<p>My S, a junior civil engineering major, is telling me that he needs to go to grad school (although he may have changed his mind since I broke it to him that I won't be paying for it). How necessary is a Masters? Is it commonplace for an employer to pay for graduate school? I have a liberal arts degree and know absolutely nothing about engineering so any adivce will be greatly appreciated!</p>
<p>All my engineer friends have gone on to graduate coursework with the company paying. The only stipulation is that they earn a grade of B and the company will pay.</p>
<p>They are employed by large aerospace firms and fortune 500 companies.</p>
<p>Has your son done an internship at any companies yet? They would be able to confirm if they pay for school.</p>
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How necessary is a Masters?
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<p>It has its uses, but you don't really need it. You can get a perfectly good job without it, although a master's is probably does offer a positive financial return on your investment (whereas a PhD does not: you should pursue a PhD because you really want one, not because of the payout). </p>
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Is it commonplace for an employer to pay for graduate school?
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<p>Some employers, especially the larger ones, will pay for grad school. But they often times will then force you to sign a contract agreeing to work for them for X number of years (or else pay back the subsidy), lest they pay for your degree only to have you use it to immediately jump to another company.</p>
<p>He has an internship lined up for next summer with a larger (about 2000 employees) engineering firm. I saw something on their website about in-house training programs as well as tuition reimbursement after six months of service. </p>
<p>My S seems to think that he couldn't go to grad school and work full-time and that he should go straight to grad school. I, on the other hand, think he needs to work for awhile and think about grad school later.</p>
<p>What is he basing his opinion on? Grad students and prof opinions?</p>
<p>I think he should network during his internship and find out what those in positions he would like to have did. Masters degrees in engineering are commonly obtained while one works full time. Additionally, I am going to school in the evenings for my MBA, I work all day as an engineer, and I have a wife and two young children as well. It's possible, but it's busy. He may want to get the work experience in order to help him decide what kind of masters degree to get as well. Still, my first sentence of this paragraph will give him a better idea.</p>
<p>If your son is in civil engineering and says that he needs to go on to grad school, then he probably does. In civil engineering, and definitely in structural engineering, you NEED a masters to get hired by anybody who does anything cool. I know my structures firm doesn't even interview people who don't have a masters degree. Resumes go straight into the trash.</p>
<p>Typically, school will PAY you to get your masters, which takes one to two years, tops. Tell your son to talk to his profs to see whether he has a good shot at getting a teaching or research assistantship at a good graduate program, but if he thinks he needs to get a graduate degree to move beyond the realm of trail-horse, commercial development engineering into solving original problems and doing all the really cool stuff that people tell you about when they're trying to convince you to be a civil engineer.</p>
<p>All the companies that I worked for offer to pay for Masters degree and even Phds. If he can NOT find employment then go for Masters degree.</p>
<p>I would think that he would have a good shot at a teaching/research assistantship as he has very good grades (3.6) from a top 20 school albeit not a top 20 engineering school. His concentration is in structural engineering and if I am understanding him correctly, he does want to do design work. I can appreciate that at some point he will need a Masters degree. Would it make more sense to get a job first and have his employer pay for his graduate school education or for him to try to get a teaching/research assistantship so that the school pays for it? I don't think that he's really considered getting a teaching/research assistantship because he mistakenly believed this his Dad and I would be paying for it.</p>
<p>I also think that he thinks that he needs to get a Master's because most of his friends are going on to graduate school. However, they, for the most part are not engineering majors and would have to get a graduate degree in order to be employable.</p>
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My S seems to think that he couldn't go to grad school and work full-time and that he should go straight to grad school. I, on the other hand, think he needs to work for awhile and think about grad school later.
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<p>I'd have to side with you on this one. He should a full time job upon graduating in a company that offers tuition reimbursement. Then work by day and go to school by night.</p>
<p>I'm a structural design engineer with a masters degree, sitting at my desk procrastinating on finishing up Level 1 of a high-rise hospital, so i'm in the field it sounds like your son wants to go into. It's different with structures, JoeJoe. OP, if your son lands a great internship with a great company before he graduates, he should ask them whether or not they reimburse tuition for grad school. If they do, great. He should see if he can work for them part time while getting his masters degree, and then he can walk right into a great job with a great firm as a graduate engineer. Otherwise, if he's got a 3.6 from a good school, if he applies to a lot of grad programs then he'll likely have SOMEONE offer him money to go to that grad program.</p>
<p>Grad school comes first in this field. Stalling just costs you money, and increases the chance that you won't go back to get your masters. Your masters degree opens many, many doors that would otherwise be closed to you. Someone will almost always pay for you to go, or you'll accrue loans that you'll pay off very quickly because grad school takes two years, one if you hoof it. If your son is inclined to go to grad school, if he wants to go into structures, he's being given good information that's consistent with what the industry is demanding.</p>
<p>If you'd like, take a look at ASCE's policy 465. The entire professional society has put out a massive resolution saying that a bachelors degree is not enough for a terminal degree. This is particularly true in structural engineering.</p>
<p>American</a> Society of Civil Engineers (ASCE)</p>
<p>Waiting for grad school is something that's done in other engineering fields, but it's not what's done in structures. In structures, it is the norm to go to grad school straight away, and someone will almost certainly pay for it. Tell your son to start asking around... professors, employers, members of his local ASCE or SEA chapter... for grad school funding suggestions.</p>
<p>Thanks a lot for the link aibarr. As usual, it looks like my son does know what he is talking about. I'll let him know that he should check with the firm he's working for this summer to see what they would be willing to do about grad school as well as talk to his professors about pursuing a graduate assistantship. Any thoughts on where he should apply? He mentioned the University of Illinois but I'm guessing that it would be extremely competitive since it is one of the top rated schools for civil engineering.</p>
<p>If your son is pursuing a career in civil engineering, then he will ultimately want a state Professional Engineering (PE) license to advance in his career. Traditionally, the BS degree was the entry-level qualification for the PE license, but NCEES -- the national organization of state engineering boards -- recently endorsed the MS as a new standard. NCEES is now recommending that states amend their laws and regulations to mandate the MS (or equivalent coursework) as the new educational qualification for PE candidates.</p>
<p>Earlier this year, [url=<a href="http://www.nspe.org/PEmagazine/pe_0408_On_First_Attempt.html%5DNebraska%5B/url">http://www.nspe.org/PEmagazine/pe_0408_On_First_Attempt.html]Nebraska[/url</a>] became the first state to consider making the MS a legal requirement for engineering licensure. The bill did not pass, but the issue probably isn't going away. It seems likely that more states will be considering this change over the next 5-10 years, and that at least some will accept it. </p>
<p>If such legislation does pass, then grad school would basically become mandatory for civil engineers, just as it is for doctors or lawyers. Most other engineers would not be directly affected, because most other engineers do not need state PE licenses.</p>
<p>You're talking to the right gal; I got my MS at Illinois, and during my time there, I had both a teaching assistantship and a research assistantship. I came from Rice with a 3.5-something. I think he'll have a pretty good shot at admission. It sounds like someone's steering him right, though, if he's set on grad school and thinking about UIUC. Have him talk to a few trusted professors within his department-- they'll have a better feel about where else he should apply to (probably six or seven of the top programs, and then about half will admit someone with a 3.5 or higher, was what I was told at the time), and about how applicants from his school fare in the admissions process.</p>
<p>Grad school <em>will</em> eventually become mandatory for civil engineers. The professional societies will continue to push for it until it passes, and the requirements will be phased in eventually. Everybody who's in college now will probably be grandfathered in to the current requirements, but employers in the industry like to see young engineers who are attuned to the current trends, and the current trends indicate that you really need more than a bachelors to do the job these days. There's just too much material to cover in four years.</p>
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If your son is in civil engineering and says that he needs to go on to grad school, then he probably does. In civil engineering, and definitely in structural engineering, you NEED a masters to get hired by anybody who does anything cool. I know my structures firm doesn't even interview people who don't have a masters degree. Resumes go straight into the trash.
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<p>I've had very similar experiences talking to some structural engineering hiring managers. This seems to be less the case with other subdisciplines in civil engineering. However, the overwhelming majority of the civil engineering students in my year that went straight to work also went straight to grad school part-time.</p>
<p>Whether you choose to work full-time and go to school part-time, or just get your MS done first will depend on the proximity of colleges in your city. You have fewer options if choose to do both simultaneously. I have yet to hear of anybody being an RA or TA and completing their degree in one year though. It would typically be two years. One year is do-able if you pay full tuition.</p>
<p>One thing that people often don't consider when making a decision like this is that if you go to school and work full-time, you probably won't be able to get as much out of your education. Work won't be on a fixed 9-5 schedule. Sometimes you'll have to stay late to finish some work up. Sometimes meeting will last longer than expected. Or there might be an emergency. Or a million other things. This will likely cause you to mix classes and/or prevent you from putting enough effort into the course to get something worthwhile out of it. If you go to school full-time, you're only responsibility is with academics, and not split with professional responsibilities.</p>
<p>Just let your son do what he wants to do. If you're not paying, why bother second-guessing him?</p>