal with you. lol… But quite honestly, I’m kind of have double thoughts about Columbia being a “super elite” school as the data have shown that their grads aren’t comparable to Dartmouth’s. Based on data, it appears that it’s Dartmouth that is “super elite” and is the one that’s competing with Harvard, Princeton and Wharton, not Columbia. I’m not siding Dartmouth here, but it really does have a spectacular record. So, if you’ve set your sight on joining in a BB after college, Dartmouth should be super high up there in your list. It’s even better than Yale, based on data.</p>