<p>Hello all:
My D is considering Carleton College. What is frustrating is that very few people out here in the New England area, have heard of Carleton. My question to you all, is: Is it really good as far as academic reputation and rigor go, and to get an idea, what does it compare to, as far as both LACs and national universities are considered?
Thanks.</p>
<p>“Really good” is a very vague description, but I’ll answer - yes. I am from New England, and while it’s frustrating that very few people in the area have heard of Carleton, that’s more a factor of regional knowledge than anything else. As far as LACs go, I feel like the average midwesterner hasn’t heard of Amherst, Williams, or Middlebury - it’s all about perspective.</p>
<p>I have found it fairly rigorous and the workload can be very demanding. I was a very good student in high school, and I’ve managed to do well here, but it hasn’t been easy. People here are very smart, and it takes a lot of people time to get used to the fact that they are no longer the smartest kid in the room. It may not be as well known in New England, but most LACs are not well-known to the average individual outside of their respective regions. The people who count - grad schools, employers, etc. - will know about Carleton, and will understand how rigorous.</p>
<p>I believe that the atmosphere is somewhat different at Carleton when compared to schools such as Williams or Bowdoin - different campus, different climate, etc. - but the academic experience will be extraordinarily similar at both. I chose Carleton over many other schools, both LACs and larger universities, some of them ranked slightly higher and most of them on the East Coast. I have never regretted my decision and I feel like I am getting a quality education in an environment I enjoy.</p>
<p>If you care about rankings, it’s a top 10 LAC. That seems pretty good to me!</p>
<p>[Carleton</a> College | Best College | US News](<a href=“http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/carleton-college-2340]Carleton”>http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/carleton-college-2340)</p>
<p>As a Carleton grad I would say so. Yes, it is demanding, and it is well thought by academics if your D is considering grad school. That being said, one of the most frustrating things about going to Carleton as a New Englander is that it can make the job search a little tough when everyone on both coasts seems to have never heard of Carleton. It doesn’t have the kind of name “pop” that Amherst or Williams have out here. Although, I would be very surprised if either Amherst or Williams offered a better education. The professors are great and accessible and they expect a lot of their students. Not to mention comps (Senior Project) can be a really nice feather in your cap. </p>
<p>On an aside, I miss Carleton terribly. It is a beautiful little school and a great environment. Not to mention the safe, but reasonably sized town it sits in.</p>
<p>What kind of a question is this?</p>
<p>Yes, the academics are excellent. 8th in the nation, or maybe you didn’t know. You might get some blank stares from pretentious socialites when the name comes up, but if you value that kind of stuff, don’t go to Carleton. The people who matter (grad schools, employers) know how strong a Carleton education is.</p>
<p>I am sorry if I have ruffled a few feathers. The rankings may be a good guide but it does not tell the real story. The best answer I got from a few non-pretentious friends about Carleton was, ‘Carleton! great frisbee culture’. I know it is a matter of perspective because when I mentioned Carleton to a relative living in North Dakota, his response was ‘Harvard of the Midwest. Great college’.<br>
I hope you understand my confusion.
Thanks.</p>
<p>These two linked reports show that Carleton has been a great source of future PhDs, especially in the sciences and history. This is one of the few ways I am aware of to measure “how good” Carleton is “as far as academics go.”</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.nsf.gov/statistics/nsf96334/tables/tab8.xls[/url]”>http://www.nsf.gov/statistics/nsf96334/tables/tab8.xls</a>
[REED</a> COLLEGE PHD PRODUCTIVITY](<a href=“http://www.reed.edu/ir/phd.html]REED”>Doctoral Degree Productivity - Institutional Research - Reed College)</p>
<p>This source has additional supporting data:
<a href=“http://www.rescorp.org/gdresources/downloads/publications/ae-feb-2002.pdf[/url]”>http://www.rescorp.org/gdresources/downloads/publications/ae-feb-2002.pdf</a></p>
<p>what I’ve heard about Macalester also goes for Carleton:</p>
<p>“rigorous academics without the east coast pretension”</p>
<p>one urban; one in a small town; both excellent schools</p>
<p>P.S. The main difference between excellent schools back east and those of the midwest and west is that at the former you have to look like you are not enjoying yourself while working hard, while at the latter you have to look like you ARE enjoying yourself while working hard.</p>
<p>Hence the frisbee culture quip you heard.</p>
<p>l</p>
<p>Carleton is extraordinarly strong academically, one of the very best of the best. </p>
<p>There are many so many academic distinctions setting Carleton above other similar institutions that it is hard to respond to your concern with specificity. I’ll throw out two: </p>
<ul>
<li><p>its reknowned writing program which is a model for other schools
[Carleton</a> College: Carleton News: News: Carleton Writing Program Cited for Excellence](<a href=“http://apps.carleton.edu/news/news/?story_id=679520]Carleton”>http://apps.carleton.edu/news/news/?story_id=679520) </p></li>
<li><p>and its #1 ranking among LACs for undergraduate teaching [Best</a> Undergraduate Teaching | Rankings | Top National Liberal Arts Colleges | US News](<a href=“http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-liberal-arts-colleges/undergraduate-teaching]Best”>http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-liberal-arts-colleges/undergraduate-teaching)</p></li>
</ul>
<p>My feathers certainly aren’t ruffled. Carleton’s rankings are strong, which is one way of looking at rigor and reputation for comparison sake, which is what you asked for initially. What other kinds of information are you looking for?</p>
<p>The grad school statistics are definitely encouraging. My D does have grad school in her plans as of now.<br>
Can you tell me which prestigious national universities and LACs does it compare to. so I tell those pretentious or ignorant folks something when they say ‘Carleton? Where is that? Never heard of that’? I know I should be ignoring them but I can’t. :)</p>
<p>Try Bowdoin, Williams, Davidson, Haverford, Pomana, Middlebury - great company! Carleton has the highest alumni giving rate of all these schools - telling you that graduates value their experience at Carleton and demonstrate that by giving back. It also is highly regarded by the academic world (demonstrated by high grad school admission rates and consistently high rankings for teaching and scholarship by other colleges and university faculty- ie peers).</p>
<p>Most people have never heard of any LAC unless they are knowledgeable about education. What you seem to be focusing on is name recognition. Yes everyone has heard of Ohio St or Florida St but that is based mostly on football. Keep in mind that even educated people mostly know very little about the schools until there own children go to college. Mention Swarthmore,Haverford,Bowdoin or Pomona to most people and it will bring a look of confusion or they will pretend to know the school. If it bothers you or your child go to a big university. The people that will matter to your child’s future on the other hand know the elite LAC’s and that’s what really is important.</p>
<p>If you can’t ignore them and don’t think you’ll be able to learn to, truthfully, I wouldn’t apply. I hope that doesn’t sound harsh, but I’ve been corresponding for months with a sophomore at another LAC who is questioning his decision to go to his school and thinks a lot about transferring. Some of it is his classmates – he’s kind of a hipster, loves sports and hasn’t found a lot of “his people.” But some of it is his insecurity that a liberal arts education was the way to go. He wasn’t sure going in about his choice, but the school was the highest-ranked one he got into, so off he went. Now, he wonders whether he should have gone to a more recognizable “name” university like his classmates and done something more pre-professional, such as a business degree. He admits the school is rigorous and knows he’s getting a great education, but there’s this thing that keeps nagging at him. I can’t imagine spending four years somewhere and questioning my decision constantly.</p>
<p>His concerns aren’t quite like yours, but I guess what I see in common is the idea of commiting to a place that you aren’t fully behind. If going in you’re already going to be bothered that no one in your circle “knows” Carleton and that that bugs you, then why would you pursue it? Will you question the choice for years? Of course, this is your dd’s decision, isn’t it? If she loves Carleton and applies and gets in and accepts, will you be able to just be really proud of her for going to a first-rate school, regardless of less-satisfactory bragging rights? Several people have offered links showing that Carleton can hold its own academically. That’s what I care about – that my student is getting a great education that can translate into a job or grad school.</p>
<p>I kind of like that a lot of people where I live don’t know Carleton – gives me a chance to educate them, and I know they wonder, “What do they know that we didn’t?” ;)</p>
<p>Will it bother you and your daughter that she will no longer be “the smart kid” amongst your circle of friends? What I mean by that is that your friends and the parents of her friends who go to the premier state U. will be quick to show you that their smart kids are on the Dean’s list or this or that honor roll or society. At Carleton, my straight A son had his first experience with working really hard for a B and with not being the only really bright kid in his class. He visited his friends at the State U. and upon going to class with them was amazed at how much LESS DEPTH there was.
He never had highest honors at Carleton to put in the local newspaper for parental bragging rights but he learned and grew tremendously; both intellectually and as a rounded adult. A year after graduation, not only is he proud and pleased with his Carleton education but, as parents, we are thrilled that he A. graduated in 4 years and B. graduated with a well paying interesting job in hand to move onto.</p>
<p>Thanks everybody. The state Us do not bother me at all. My D’s own friends in school haven’t heard of Carleton and my friends’ kids are going to the Ivies or Tufts or the New England LACs like Williams, Wesleyan, Amherst and Middlebury. That is why I began to have my doubts and frustrations. Well, like somebody on the thread said, it will be an opportunity for me to educate them. :)</p>
<p>And you can always say what I do: When in their lives are our kids ever going to be so unemcumbered – no spouse, no kids, no job, no mortgage – and able to do whatever they want? This was an opportunity to see a different part of the country rather than stick with what was familiar and safe. College is about expanding the horizons and trying something new. Think of you and your dd as trailblazers. :)</p>
<p>If your daughter does decide to attend Carleton, then take the opportunity to attend Family Weekend and sit in on a class or two. Made me wish I had gone to Carleton.</p>
<p>I agree with reesezpiecez103–I don’t think the average Midwesterner is familiar with many of the East (or West) Coast LACs unless they are in education or have fully explored LACs while having a child go through the college selection process. We had something of the same (but reverse?) situation as the OP–we are from MN and our daughter chose to attend Wellesley (and declined admission to Carleton). I was stuck at the time by the number of folks who didn’t really know where Wellesley was–and who couldn’t believe that our daughter had chosen a school they had never heard of over Carleton! I think that the general populace is pretty provincial in many things, colleges among them. And I have to admit that at the beginning of the whole college search ordeal, I hadn’t ever heard of Williams College, so I guess I shouldn’t cast too many “provincial” stones at my fellow Midwesterners!</p>
<p>Carleton is a fabulous school and it was a tough choice for our DD, but she ultimately wanted to go somewhere different (i.e. not the Midwest), the FA was slightly better, and she loved Boston. And as a number of the other posters have said, the people who matter are well aware of Carleton’s reputation and that is what should count.</p>