Is Brown worth massive debt?

Colleges and Universities A-Z Brown University
1

Hi! I’m having a serious struggle deciding which university to attend next year. I was accepted to Brown (my dream), but didn’t get the financial aid I was expecting, even after appealing. My parents are willing to pay $20,000 a year for my college education, and they’re allowing me to borrow the rest from them, interest-free. Even so, I don’t know if the debt would be worth it, especially for an undergraduate degree. I didn’t apply to many schools with merit scholarships (I didn’t think I would have to), so in the past few weeks, I’ve been desperately applying to schools with rolling admissions and merit aid.

I’ve narrowed my options down to the following four schools. The price next to each school is the amount I would owe my parents after four years.

Brown University - $167,352
Dickinson College - $101,472
Western New England University - $45,576
University of New Haven - $40,680

What would you do in this situation? Is Brown worth being $167k in debt?
Does anyone have any insight into WNE or UNH? What I know about them is pretty much limited to the few forums I’ve seen online and their websites. (I live overseas, so I don’t have the option to visit the campuses.)

Thanks in advance!

2

I can’t tell you much about the schools, but I can tell you that you probably know the answer to your question. Brown is not worth that level of debt. I have never visited University of New Haven, but my nephew got a mechanical engineering degree there. The proximity to a company between New Haven and NYC nearby resulted in a really good internship with the company, funding by the same company to complete his senior capstone project, and a job when he graduated. He had to borrow 65,000 to do it, and complained about the loan repayment, but by living frugally, putting all bonuses toward the loans, he has them mostly paid off at 30. 167,000 dollars is a heck of a lot of money.

3

So, is it fair to guess that there are underlying dynamics here? $20K/pa is less than 1/2 the COA for even your least expensive schools (and btw, how did you come up with that list?!).

Brown only gives need-based aid, and apparently they have decided that your family can afford to spend $60K/pa (out of a COA of $70K) on your education. Your parents seem to agree: they are willing to spend the $60K/pa- but only if you repay them for 2/3 of that amount.

If they have the money to spend, are they are using the allocation to try and direct you to a particular path? (as in, 'you can make a choice we don’t like, but it will cost you). Do they have a belief that you should have ‘skin in the game’? Do they have outdated ideas of how much college costs & students can earn? Did they establish a budget and expect you (and perhaps siblings?) to stay within it? It just feels as if there is more to the story.

Have you considered taking a gap year, working or doing something productive and re-applying to more in-between colleges? Being $167K in debt - even interest free, even to your parents- is not a great plan (unless irl they will forgive the debt?).

4

Correct me if I’m wrong, but you’d be in debt to your parents, right? It’s very different from a bank loan - parents can be flexible for more than six months or if there’s a career bump, you can change the terms of payment up or down easily (like, if you want to pay more because you got a nice salary but then your car breaks down and you need a new one so you ask for lighter monthly payments for a few months, etc). Plus, there’s no interest and they’re not going to seize your house, computer, car… etc. Obviously you need to commit to paying them back but I’d pick Brown or Dickinson.

5

I’d consider Dickinson since loan is from parents. I don’t imagine you will get the experience you want at New Haven or Western New England. I feel like those might be really isolating for an international student

6

@collegemom3717
Let me try to explain the big picture. My mom never went to college. My dad went to his state school and was the first person in his family to get a degree. He had to pay his way through, so I think that’s why he wants us (my brother and I) to do so as well. Until three years ago, my parents always said that they would not pay any of our college tuition. When they finally told us that they would pay $20,000 a year, I was genuinely shocked.

My dad does have a good job. I’ve never worried about money in my life. That said, we do have numerous expenses and a mortgage we’re paying. They can, theoretically, pay the $60,000 that Brown believes they can pay, but it would take most of the money out of their savings.

They keep saying that “I can do whatever I want to do.” They’re not trying to direct me to a particular path. They just don’t want to pay more than $20,000 a year for my education. Yes, I do think that they have outdates ideas of how much college costs, but that’s not going to change their opinion. My mom is Portuguese, so I also have EU citizenship. They keep saying that I do have a cheaper option (European universities), but I don’t know what I want to study and want to experience the whole American campus vibe.

They will not forgive the debt, but they will change their will (just in case I can’t repay it before they die).

7

Even if the money is from your parents, that’s just too much debt hanging over your head, and your parents would be emptying their own savings to make the loan. A gap year is needed here, imo. The other options aren’t good.

8

@collegemom3717
As for how I came up with this list, that’s another story.

I originally applied to Brown, Yale, Haverford, Dickinson, Tufts, and University of Virginia. I was only rejected from Yale. The rest gave me minimal aid. I chose to keep Brown on my list because it’s my dream, and I kept Dickinson because it’s the cheapest of the bunch. (I didn’t apply to many other schools because my FAFSA EFC gave me good estimations…)

A few weeks ago I applied to all of the schools in the Northeast with rolling admissions, between 3,000 and 10,000 students, and no religious affiliation. WNE and NHU gave me the best aid and had the least bad reviews.

9

@MYOS1634
Thank you for your comment. Yes, I would be paying back my parents. I know that’s very different from paying back a bank, but I’m still worried that the debt will be a lot. I would be using almost all of my parent’s savings, so most of their retirement plans of traveling and renovating our house would be … put on hold. Also, regardless of who it is to, I feel that $100-$167k of debt is a lot for a 22-year-old fresh out of college. But yes, I am very fortunate that my parents are letting me borrow it from them.

If I were to go to either Brown or Dickinson, I feel that I’d choose Dickinson (it’s much cheaper). That said, I don’t know if Dickinson is worth $55k more than WNE.

10

@Booajo Can you tell me more about WNE and NH? Why do you feel they are isolating?

Also, I’m not an international student – I’m an American whose parent works for the US government. I’ve been moving around my entire life (only lived in the US as a baby). That said, yes, I am afraid of an isolating campus, but I am wondering why you said WNE and NH are isolating

11

So if you got into Brown, your stats are good, right? Have you considered any of the auto-stats schools that are still accepting applications?

Are you a National Merit Finalist? Bama offers a full ride if so, as do several other schools.

12

@itsgettingreal17
Although I agree with you, I don’t know what I would do with my gap year. No job would pay me enough to afford any of these universities.

Also, my family moves around a lot. Next year, they’re moving to Cairo, Egypt. If I were to take a gap year, I would be expected to move there with them. I don’t know anyone in Egypt, and it’s not the safest place to be, so I don’t think I’d have a great year.

They don’t feel comfortable with me moving to the US and beginning to work because they think that I will never go to university if I get a job. I’m also not close with any family in the States, so I’d have to move somewhere new completely on my own.

Community college is an option. What do you think?

13

@DiotimaDM Yes, my stats are fairly good, but I’m not a National Merit Finalist.

I did apply to most of the schools that are still accepting. That’s where I got WNE and UNH. Problem is, most schools that are still accepting have already given away most of their merit scholarship money…

14

Yes Dickinson is worth 55k more than WNE. It’s an excellent college.

Do your parents have the money they’d loan you or would their savings account?

You still have time to apply to UArizona and UNM and you’d get a lot of money from them.

In about 2 weeks there’ll be a list of colleges that miscalculated yield and most offer financial aid so deposit somewhere and don’t lose hope. Since your stats are good enough for Brown or Dickinson you may get sufficient merit from one of the top colleges from that list.

NE and NHU aren’t worth it, you’d be better off taking a gap year and recalibrating your list.
Look up a thread here titled “I messed up”. At re end of March, the poster realized he had ended up with unaffordable colleges plus one unsuitable, 4th tier college that barely was affordable. You can read what happens as it happens. It’s many people’s favorite thread.

A gap year wouldn’t be about earning the missing tuition but rather drafting a new list based on earning a lot of merit money.

15

Would you consider UA-Hunstville or UA-Birmingham? Both are still accepting applications. They’re not in the NE, and they’re larger than your stated target size.

What majors are you interested in? Is grad school a possibility?

http://automaticfulltuition.yolasite.com/ This list is a little old, so you’d have to double check the various offers on the schools’ websites.

There have been cases where a student is admitted to UAH or UAB with merit, and then Bama matches the offer, sometimes even after the deadlines have passed.

I realize this is a big deviation from your original search, and maybe it’s not what you’re looking for. If so, no prob.

On the other hand, you still have a shot at big merit money. The applications are very fast and easy to do.

If you think you might be interested in Bama, we can send up the Bat signal for the member who knows if / how to make it happen. For UAH and UAB, there’s still time to apply if you do it right away.

University of Alabama
Application Deadline: December 1st
Award: Full Tuition
Out-of-State Requirements: 3.5 GPA, 32 ACT or 1400 SAT (CR+M)
In-State Requirements: 3.5 GPA, 30 ACT or 1330 SAT (CR+M)
Out-of-State Scholarships - Undergraduate Scholarships - The University of Alabama
In-State Scholarships - Undergraduate Scholarships - The University of Alabama
Award: Full Tuition + $2,500/year
Requirements (Eng/CS Only): 3.5 GPA, ACT 30 or 1330 SAT (CR+M)
Scholarships - Undergraduate Students - The College of Engineering - The University of Alabama

University of Alabama-Huntsville
Application Deadline: June 1st
Award: Full Tuition + Housing
Requirements: 4.0 GPA, 34 ACT or 1490 SAT (CR+M)
Award: Full Tuition
Requirements: 3.5 GPA, 30 ACT or 1330 SAT (CR+M)
http://www.uah.edu/admissions/undergraduate/financial-aid/scholarships/merit-tuition-scholarships

University of Alabama-Birmingham
Application Deadline: May 1st (December ACT/SAT)
Award: $15,000/year (Full tuition for up to 25 credits per year)
Requirements: 3.5 GPA, 30 ACT or 1330 SAT (CR+M)
http://www.uab.edu/students/paying-for-uab/scholarships/item/570-act-gpa-based-scholarships

16

Are you “in state” for any colleges? Your parents 20k plus the federal student loans would just about pay for most in-state schools and many of them are excellent.

17

@danisonder Hey, I am sorry about your parents. Some parents are like that. Have you considered telling them to consider part of the debt as your early inheritance?

18

@jerrythemoose I don’t know, I’m actually very thankful for what they’re doing. $20,000 a year isn’t anywhere near the amount that I need, but it is still a lot of money. Also, they’re letting me loan the remaining money from them, interest-free. I’d say that’s very generous on their part.

Yeah, they told me that they will change their will, just in case I can’t afford to pay them back. In a way, this would be a form of early inheritance.

19

@gallentjill

My family is legally from Florida, but I’ve never lived there and have no interest of being there. Most schools in Florida are huge, and I’m not all about that life. (Yes, I am way too picky considering the situation I’m in.)

My brother attends the University of South Florida, and since we own no property in Florida, they said that he doesn’t qualify for in-state tuition. I fear I will meet the same fate

20

Re: UNM - they would waive OOS tuition for you, and they are still accepting applications. If you’re full pay with no federal need-based aid, the COA is around $20k/year. Good honors college (top 25 in the nation), good engineering, good for premed, good for film.