Is college a sick joke?

Parents Forum
1

<p>I am a lower class young adult. My parents helped pay for my Bachelor's degree. Now I struggle to find jobs even though I went to a California State University and earned a BA in Economics. My GPA was "good". Where is this $50K a year entry level job? I ended up working for Walmart for 5+ years at a whopping $11 an hour. </p>

<p>So what are we supposed to tell our kids when "study hard, go to school, get good grades, and you too can work at Walmart" is the path that we end up taking? Granted I could have gone into the military and/or learned a trade, but I was told to go to college. It just seems like a really messed up joke to smash my hopes and dreams every time by laughing AT me while asking the question, "What can you do with THAT degree? Har har har!" </p>

<p>I am extremely bitter.... Don't let your 30-something children end up in the same boat as me.</p>

2

<p>So are you saying that no one should go to college or they should be better informed when deciding whether to go to college, learning a trade or find a job out of high school?</p>

3

<p>What job did you hope to get with an Econ degree? If you had a reasonable GPA you should try adjusting your resume and selling yourself/skills to potential employers.</p>

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<p>Among Payscale members, the most common job titles for persons with BA in economics were financial analyst, business analyst, and data analyst . The median starting salary for <1 year after graduation was $45k. It sounds like few of them had Walmart type jobs. Did you apply for any analyst positions? </p>

5

<p>Based on what you said in other topics:</p>

<p>You struggled in Calculus, something relatively important for economics. </p>

<p>You quit two majors previous, doesn’t necessarily speak highly of you.</p>

<p>You graduated with a 3.0. In anything other than something where there’s extreme demand (EECS, nothing else really), that’s not quite a “good” GPA. </p>

<p>Sorry to be harsh, but you don’t sound like a very strong student. And based on where you are now, you probably shouldn’t have gone to college. It’s not a mistake for everyone, but it clearly was for you. I suggest you give up on any further higher education (in case you were thinking of it) and see if there’s a way you can move yourself up the ladder so to speak. Many of the students/kids of parents here are better students than you, and they’ll end up where they want to be. Sorry it didn’t work out for you. </p>

<p>Also, since you graduated 10 years ago, it’s time to let go of the fact that your degree didn’t net you anything. It’s too long back. You need to get over it.</p>

6

<p>Hi @mattnchico‌
In one of your other posts you mentioned leaving your school’s Mechanical Engineering program to pursue a BA in Economics because it was considerably less math intensive - I think that may be one of your biggest issues. There’s nothing wrong with not being a stellar math student, however, it seems as though you arbitrarily changed to a major that you didn’t have a solid long term plan for and that is where the issue at hand is - I may be completely wrong, though.</p>

<p>I don’t think college is for everyone - I think that some people would fare far better exploring opportunities available through trades. There seems to be a negative connotation associated with learning a trade, though, which I think the school system in this country should actively try to dismantle. Plumbers and Electricians can often make substantially more than a whole slew of BA/BS holders - and I don’t think enough teenagers know that. Many people don’t associate carpentry or plumbing with six figure salaries, but that can often be the case, especially if someone starts their own firm/company after working in the field a certain number of years. The culture of this country has yet to abandon the idea that white collar is always superior to blue collar and refuses to accept the fact that it is a hell of a lot harder to outsource a blue collar job than it is a middling white collar/non-trade position. </p>

<p>But it isn’t too late - you are not doomed to work at Walmart forever. Maybe being raised by immigrants has rendered me completely ignorant, but I still firmly believe America is still the land of opportunity - it’s never too late to take control over your future. You write your own destiny - you get to say how you spend the next 30, 40, 50 years of your life. A little sweat and a solid plan of action is all it takes (coupled with a healthy dose of realism - maybe you won’t ever play for the Lakers - but you can certainly find a job more fulfilling than being a store associate at Walmart). </p>

<p>For what it’s worth, I found @Vladenschlutte‌ response to be a bit harsh - I don’t think your shortcomings in life thus so far are massive, irreparable failures - there are definitely opportunities to change your lot in life and make better for yourself. </p>

7

<p>Sometimes it is not the college or major that prevents a person from getting a good job, it is the apllicant himself. </p>

8

<p>A degree in Econ does not doom one to a life as an $11 / hr Walmart employee. I know of 2 people with similar GPAs, one with a BA and the other with a BS in Econ. The BA is successfully working as a financial advisor for a well known brokerage firm. The BS took a low level entry position with a large bank to get his foot in the door, and has gotten 4 promotions and 6 raises (more than doubling his starting salary) in 3 years. I would think that an organization as large as Walmart would present opportunity for advancement - dept. manager, asst. manager, store manager, etc. The BS was disappointed he didn’t land a better job out of school, but he recognized that if he got his foot in the door, worked hard, networked within the organization, and had a great attitude, it wouldn’t take long for people to notice - and he was right. </p>

9

<p>My daughter’s boyfriend was an Econ major at a not-top-tier college. He hustled for internships every summer starting freshman year, and gradually got better internships and better experience. He started with something at the small business administration, then the budget department of a gov’t agency, then one of the larger consulting firms. If you missed out on internships because of major hopping, it could have cost you in the job market after college. When he was job hunting after graduation, he had three different solid internship experiences on his resume, and he got a good job in spite of graduating at a time when new college grads were really struggling near the end of the recession.</p>

10

<p>As others have mentioned, get into banking and work your way up. A job as a personal banker or account rep is a good place to start. Check into manager trainee programs in various companies. </p>

11

<p>I have also been wondering if a college degree has become a luxury good for many graduates who do not proceed into a few select fields within several years of graduation, if not immediately upon graduation. And as the parent of a recent grad who is considering further education within the next couple of years, I am very leery of spending even more money to end up in the same place, even if job prospects in a prospective field look decent right now.</p>

<p>There is no question in my mind that over the past ten years or so and especially since the recession has hit, competition for internships and entry-level career positions has become fierce even among students with background in subjects supposedly in demand, along for competition for slots in graduate and professional schools. Mistakes (wrong choice of major, low GPA) are also more difficult and far more costly to correct than was once the case. The process of hiring has also become much more complicated over the years, from what I am hearing.</p>

<p>It seems easy to blame the graduate for having chosen the wrong major, or not working hard enough for a high GPA, or for not having snagged the right internships (or any internships), or for having made a few mistakes that might have seemed minor a few decades ago, without taking a close look at overall supply and demand and shifting barriers to entry. </p>

<p>I think OP hits on some very serious questions that many of us have been asking ourselves if not each other in this shifting and uncertain economy, whether our children are recent graduates or have been working for a few or even several years but at a job that does not provide opportunities for advancement or one that does not offer long-term security. The latter might even include STEM students in post-doc limbo.</p>

<p>That said, I would have to ask OP, if not happy at the opportunities at walmart - </p>

<p>Do you have any feel for where any natural ability (this could include a “soft skill” such as sales, or a mechanical aptitude or flair for writing or learning a foreign language) might give you an advantage if coupled with re-training and networking, even if course grades were not impressive the first time around? </p>

<p>Do you have enough mechanical aptitude to re-train for a blue collar job at a local community college, and could you afford the tuition?</p>

12

<p>@preamble1776 - </p>

<p>The choice between going to trade school or entering college to pursue an engineering degree is not always straightforward. We looked into this for our oldest, who likes to work with his hands and is now an engineer. It was never a matter of having disdain for blue collar work. (I was not raised by immigrants; it was my immigrant grandparents, however, who had the disdain for blue collar work and pushed their children to college and professional schools.)</p>

<p>At the high school level, taking enough vocational courses to qualify for an entry-level job would have meant not having room to take or prepare for the AP math and science classes that gave him the background to succeed in an intro engineering curriculum. We also saw that the vo-tech classes offered through the high school consortium were not always taught well, and that placement for graduates was very specialized. The most successful students seemed to have a very clear career path in mind from a young age and to come from families that could help to place them in a network immediately following graduation, had very good networking skills, or had the luck to graduate into a job market with immediate demand for their skills. (Market for blue collar skills can also wax and wane with the economy and variables such as construction and defense spending.)</p>

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<p>Is there a management trainee program at Walmart? </p>

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<p>Yes. The current CEO started as a seasonal cashier. Fun fact.</p>

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<p>To those who didn’t look, he graduated in 2004. The recession was not a problem he was facing. </p>

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<p>Vladenschlutte, that may be the case, but the point is what can he do NOW.</p>

<p>OP, you have retail background and an economics degree. I suggest retooling your resume to highlight this combination and looking for an entry-level position in retail banking. Or, if you actually like retail, look for a management trainee position with a retail organization. Don’t overlook things like supermarket chains, marketing services companies, and so forth.</p>

<p>If that sort of thing doesn’t appeal to you, think seriously about what DOES. I would bet that there are free services around identifying strengths, job hunting strategies, putting together a resume, etc through employment centers in your region. They are usually associated with the unemployment office. Use them. </p>

<p>FWIW, I completely agree that far too many people are pushed towards 4 year degrees who would be much better off with great vocation education/apprenticeship starting in HS. Despite this, I certainly hope that you got something out of your undergraduate studies other than a job credential. It is education, not training. Or should be. It sounds like you were pushed into pursuing a course of study that really didn’t suit you because of a false assumption that only certain majors were “employable.” But that is water under the bridge. Time for you to take stock and set a new course NOW.</p>

17

<p>"Now I struggle to find jobs "- Wake up and smell the roses, I have strufggled to find the jobs 9 times with huge amount of experience and an MBA. But eventually I did, 9 times and in the one of the worst economic region of the country and not being able to relocate. But you did not have to let your parents pay for your education, you could have gotten it for free if you choose your UG wisely. That is another unrelated to job point that has no relevance to your search.<br>
in regard to a 4 year degree, many places will NOT hire you unless you have A 4 YEAR degree. Specifically my current position requires a 4 year degree, I would not be considered at all for this position wihtout it. However, the job that I perform (IT) does not require it at all. With cetain training, one can write software without any degree at all and I have known such people. However, they will not be hired now, not a chance.
I myself let various employers pay for my BS and MBA. Frankly, I do not need MBA at all, not even a requirement, but I got it because it was free, why not. I was told by several interviewers that it looked very impressive and I was even told that it got me in. So, education is never disadvantage, it is an advantage, and the free one is even a bigger advantage. Frnakly in our family, we paid only for S’s 4 year degree, the rest of us got it for free.
So, be patient, persistant and be ready to take ANY job, yes, ANY. I went thru this 9 times and the last time I was very close to my 60s. As a young person, you should endure the process.</p>

18

<p>try Home Depot. you have good retail experience, build on that. The Home Depot has good career tracks, especially for ppl who make it clear they want to climb the ladder. it’s a fun place to work and very rewarding. when you tell ppl you work at The Home Depot you get respect. get your foot in the door and do all the online training they offer. be patient but make it clear you want a “career”. they love that, and they need ppl like that. </p>

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<p>Marriott, as well, has good careers tracks. If you started out with them, odds are you’d’ve been manager or something by now. </p>

20

<p>First, I am very impressed with someone who has the perseverance to stay in a job with Walmart for 10 years. I would be very proud of you if you were my child. Employers may be impressed with this as well.</p>

<p>Even a few years ago, college was not necessarily about training for a job, but about learning things. You say you are from a "lower class, so you may not have felt this way going in, because it is generally (not always) people with money or “upper class” status who talk about “learning for learning’s sake”, but nevertheless it does apply for you. You may not realize or value it, but you are an educated person and had exposure to ideas that you may not have have exposure to without college. To me, that is the only reliable outcome of college, fortunately or unfortunately depending on your attitude. And sure, you could just opt out and read on your own, but were there teachers or fellow students you met that you valued?</p>

<p>You also may not realize that for the duration of your life you will be able to apply to jobs that require a college degree. A degree may be one of those things you learn about in economics, that doesn’t bring a positive but prevents a negative by its presence. In other words, you may not feel better off with a degree but you would feel a whole lot worse without one!</p>

<p>Consider the BA a platform you can build on. You have demonstrated work ethic and persistence by completing a degree and by staying in a difficult job for a long long time. Now, what are your options? Perhaps you could find a job or life coach to talk with. Are you interested in health care at all? Community colleges have many programs for various types of technician jobs, radiology, respiratory, ultrasound, EEG, RKG, sterile processing, etc. You could acquire office and technology skills as well. Get a post grad certificate. Check out your nearest state college or university for certificate programs. There are online and low residency programs as well.</p>

<p>Are you interested in service? Look up Americorps. Teaching? Sales? Decide on a general direction and try it out with entry level or even internship or volunteering.</p>

<p>Understand that many many college grads are in the same position, and many do head for community college for post grad training. There are also many career changers, even older ones, who are doing the same thing.</p>

<p>Life is full of zigs and zags and you have to just push ahead a little more creatively. I know it is necessary to make enough to live on. That is the main trap for many. Some graduates are still receiving financial support while they pursue studies or interning and have the financial ability to take risks. Hopefully you have some savings and can do that for a bit. Craigslist, Hire Culture, Monster can give some ideas. But find a person to help you.</p>

<p>You raise important questions for those contemplating college, but you have already gone and finished with decent enough grades and an interesting major. If nothing else, see if you can talk to a cognitive behavioral therapist because there are a lot of positives in your picture, and you may need help seeing the glass as half full.</p>

<p>The rest of us are indeed thinking about whether it is all worth it, believe me. One of my three is not going to college, at least for now. I am sorry you are so disillusioned and repeat that I admire you for doing your job for so long, but hope you can take the plunge and try something else. Good luck!</p>