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<p>I agree. As long as my kids become self-sufficient within a reasonable amount of time, as long as they are happy, what difference would it make to me if they took jobs such that they wind up living on $30K, $300K, or $3 million? It’s not as though I expect them to re-pay me the cost of their college education. That was a gift.</p>
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<p>Oh, please. Paris, Rome, London are worth going to on their own merits, regardless of “what other people think.” Anyway, no one “tells other people” where to go on vacation. And frankly, no one “tells other people” where to send their kids to college either.</p>
<p>^^^Yes … and now pick which ONE you will go to at the exclusion of all others, for ever and always- which is the case in college decisions. " I summered in Paris " brings a much bigger picture to many a mind than “I summered in Warsaw”. </p>
<p>That’s where the 'people telling them how important it is comes into play.( Notice I said 'telling how important" … this is different than “telling that’s where they must go”)</p>
<p>No, dietz. It only becomes important if one’s self-esteem is so fragile that it’s dependent upon the reactions of others.</p>
<p>Pizza is correct. Paying for college is a gift that parents can give. The giver determines how much of a gift. There are no guarantees that the student will get great grades in college. There are no guarantees they will finish. There are no guarantees that they will be employed within 6 months of graduation and there are no guarantees they will reap a “huge” salary by age 40. Parents need to take a long look at themselves and figure out how much they are willing to spend. Maybe I can’t afford Paris and can only afford Warsaw but that does not mean my trip will be less fulfilling or that I won’t get to Paris someday when I have more income.</p>
<p>@Pizzagirl,</p>
<p>I agree with you. In my post I said its not an absolute rule but a guide as someone using financial aid to get kids thru 4 yrs of college.</p>
<p>If you have the money to send a kid anywhere without it being a great financial burden, go anywhere you want.</p>
<p>Where huge debt is involved, a person needs to be more strategic in the choices they make. Even then, my S goes to more expensive university mainly because his chances of success are greater there than some lower cost options we had. We had to take other personal factors into consideration besides debt.</p>
<p>PizzaGirl:
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<p>Couldn’t agree more! And with media hype, sites like this, the battle of the rankings, and the market strategy pushing the unquestionable benefit of name brand recognition ‘fear’ takes hold in many a normally resilient and confident person. </p>
<p>And if this is not a predictable and expected reaction by the ‘common man/woman’…well then there is no need for Women/Gender/La Raza/Non-European programs…because after all… it would only serve those who ones self-esteem shouldn’t be so fragile as to require discussions and second/third/ and fourth looks at what is considered to be ‘true’.</p>
<p>While I would not compare Paris to Warsaw, I think that Prague is more beautiful than London ;)</p>
<p>Also, there are “elite” schools that offer full rides for merit. Three that I am familiar with are U Chicago, Duke and Caltech.</p>
<p>Sent from my SGH-T999 using CC</p>
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<p>Sorry if this is sort of off topic, but could someone expand on this more? I’m going from a top-4 in my field for undergraduate to a school only in the top 30 for grad school (but top 20 in my subfield), and I’m kind of nervous that people are going to take me less seriously when they see that. I don’t think I wasted my time here - my GPA is a 3.8 and I’ve taken around 9 grad classes - but I’m not sure if other people will see it that way.</p>
<p>Per the original question of this post with a little variation, is it worth going to USC without aid or alternatively a less expensive school elsewhere? I think the problem is deciding what class of school one puts USC in.</p>
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<p>Similarly, son attended a top tier, need-based only college, for less* than the cost of our instate flagship.</p>
<p>CADREAMIN, if your choice is USC vrs UCLA,for FAR less $$, then pick UCLA.
It is just as good a U and since you are a Cal resident, the decision should be a no brainer.
The goal should be to get the best education at the lowest $$ possible.</p>
<p>Fwiw In the real life world, my old state flagship school doesn’t trade well in the legal marketplace where I’m up against legal beagles from Tier 1s. So it really depends on your career choice. When I started out, I recall seeing a job post and begging my colleague, an USC grad to not apply because all things being equal, her degree would nose me out haha. Now that I do the hiring, I have to say that with so many apps flooding my office, I have to weed them out somehow and every law firm wants their website to have showy names in the bios. Sad but true. Fortunately not all kids will be lawyers, thank goodness for that:)</p>
<p>Pizzagirl: IF the only purpose of elite education is to “make it back” through increased earnings in the workplace. I don’t believe that’s the sole value of an elite education. I, personally, couldn’t GAS if my S at Northwestern winds up making not a penny more than what he would have made going to U of Illinois. That’s not the return-on-investment I seek out of the whole thing</p>
<p>And, that’s totally normal for families with incomes like yours. You and your H aren’t scrimping while your twins are in pricey schools. 
(not being snarky, just a simple fact because you have a very high income, substantial savings, etc. Congrats! You both had a good return on the investment of your education! )</p>
<p>However, when families are taking out Plus loans, co-signing loans, or living paycheck to paycheck while making tuition payments for a higher priced choice, they are more likely going to expect that there’s going to be a good return on the investment (heck, if only to help pay back the loans. 
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<p>I can imagine that there are many debt-burdened parents out there who signed those loan papers thinking that their elite-bound child would be earning $60k+ out of college and would be on track for 6 figures soon after. Imagine their frustration when their child ends up earning the same amount as the neighbor’s kid who went to some mid-level school and has no debt. </p>
<p>Imagine the newish grad’s frustration if he is paying back big loans while his same-income-colleagues who went to less expensive schools are not. </p>
<p>I completely agree that sometimes you’re not just paying for the education aspects or expected return on investment. You’re paying for an experience that you want your kids to have because they’ll gain something not measured by future salaries, etc. Totally reasonable, totally fine. It’s hard to put a price on an undergrad experience that helps grow the naive 18 year old into a more confident 21 year old. </p>
<p>Back to the question in the OP’s subject title: If you can happily pay full freight and you don’t have an expected return on your investment, then choose whatever you think will be the best for your child. If you can only pay full freight if you have to borrow, take from retirement, etc, then don’t.</p>
<p>We struggled with this question back in 2006. My son chose to go to PSU Honors instead of Cornell, Duke, Swarthmore, etc. </p>
<p>He went to school for free and had additional stipends to help with books etc.</p>
<p>4 years later he graduated with a 3.8 GPA, a BS and a BEEE degree, phi beta kappa, two paid research experiences and a great internship under his belt. </p>
<p>He was admitted to a top graduate program in his field.</p>
<p>Our finances have changed during that time. We thought we would have two kids in college at the same time but that ended up not being the case so if we had depended on this for finances it would have been a huge problem. Also we are looking at a possible early and not wanted retirement. Again really disrupting our finances.</p>
<p>So this is what has happened with us. The fact that we didn’t borrow huge dollars for the IVY has helped our family greatly.</p>
<p>The fact that he took advantage of his college education and everything they offered to him was huge. He worked hard and was among many other extremely bright and hardworking students.</p>
<p>I think there is some benefit from the networking provided by having a degree from a well-known university, but only if your kid ends up lving in a place with a lot of alumni. For example, both USC and UCLA have strong alumni networks in California. But if your kid wants to work in Wall Street, he or she might be better off with an East Coast connection. I would just caution people to keep in mind that situations change. You may think you can pay full-freight for an elite private school, but anything can happen: job loss, cancer, earthquake, bombing…your whole life can change in an instant. I am glad my kid chose the lower-price option. She has now graduated with no debt and has a job; I can rest easy, and retire if I have to.</p>
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The reason I like the travel analogy is that it makes pretty clear how fluid the idea of “value” can be. Prague is beautiful, but if you really like to see theater (in English) on your vacation, you might prefer London. We’ve found in our own nuclear family that we have disagreements about what the fundamental value of a vacation is–i.e., relaxation vs. sensory stimulation. With college educations, there are also multiple values involved. Some of them are more basic (i.e., actually learning something), while others are more like luxuries (i.e., a prestige name).</p>
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<p>You did not “waste my time”. You got a degree. That is not a waste of time.</p>
<p>Undergrad vs. Graduate degree:</p>
<p>You don’t say what is your field. Let’s say it is engineering. Who would you rather hire:</p>
<p>Person #1 who did their Undergrad at Caltech (#4) and Graduate School at Ohio State (#29), or</p>
<p>Person #2 who did their Undergrad at Ohio State and Graduate School at Caltech?</p>
<p>Now, if the choice is:</p>
<p>Person #1, as above, or</p>
<p>Person #2 who did their Undergrad at U of MN-Twin Cities (also #29) and Graduate Ohio State?</p>
<p>First, to answer Operadad,
sorry, it is almost insane if person 1 does exist ever? If he/she does exist, he would probably hide his grad degree from his resume, friends, etc. Unless you want to explain to everyone you know of your situation, people would just assume Caltech admitted you just by mistake or you got in just by luck, legacy, etc and now you finally find what fits you in Ohia Stat. No offense to Ohia alumni, you can of course justify how great the school,…
Go back to address the original question on this thread. People just forget what parents have in mind when they pick a school like NYU with say $100K loan over Rutgers free. This decision does happen very frequently in NJ for students with SAT 2000 to 2300 range. Rutgers would love these students over their average profile (around SAT 1800) to boost their selectivity by offering merit aid. This is indeen a very hard decision. I agree to most opinions discussed here. However, what about “parenting prestige”? Even though Rutgers is a very good school in NJ, but is still lags in prestige to all schools ranked #50 or better in US news. I may choose Rutgers over Penn State as the difference in prestige is almost none. But for NYU, or U Michigan, UVa, probably not. People neesds to understand how much a parent invest in his son’s 18 years before that: SAT tutor, activities, clubs,… and parents don;t want to forfeit that and son labeled as “Rutgers material” only if indeed he is not. For a lot of above average kid in NJ, you can get into Rutgers easily without all those extra (called holistic by those schools ranked #30 or bettter)Why do I invest so much moneywise, timewise, effortwise, if I know he can he willl just end up like that! I am sure some parents would not agree but this just a reality. Your friends would congratulate your Rutgers admission but at the same time they already grade your 18 years of parenting effort by whatever college your son get into! The scary thing they will never say that in front you you but I heard it time over time during parents discussion.</p>
<p>I am not sure why we are assuming one won’t go to OSU from Caltech or vice versa. If you look at some of the profiles of faculty members at various institutions, it is quite common. It is a matter of whether OSU has a specific field that is considered outstanding in their research area. Many do indeed go to state schools for research and state schools by far issue the most PhDs in this nation.</p>