Is Notre Dame worth the money??

Colleges and Universities A-Z University of Notre Dame
1

<p>Okay, so Notre Dame has been my dream school for about as long as I can remember. I completely understand that Notre Dame is an investment with insane payoffs for many graduates. That being said, I'm guessing right now that if I'm accepted (which is up in the air for me, as it is for pretty much every applicant), I would probably get minimal to no financial aid. </p>

<p>Just for a bit of background, I'd probably estimate my family's gross income to be maybe around 180,000 a year. I'm very aware that this is a highly significant amount, and I know I have been incredibly fortunate to grow up with parents who make so much. However, my parents are freshly divorced, and my mom (the more wealthy parent by a crazy amount) has just taken out a loan for about 200k for a house. She is also the parent who basically refuses to give me any more than about 5k a year for college. My dad has a significantly lower salary, and he would do anything to send me to Notre Dame, but he just can't pour out his entire life's savings for me to go to college, and I wouldn't want him to do that. My older brother goes to a private college as well, and his tuition is about 30k a year, and right now with my current situation we can barely send him there even with his merit and athletic scholarships.</p>

<p>I'm not against taking out some loans for college, especially a university the caliber of ND, but I'm definitely against accumulating so much undergrad debt that I can never recover.</p>

<p>I guess my question is twofold: How much debt is too much for a school like Notre Dame, and is it worth it? I'd like to know now before I even apply to ND and get my hopes up, if that makes sense.</p>

2

<p>First of all, you have my sympathies for your parents’ divorce. It is a difficult time for a teenager, especially during your senior year. I am sorry that you have to go through it.</p>

<p>Based on my understanding of Notre Dame’s FA philosophy, their offer will be based on your parents’ ability to pay - not their willingness. This is also true of every university with which I am familiar.</p>

<p>Your parents’ combined income is $180k. Barring any extenuating circumstances, you will likely qualify for little, if any, FA. Unfotunately, a divorce is not considered an extenuating circumstance. Rather, this would include multiple students in college at the same time; extremenly high medical bills; or other situations beyond the control of the family.</p>

<p>You don’t specify the earnings of your mother and father, only that your mother’s is considerably more. Even if the split is $100k for mom and $80k for dad, your dad will not be able to pull $50k for tuition from his income. He also is unlikely to qualify for loans that large - and that would be a terrible idea anyway.</p>

<p>Have your parents saved anything for your college expenses? With a high income, most colleges, including ND, will expect a family to have put aside a good bit. Also, you stated, “She is also the parent who basically refuses to give me any more than about 5k a year for college.” It would be helpful to get a clear statement and commitment from her rather than “basically” and “about”. If the divorce is fresh, she might have been speaking from an unhelpful emotional position previously that might change over time.</p>

<p>I would suggest that you contact ND’s FA office. I have found them helpful and they respond quickly to requests. I would also suggest that you develop a strategy for convincing your mother that $5k for college expenses doesn’t go far.</p>

<p>Based the information in you OP, I would be pessimistic. However, if ND is your first choice, I would encourage you to apply anyway. Circumstances can change dramatically between now and April (when you would need to submit your deposit).</p>

3

<p>You are asking if basically a 250k cost is worth it for a degree. You have not specified a major so I will answer generally. My answer, as an ND senior, is absolutely not. I have spoken to many seniors who will tell you the same thing in private. By the time you graduate, total cost will be in excess of 60k a year. Ask yourself, aren’t there better things you could do with that money than get a bachelors degree?</p>

<p>Notre Dame is a good school, but it is also probably one of the most hyped schools in the country. Friends of mine that went to state schools also had a great time and ended up getting the exact same job that I did with the same starting salary. Do not buy into the belief that there’s only one perfect place for you, there are many great places. Do not go into serious (over 100k) debt for any school except maybe top Ivies. I have seen too many kids worrying about serious debt for a degree that ultimately isn’t the “investment” they thought it would be.</p>

<p>P.S. If you have any questions about this, feel free to PM me.</p>

4

<p>A Notre Dame degree is worth the money as much as (possibly a bit more) than other higher ranked private schools. Coming out of ND with a gpa > 3 and a business degree (or engineering, pre-law, etc.) is almost a guarantee of a solid investment. That being said, it is near impossible to value and private school as a better investment than many of the better state schools. As jsmithers said, many public school students get the same jobs as ND students. </p>

<p>Probably the most undervalued part of a Notre Dame education is that it has the number one career center in the country. If you really want a job, you will get one (this does require making the trip there once every few months). Even our liberal arts college has incredible job placement (I am someone who almost always advises against going to a private school for a liberal arts degree).</p>

<p>Basically, its a good investment that I am happy I made, but that I would not be as happy with without merit aid. Paying full price is illogical assuming getting into ND also means you could get into state schools.</p>

<p>As a final note, ND has something called quarter dogs. After midnight, they sell hot dogs with buns and condiments for a quarter each. It costs them $0.32 to produce, so I am making my money back $0.07 at a time. If you eat 4 per night every weeknight for your ND career you can save over $200 on hot dogs. And that’s the best investment you can make.</p>

5

<p>Hello!</p>

<p>I am also very sorry to hear about your parents’ divorce… mine are separated as well and I understand how difficult it can be. Correct me if I’m wrong but now that your parents are divorced you do not need to put their combined income on the FAFSA… you should be able to use just your dad’s income. What parent do you live with? Also… your brother being in college will help with FA, I would recommend at least applying and seeing what Notre Dame comes back with to see if your dream is possible, good luck!</p>

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<p>^ Isn’t that Hal Varian who has degrees from MIT and UC Berkeley?</p>

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<p>Our son has narrowed choice to ND and Madison. Wants engineering and math, and Madison is ranked higher in both. And he wants MBA also, so will need money for that. We have two more younger children to pay for, and we would be very hard pressed to make ND work financially. Son would have to take on debt for most of the $100K cost difference. But we know he would love ND and we also think the future network would be helpful. We are more interested in paying now for a future career benefit than for great experiences in undergrad because I think he can find great experiences in both schools.</p>

<p>Can anyone comment on the comparison of the value differences on the future career benefits between ND and a good state school? Worth $100K of debt to the student?</p>

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<p>@TCParent869, just wanted to sympathize with you as we are in almost the exact same boat. We are debating between ND and free ride at Wisconsin state school (not Madison, my S has already decided he doesn’t want to go to such a large school.) We also have two more kids after this one. I think everyone expects us to choose ND because of the prestige, but they aren’t the ones who will be paying. :slight_smile: Hang in there! We don’t know what we are going to choose yet either and it is getting down to the wire!</p>

9

<p>I’m terribly biased, but even at age 17 or 18 I would have agreed to take on the debt and go to ND. </p>

<p>Lou Holtz on ND: “If you’ve been there, no explanation is necessary. If you haven’t, none is adequate.”</p>

10

<p>Thank you AnnikaH and Dad1717. I know that Son and family will love everything about ND except the price. Thie issue is whether $100K in debt to the Son with MBA aspirations is worth the difference. To me it seems unlikely that it is, but I don’t know much and that is why I am posting.</p>

11

<p>Another option not frequently mentioned (and admittedly, not universally applicable) is ROTC. If you are not opposed to serving 4 or 5 years (not sure of the requirement these days), visit the ROTC building - pick a service they are all there - and find out about scholarship opportunities. Then it’s free, you have a job after ND, and get to serve the country. Good gig.</p>

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<p>I know many ND grads. They all loved the school, BUT, they are not exactly making big time money. Far from it. Those who got degrees in fields that have high paying jobs, lots of them out there are doing well, but the rest,…well, the schools pay that ND grad the same as what they pay the state school grad (sometimes state gets more due to easy/ready certification from being in the same state). So don’t count on that degree as an investment with such concrete returns. </p>

<p>For those who can even uncomfortably afford it, yes, I’d tell those parents to go for it, pay it, if you have it. But in your situation, if your parents are going to have trouble paying for a $30K a year cost like your brother now has, ND is a long shot in terms of being affordable. If you can get some numbers, maybe your bro can share what he got from your parents if they aren’t able to give them to you now, and run the NPC for ND, you’ll see what you are looking at in costs. Also look at what merit awards they do have and if you are in the running for them. If you are not and it doesn’t look good for money, you might still want to buy the lottery ticket but with full awareness that this is most likely an unaffordable option for you. </p>

<p>YOU are highly unlikely to even be able to take out more than $5500 in loans freshman year on your own, and to hang that kind of debt that ND will cost on your mom or dad is not something I would recommend even if your dad would sign anything for you. Do look out a bit for him. Some parents do need a little help that way. So it’s not you, but your parents who will have to borrow. </p>

<p>Find out what you and your family will likely be able to afford and start looking at schools and opportunities at that range. It’s easy peasy to find the high priced options. The work is finding the deals. </p>

13

<p>About the only way that ND can make sense for $100K of debt is if, in fact, the student majors in engineering. At least he can pay back the loans with a great paying job. Plus, the national ND network can, perhaps, help him get a great job. </p>

<p>Still, I would hesitate. Is your son a truly great student? Will he make the most of going to ND? Or will let the opportunity slip away?</p>

<p>In other words, it is not about the “undergraduate experience” but the opportunities which might get opened up.</p>

14

<p>There are two questions nearly every prospective student faces: (1) Is ND a good fit for my interests and (2) can I afford ND. </p>

<p>I say “good fit” not “best fit” because I honestly do think there is one college that posses a unique ability to educate its students. Lots of considerations go in the the “good fit” evaluation and those considerations vary for different students.</p>

<p>Can I afford ND? This is the hardest question. A few students get beyond the affordability question because of parental ability to pay or generous scholarships. For most, some combination of parent contribution, scholarships, work study, and loans are necessary. Family circumstances (retirement plans, other kids, current income, savings, future earnings, etc) impact the parental contribution (the parent calculation not he financial aid office’s). The intended area of study and career prospects, and grad school ambitions may impact how much debt the person is willing to take on. The financial comparison to alternatives (State Univ at half the price, Alt-A Private Univ with more scholarship $) is also an individual calculation and consideration.</p>

<p>Based on the number of threads, many people rare wrestling with the affordability question. People share their thoughts but each family must make the evaluation considering their unique circumstances. People should to have the courage and confidence to make the best decision for their families and move ahead.</p>

<p>If ND is a “good fit” and it is affordable, great. If not, then it is no one’s fault (no the financial aid office did not screw you) and the student will have a great opportunity elsewhere. </p>

15

<p>Thanks everyone for the input! I was accepted, and although there will be a sacrifice, my parents have decided to help me a bit and I’m committed to going! I really think it’s going to be worth it! :)</p>

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<p>Congrats LaceyRose17 - you made an excellent decision. My son just recently graduated and had a tremendous experience. We were very impressed by the quality of education and his study abroad experience and the focus on ethics. After the initial freshman adjustment, he couldn’t have been happier with his 4 years at ND. My daughter will be attending ND this fall and we found after visiting Wash U, Emory, Vanderbilt and USC, there really is no other place quite like ND. We are thrilled for her! </p>