Hi,
I was wondering, if I have any chance to be admitted to Ivy League universities. I’m in sophomore year in a competitive high school in Europe and it’s hard to have a high GPA.
Firstly, there are more classes required to graduate than in American high school and almost all of them are very demanding. Secondly, I think that education in my country has a higher level and it’s impossible to have A unless you study long hours or you’re interested in a subject. It’s not like in USA, where I think it’s easier to have A’s if you just want to and study a little bit. I think I am an outstanding student and I would have 4.0 GPA in USA, but as I have already mentioned I went to one of the best high schools in my country and most of students graduate with B in their AP classes and C in other classes just to pass and focus on final exams because they matter in admission to university. To graduate with honours I would have to have 3.75 unweighted GPA and only few students in my school accomplish that, so I was quite shocked when I read that most people are accepted with 3.9 or 4.0 GPA. Of course I could have a higher GPA with much more effort than American students. This year unfortunately it won’t be so high, but I can work on it in junior and senior year. Maybe I should move to less competitive high school with slighly lower, but still higher level in comparison to American high schools? But is it worth it? Is there any chance that I would be admitted to one of top universities with relatively low GPA (at least in sophomore year) and high SAT results or should I focus on European universities instead? I know that I won’t know it for sure unless I apply but is it realistically possible because I need to know whether I should spend time on achieving high GPA and preparing to SAT or focus on European universities and it’s hard to tell from European perspective whether I should try to go to USA or it’s not even worth trying.
Thank you 
What country are you from?
Poland
If you must have a superiority complex, at least don’t display it on your college apps…sounds to me like a pretty flimsy excuse. “Outstanding students” put the time in if that’s what’s required.
Are there standardised exams in Poland, like A levels?
Well for one, I can tell you that in order for me to achieve good grades in my Honors and AP classes, even in subjects I really enjoy and want to pursue as a career, I have to study for hours and work very hard, so your assumption that it’s a walk in the park isn’t accurate for all schools in the US (although I’m sure it is for some and certain people).
As for your main point, GPA is one factor in many that are considered when you send in applications to colleges. For Ivies, you’ll need stellar SAT/ACT, class rigor, ECs, recs, essays, etc. so it’s hard to give you a chance knowing only a small part about you.
Yes, there are, but they don’t matter in USA, so I would have to take SAT exams.
@bodangles, I’m sorry if you feel bad, perhaps I’m wrong and I understand that US students have to study a lot, because I wouldn’t ask here about my chances if they were worse students than me I thought that if in American high schools there are 2 times more students and most of them are graduating, then level can’t be so high. But maybe it’s just the stereotype that American education isn’t so demanding,
It’s more difficult for international applicants to get into American schools. This goes especially for the Ivies, where the overall admissions rate is usually in the teens and the international one in the single digits. Just something to keep in mind. Also, if your family is going to need significant financial aid, only a few of the top schools provide that to international students.
It’s hard not to be offended by this, honestly. Education systems differ, but it’s probably not a good idea to think of your system as superior or above any others. Plus, in the US, the ability to get As varies widely and is dependent on schools themselves, teachers, classes, and the other students, as well as effort and intelligence. There are “easy A” classes but there is no “easy A” schedule that will get us into top universities.
The US system is different in that there is no single test required to get into a university. There are the ACT and SAT, but those are sometimes optional and can be mixed, matched, and retaken. The schools in the United States are going to look at your grades (and Ivies will expect them to be at the top of your class) as well as your entrance exams.
Bottom line, it’s hard to tell you if you have any chance at all because you are a sophomore. Keep your grades up and try to get the best scores possible, take standardized tests, and figure out where to go in a year or so from now.
Why do you want to come to the US to study then if “American education isn’t so demanding”?
Most students graduate school here because the minimum requirements to get a basic high school diploma are not difficult (barring special circumstances). If you don’t have a high school diploma, you are basically unemployable. Almost everyone graduates from high school.
That said, there is a difference between graduating with the minimum requirements met and graduating having taken difficult classes and getting honors, sometimes you even get a completely different diploma. So essentially what goes into a high school diploma varies widely by student.
You have a skewed sense of the American secondary educational system. While it is, indeed, quite different from the European model (which has some serious pros, but equally also cons–just like the US system), generally speaking and in particular the education of the pool of students who compete for admission to Harvard and the Ivies, secondary education is perfectly excellent here. The thing is, the US does NOT have standardized secondary education the European countries have–things differ by state, and then more microscopically depending on the county/city where people live. Some states, counties, cities have rigorous, high quality education that would compete ably with the best secondary systems in Europe (my experience is primarily with German and UK secondary education, FWIW). Other states, counties and cities in the US have absolutely abysmal education that should cause us deep and unrelenting shame. But those kids aren’t your competition for the Ivies.
While I do personally feel there is some grade inflation happening here (I’ve read some of the essays/writing by so-called 4.0 student aiming for Ivies, and their teachers do not have the exacting standards for clarity and purpose of writing that I would have, and certainly that most colleges have), for the most part the high fliers that come out of our best schools who are gunning for Ivies are taking demanding course loads with a LOT of reading, studying, homework, essays, and tests. We promote a broad liberal arts education here PLUS we expect students to do 8 million ECs and be well-rounded, whereas I’ve found European systems demand more specificity (ie: Abitur in Germany, A levels in UK where you pick “focus subjects” and take exams in them) and are more lenient, re: ECs so students can focus on their academics (which is something I personally quite like about the European model–both the specialization and the academic bend).
I would encourage you to not be so derisive, especially as you would seek for these Americans to be your peers at these schools you want to attend! That said, the Ivies, like most schools, would take into account the rigor of education and the grading scale at your school, and you will either measure well against that or not. It’s hard to tell you whether or not you have a substantive chance without seeing your test scores, course load, ECs, etc. But I personally will say that unless you are rich/truly outstanding and/or strongly dislike the European higher education model (which, again, is very different from ours), that you may not find it worth it. University in Europe would certainly be less expensive.
I didn’t mean that American education is not demanding at all, for example there better universities in USA. In Poland there are also more and less competitve high schools and now I see there is a difference between students and I can imagine top students have to study hard as I do if they take demanding classes, I am just curious if I didn’t pay attention to grades in two first years and my cumulative GPA won’t be 4.0 even if I will work on it now, do I still have any chance or does GPA under 3.9 disqualify me?
The admissions officers at the universities you apply to will look at your GPA in context. Meaning, it will be compared to the rigor of the courses you have taken, the other students in your school, and other applicants from your country.
Where do you get your information on the US educational system? Sitcoms??
And if the education in your country is so much more rigorous than in the US, why on earth do you want to come here? If you really are the “outstanding student” you claim to be, I would think you would prefer that “higher level” education you can receive at home.
I see some posts are moderated but nevertheless I think you misunderstood my attitude towards American education and you shouldn’t feel opressed. I don’t feel superior, many people here have 4.0 GPA and I just couldn’t imagine how is it be possible if high school educational system are comparable since it’s hard to have so good grades in my school. The only thing I want to know because I’m still not certain is would my application be even considered if my grades weren’t only A’s in two first years and thererofe cumulative GPA could be below 3.9? I had 3.8 GPA in freshman year.
It is the responsibility of Admissions officers to view your grades within the context of your HS. Since you attend "one of the best high schools " in your country, AOs should be familiar with your grading system and how your grades stack up against others in your school. The fact that you say you didn’t pay “attention to grades” your first two years I take to mean that you are not at or near the very top of your class. If this is true then attending a top school in the US will be difficult because the competition for spots for internationals is brutal. Graduate near the top of your class, get high standardized test scores, do things outside of the classroom that will really make you stand out in the foreign applicant pool and then “maybe” you might have a chance at being accepted. That’s the reality of your situation. With a 5% acceptance rate at schools like Harvard and Stanford, American students don’t exactly have an easy path into these schools either. Good luck!
We don’t have class rank, but I think I’m near the top of my class. Thank you for the answer.
I think you answered your own question.
@IcomefromEurope hello. I am from Poland as well and you can write a private message to me here and we can chat. I have a lot of info that might help you, since I went through tons of threads in here.
and there are some things that you should consider before kinda shooting everything at your GPA. @IcomefromEurope