<p>In looking over the Vanderbilt supplemental form, the idea came to me that its purpose is solely to identify legacies. I know legacies are a large portion of Vanderbilt admits. My question is: is the higher early admission percentage due solely or mainly to legacy admissions?</p>
<p>Many supplements of prestigious colleges have large sections devoted to alumni relation.</p>
<p>I doubt that legacies have that much sway in the admissions process, especially since they generally do not comprise a large percentage of applicants to any college, not just Vanderbilt.</p>
<p>Being a legacy at Vanderbilt as of two years ago means NOTHING.</p>
<p>At Vanderbilt specifically, there are more direct legacies that apply each year than there are spots in the freshman class.</p>
<p>So, assuming they only accepted half of them, that leaves little room for affirmative action beneficiaries, jewish people, and internationals (not making this up, reference Hustler article online about stated desire to equal Duke's minority and international rates in 5 years, kind of like Stalin's five year plans, we all know what good that brought the world).</p>
<p>The higher ED acceptance rate boils down to this simple fact. While Vanderbilt ultimately wants to change its public image so Hillary Clinton and other liberal demoncrats can give speeches at Vanderbilt instead of Belmont/Fisk without being labeled as favoring old money establishment by CNN, it simply is not possible to do this in a four year cycle as every major alumni donor, most of whom were Greek, will...stop donating. Instead, they sneak in a few important legacies, children of well to do families, good looking wiminz, and an athlete here and there in the ED cycle to appease some of these people while still losing a few donors each year for denying legacies from donor families.</p>
<p>Surely in about 15 years after Vanderbilt has completed its shift to become more like Yale and Oxford with rainbow-painted Residential Colleges and a fresher, more liberal and Northeastern alumni base exists, perhaps the legacy factor will be "formally" reintroduced into the admissions process, but until then, they'll keep on nixing multiple generation Southern families that just can't produce those 2400s from the Vanderbilt family slowly but surely to make room for Juanita Goldstein and John New Jersey.</p>
<p>This summer we were in an info session and the Cornell Dean of Admissions explained the advantage (numerically) of applying for early decision. He then turned to the group of kids, asked, "Are there any legacies here?" informing them that their legacy status would only be considered during the early decision phase. I doubt this practice is limited to Cornell.</p>
<p>Legacy is essentially affirmative action for the upper class. </p>
<p>Attempting to have a diverse group of students, in my mind, is a noble goal. I wouldn't equate Stalinism (or progressive politics) with an attempt to provide a more well-rounded enriching experience for the students. When I went to college I had never before met a Jewish person, nor anyone from South America. All of those experiences were pluses in my college education.</p>
<p>UPenn openly tells legacies that only during ED would their status would have consideration for admissions. I don't know if Vandy has such a policy or if any other schools do. Some schools insist that there are NO special considerations for early applicants; that this just happens to be a more qualified pool of kids which is why the accept rate is higher ED. Others say there is definitely an advantage.</p>
<p>I don't know where anyone thinks that legacies have any advantage at Vanderbilt now. I personally know of one girl just a couple of years ago who had more than acceptable stats, had both parents who were Vandy alums that hosted numerous fundraisers in their home and had another fundraiser scheduled when they found out their daughter was waitlisted. There were many blistering phone calls made! Daughter did NOT go to Vanderbilt. There is also no preference for admission to children of faculty either, both in the regular university or the medical center.</p>
<p>Just because there is legacy preferance does not mean that all qualified legacies will get admissions. I know at son's private high school, there is a very strong legacy card for admissions, but it does not guarantee that all legacy kids will be offered a spot. It just means that they get extra CONSIDERATION. For colleges, most admissions processes do use a point system of sorts to help along even holistic decisions, and legacies almost always get a few extra points thrown into the mix. But a strong applicant pool any given year, can mean many legacies still not making the numbers. </p>
<p>Princeton openly states that it gives alumni kids a leg up. And a close analysis of the numbers which P openly gives out shows that the legacies are accepted in greater percentages with lower stats than the over all admitted pool. But you still hear of kids with great stats, definitely HPY material who did not make admissions even with the legacy card. It is that competitive. It is so different when being a legacy meant an almost automatic in. These days there are just too many legacy kids and too many other kids, too many other college needs and wants for its student body for legacy to be as heavy of a weight as it used to be. At some schools, however, legacy can still mean a lot. Now if you want to get into a heavy card, development, especially loads of $$$s development will trump legacy every time and if you have both legacy and heavy duty development, that will likely get you in the door if you are a viable candidate at all, sometimes even if you are not.</p>
<p>palmettotree, that concept seems ludicrous. In America today, I think most ppl have a concept of on nation and not antebellum ideals where there is a distinction between regions. My friend who is Jewish attends Vanderbilt and it is offensive for you to suggest that somehow he took some "Southerners" spot. He was VERY accomplished (3rd in class) and definetly deserved to be there. And as a Black Republican it is really offenisve to me to refer to minority applicants as "Affirmative Action Beneficiaries" they are MANY black applicants who are very qualified to attend Vanderbilt, and who would get in regardless of affirmative action.</p>
<p>Palmettotree"s diatribe against affirmative action (and Early Decision) made me look up some of his prior posts.</p>
<p>April 2008, Palmetto stated, "I think what might be happening is Vandy is trying to appear like they care about all that liberal crap to appease the ranking lords, but ultimately they're sneaking in all the legacy WASPs through ED."</p>
<p>Palmettotree, who has identified himself as a boarding school graduate, also reveals that he got an interview for admission from his daddy's friend, both of whom are Vanderbilt alums: "I interviewed with a friend of my dad's (both went to Vanderbilt in the 80s). He was great."</p>
<p>Vanderbilt admissions told us that interviews were not possible. Apparantly, for Palmetto tree, the admission interview was not only possible, but could be conducted by daddy's frat brother. A very sweet deal.</p>
<p>Thanks to the other posters, who have provided balanced information.</p>
<p>1) Quick history lesson on Vanderbilt. It has ALWAYS been a place of tremendous balance. It epitomizes the "work hard, play hard" attitude, has had geographic diversity since the dawn of time (even Mr. Vanderbilt's endowment stated he wished to bind together the pieces of the nation). Here's where it turns sour. Somehow, for some outrageous reason, the powers that be (Gordon Gee) decided that this simply wasn't enough and that the approval of the Northeastern Liberal Ivy Grad SIMPLY MUST BE HAD. Solution? Rape the culture, change nearly every policy over a decade (quick examples off of top of head, BYOB policy at fraternity parties = 2004, Commons Iniative & Residential Colleges = 2007, even a huge amount of the courses have been RENAMED and RENUMBERED to correspond with Ivies), dismantle alumni base and start anew, recruit JEWS!!! Look, I'm a huge fan of Jews, example: Judah Benjamin is my favorite historical character, look him up. But that does NOT change the fact that it is absolutely pathetic to RECRUIT Jews (1% 1999 15% 2008) just to jump a few spots in rankings and Northeastern Prestige (again, feel free to reference some of Gee's quote's in Hustler archives).</p>
<p>2) I'm obviously biased, but that doesn't change the fact that I know what I'm talking about and am spot on the money. Reference hope4freeride's post and then re-read mine. Trust me, that's no sole occurrence. I live in an area with quite a few Duke (in its heyday), Vanderbilt, UVa, etc... grads and know of more than a few families that are no longer annual donors after their kids were rejected. My father is an alum and I guarantee you he'd have stopped as well.</p>
<p>3) "In America today, I think most ppl have a concept of on nation and not antebellum ideals where there is a distinction between regions". I could write a god dang thesis on this one. Try not to find this too offensive, but as a "republican" you should probably know a thing or two about states' rights. This country was founded as an entity in which your patriotism to your state (or region in this aspect) always superseded that to the federal government. Southern people are far and away the most patriotic people in this nation, go have a look at the recipients of the Medal of Honor to confirm that one. Basically, to fast forward 30 pages without going all ADD, Vanderbilt was a Southern school, has a Southern identity, and it is a disgusting sham to pillage its identity and culture in order to make it more suitable for Ivy League rejects.</p>
<p>4) You immediately went on the defensive when neither you nor your friend were attacked. YOUR point of view represents the wrong with the liberal media and its brainwashed constituents. Obviously there are many black applicants with appropriate qualifications, and they have every right to attend. Affirmative action is a policy that exists and DOES benefit minority groups. FACT: There ARE unqualified blacks that attend Vanderbilt not playing sports. It is a pathetic excuse for fairness and completely hypocritical for two reasons: 1) It is racism meant to...combat racism? In Vanderbilt's case, they have rid legacy status as a factor in admissions, but KEPT a FAR more ludicrous factor.</p>
<p>Your Jewish friend probably is more qualified than a comparable Southerner on paper. ON PAPER. </p>
<p>This is how you need to look at it. The same jobs are paid higher in NYC than Charlotte, NC. Take a look at living expenses, and guess what, they equate!!!! Vanderbilt does not ADJUST for context, it's that simple. I can name on one hand the people I know that paid for SAT tutoring lessons, but it would take a notepad to mention the deb girls I know. Upbringings are different and priorities are different. Success at Woodberry Forest is VERY different than success at Phillips Exeter.</p>
<p>Whatever I wrote here was probably an illegible rant as you fired me up and I don't have much time, but let me say this,</p>
<p>Vanderbilt is THE best school in the country STILL. Even with these radical changes, it will be another 10 years before that will change. It is not as great as it was in 2000, but in nowhere else in the world will you find any institution that is a member of the greatest athletic conference to grace the Univerise yet also has beautiful women, phenomenal academics, sits on a national arboretum but somehow also in the middle of arguagbly one of the more fun cities around, and has served as a bastion of Southern gentility for over eight generations.</p>
<p>All right kuvaszkin Internet detective!! Waaayyy tooo goooo!!</p>
<p>PS I clearly think ED is great as you can see with your forensics. The difference between myself and a politically correct sob is I don't apologize for what I believe and can justify.</p>
<p>Back to the question of the relationship between Early Decision and legacy admission: I've discovered the following posts:</p>
<p>Quote:
Princeton is one of the last bastions of legacy admission IMO, I'm not surprised by a near 40% acceptance rate.
The acceptance rate is sky high, but the percentage of legacies that make up each class hovers at around 15%, which is similar to most top schools. Weasel8488</p>
<p>"Mahoney said BC is interested in the children of alumni, commonly called "legacy cases." The admit rate for such applicants is up this year to 55 percent, compared to 31 percent for other applicants, according to a recent article in the Boston College Chronicle." highopes, July 31</p>
<p>Notre Dame sets aside a quarter of its freshman class for legacy students. It's an old promise to the alumni of the university, and knowing how ND likes its tradition I doubt that will change much. ducktape , July 31</p>
<p>It seems that legacy admission is a Large Factor, and I'd really like to know what role in plays in Vanderbilt's admissions. Does anyone have any data?</p>
<p>Straight from an admissions counselor: "Vanderbilt does NOT give preference to Jewish students in the admissions process."</p>
<p>I live in Nashville and work at, dare I say it---Vanderbilt! I am not a native, but have family who have lived here for around 25 years. There may be close to a million of us here,but it is a close knit kind of town. I have heard increasing numbers of stories of children of alums who have NOT been admitted despite meeting better than the mid 50% stats.
People who are much higher up than I am on the Vanderbilt medical center food chain have had their kids outright rejected or at best,waitlisted, and no amount of phone calls up the chain of command has made any difference.
Vanderbilt has also been reducing the number of locally talented graduates from both public and private schools as well. Only 1 from Ds school got in last year,down from 3 admitted, the valedictorian of a very good private school was rejected who has significant country music connections here. I could go on and on. Legacies and locally talented kids do not mean much to Vanderbilt lately.
Vanderbilt is truly trying to become more diverse to catch up with its peer schools and I applaud that. Even though my D stands a very good chance of being valedictorian at her school and a National Merit Finalist, I am not at all certain she will be accepted. But that is why she is applying to other schools as well</p>
<p>zooey2011, sure, it's not an official policy, nor is legacy status. Yet somehow Ross Perot III (Ross Perot's grandson, Ross Perot, Jr.'s son (vandy alum)) got in, I have a hunch Trip isn't qualified on paper.</p>
<p><a href="http://paste.lisp.org/display/12638%5B/url%5D">http://paste.lisp.org/display/12638</a> (2002)</p>
<p>"Although other ethnic and racial groups, notably blacks and Hispanics, have been targeted by many universities, that effort has largely been to promote diversity or to increase opportunity for the economically disadvantaged. Something else is driving the quest for more Jews -- about which Vanderbilt is unusually forthright. It wants them to raise its academic standing."</p>
<p>""Yes, we're targeting Jewish students," Chancellor Gordon Gee told a March 17 board meeting of the Vanderbilt affiliate of Hillel"</p>
<p>"Mr. Gee, who left the presidency of Brown University for Vanderbilt two years ago, says niche marketing to Jewish students is part of his "elite strategy" to lift Vanderbilt to Ivy League status."</p>
<p>"Vanderbilt officials say they are simply trying to lure more Jewish applicants, not to use religion as a factor in admissions. They say that bringing more highly qualified Jews into the applicant pool will naturally yield more admissions of Jewish students. "We're about broadening the applicant pool, not about quotas," Mr. Gee says. He says Vanderbilt is also trying to increase enrollment of blacks, Hispanics and Asians."</p>
<p>What this all boils down to is doing the right thing for wrong reasons. It's pathetic.</p>
<p>Actually, he is very qualified. He would have gotten in regardless of his father.</p>
<p>At the convocation for first-year students this past Sunday, the statistic given--among many others--was that there were 108 "legacy" students among a class of just over 1,500 students.</p>
<p>According to an article in the Vanderbilt magazine last year, the admissions office claimed they received more legacy applicants than they have spots for in any given incoming class.</p>
<p>If that is true, "legacy" status doesn't seem to be given a huge priority.</p>
<p>It really depends what sort of legacy students applied. Also, you don't know how many legacy students were accepted and did not end up choosing V for their school.</p>
<p>Palmettotree, BYOB for fraternity parties in 2004? That should have happened long before 2004, given the legal climate in the past 20 years. I stepped down as a sorority advisor in 1992 due to the increasing number of lawsuits aimed at greek organizations & colleges as a result of drinking. I had to protect my family. Schools have to protect themselves. It's a fact of life. Gee was hardly raping the culture. He made a decision that is in the best interest of the institution. I'm sure the partiers still find ways to drink, just as we old folks did when the drinking age was upped from 18 to 21 (while we were still 19 or 20).</p>
<p>To the OP, don't worry about legacies. If you have a strong application & you feel strongly about applying ED, go for it. I don't know if Vandy defers ED no's to RD or puts them out of the pool, though. That might be something to check into & consider.</p>