I’m having a really tough time trying to decide between UCSD and UC Berkeley. First off I know the pre-med track is hard everywhere and I’m willing to put in the effort. However, I heard that premed at uc Berkeley is pretty much suicide and that even if you try really hard you’ll still get bad grades. I visited both schools and though both have great campuses but i just felt more of a connection with berkely. Right now the only thing that is that’s preventing me from making a decision is the GPA factor at each school. I know that med school places a high priority on GPA and even though i like Berkeley a lot ill prob be more likely get a higher GPA at ucsd compared to Berkeley. Can any current or former premeds share their experiences at berkeley? Is it really that bad?
@Walter924 is pre-Med I think, she can help you out, but with a lot of classes having midterms this week I suspect it might be a few days before she answers. In the meantime if you can somehow figure out some of the classes you plan to take, you can get historical letter grade distributions on this site: https://www.berkeleytime.com/catalog/
also, will i have no social life if i do premed at berkeley lol
A friend’s niece went to Cal and had a difficult time developing relationships with professors (easy time with her TAs). When she applied to grad school, she did not feel close to one professor, enough to ask for a letter of recommendation. I would pick UCSD, where you can develop relationships with professors.
@SGates Isn’t p"pre-med" a bunch of science lower division courses like Biology, Chemistry 1A/B, Organic Chem, Calculus, etc…? With the exception of O Chem, most students would have taken biology/calculus/chemistry already in HS. You can re-take them there and do well (don’t cash in your AP credits).
You still have to have a BS degree in some discipline, but if your degree is in stem, then chances are the “pre-med” classes are part of your degree anyway. There is no such thing as “pre-med” degree, is there? So what makes a “pre-med” major so difficult compared to other majors? Assuming you want to get high GPA which I think everyone does, not just pre-med. My point is being a pre-med doesn’t make your workload harder than any other major. You may have more pressure to keep straight As than other students, but it doesn’t make it necessarily harder.
What am I missing here? Please elaborate.
However, the GPA targets are different, depending on goals.
2.0 good academic standing, graduation
3.0 less chance of being screened out by GPA when looking for post-graduation job
3.0-3.3 entrance to L&S capped majors
3.7 to have a realistic chance of medical school admission (of course, need high MCAT, pre-med ECs, etc.)
So while other students may find that a 3.3 GPA is a perfectly good GPA, pre-meds will find a 3.3 GPA to be unacceptably low.
http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/university-california-berkeley/2071932-grade-distributions-in-prerequisite-courses-for-gpa-based-goals.html has some information on UCB grade distributions, including for common pre-med courses.
https://as.ucsd.edu/Home/InstructorGradeArchive is the UCSD grade archive.
Thanks @ucbalumnus I can’t seem to use UCSD grade link. But I wonder how are the percentages of A- and above for UCSD compared to UCB for the same classes. Are the percentages significantly higher at UCSD? I would love to see side by side but i can’t seem to.
And I wonder the 3.7 minimum requirement is for your entire degree at berkeley or just for the premed classes? If it was the latter I feel it’s easier to achieve than the former.
These intro biology, calculus, chemistry classes, psych, etc., also known as the school’s “weeder” classes (GPA killers), are some of the largest classes on campus. So that would lead me to believe that many students either haven’t taken the AP classes or their advisors have told them to re-take them at the college level. Also, even having a 5 in an AP class, a freshman student will still have to do well on their placement tests to pass out of these intro “weeder” classes assuming their advisor let’s them.
Ya i also have the same question. Is the gpa required for med school gonna only be from the premed classes or the entire cumulative gpa
UCSD has technically worst teachers and the class sizes are just as big, so you’re going to have the same relationship with your professor either way. If you want a relationship, you go to their office hours every week and do your homework there.
Yes Premed is a system of classes, but everyone who’s premed is stuck taking them, even if they took AP or are art majors. But yeah, not a major.
My GPA is 3.854. I’ve gotten a B+ in chem and physics 8A, but an A in everything else, including, Bio, Ochem, and Physics 8B (just do all of the practice problems in the workbook. Solutions are on Google). I pass/no passed Peace and conflict studies and Theater in American Cultures because people in those majors are way better at those majors and you can pass/no pass breadths.
Social life: I work at the dining hall 20 hours a week at the dining hall, volunteer 4 hours a week, I’m in 2 (not premed) clubs, taking 19 units, and I go to sleep 10:30-11. I’m not really big on the social life thing, but if you don’t work, you have plenty of time, plus if you live in the dorms you really do get a whole lot of friends as long as you don’t stay in your room all the time. Dining halls are the best for making friends. I had a great freshman year.
Let’s talk about classes.
Biology has the best lab instructors. They’ve all been doing it for years and they’re funny and know everything about the labs. They frequently say things like “the lab notebook is wrong. This way works better” or “the lab mice are cleaner than food. You can eat them. Also, the dissection teaches you more if you do it without gloves”. The labs are fun, like the one where we all had to go around the grass trying to find the green and brown beads, looking very strange, for a competition lab.
Pete Marsden is a great OChem teacher. I was talking to my UCLA friend and she said that OChem was too much memorization. I didn’t know what she was talking about because Ochem is just drawing pictures and arrows. Ochem at Berkeley is a lot of homework (like 5-20 pages per packet) posted twice a week, never due, but quizzes on Tuesdays in class. So, you’re incentivized to keep up, but it’s on you to decide how much you want to do and when you understand it. There’s no textbook, he actually teaches, attendance isn’t required on Thursdays, and it’s webcast. Actually, most premed classes are webcast, but most of them use iclicker participation to convince people to show up.
Biochem is the worst. It’s like how in AP Bio they say “you don’t have to remember all the steps of glycolysis.” Well, in Biochem you do. But it’s the worst everywhere and it’s curved so even if you get a 60% it’s an A. Just so much memorization. The biochem teachers are okay though.
Premed is fun. It’s fine.
You need to look in the UCSD catalog of the subject abbreviations, such as BILD for biology, as well as what course numbers you are interested in.
Medical schools look at both overall GPA in all college courses, and GPA in all college BCPM (biology, chemistry, physics, math) courses. So you want both GPAs to be as high as possible. Note that college courses taken while in high school do count for medical school GPA recalculations.
@SGates here’s info from 2017 about Cal’s Medical School admit rates: 55% vs 43%
https://career.berkeley.edu/MedStats/national
Go Bears!
Thanks @atanger This is great info! Do you have the same info for UCSD for @SGates as he/she is trying to compare? Or how do i find the stats for other UCs…?
@SGates here’s the GPA&MCAT numbers for Cal students applying to med schools:
https://career.berkeley.edu/sites/default/files/pdf/MedStats/MCAT-GPA%20table%20All%20Apps%20-%202017-2018_0.pdf
Go Bears!!
Its not that UCB is harder, its the competition there that is stiffer, they have a better cohort statistically speaking so the competition for good grades is that much more difficult. If your in a “weeder” class where most of the class has earned AP credit, scored a 5 on the exam, willing to put in 12 hours a day of studying, you’re going to have to work twice as hard just to keep up in that one class, and most likely still end up with a lower grade. The professor cannot give everyone an A.
Thanks @sushiritto
Interesting that of all the fear of UCB grade deflation/suppression - UCB number does look better than UCSD (55% vs. 40%). There you have it @SGates - Still think it’s impossible at UCB?
Thanks everyone for all the stats and links - it’s not everything but it’s a good indicator, much better than hearsay
Be careful with stats like that, the acceptance rate is a reflection of the cohort that attends each university, it is NOT a reflection of your chances to attend medical school (e.g. you are just as likely to be in the top 43% of the UCSD applicants as you are to be in the top 55% of UCB applicants).
This is a few years old so take it for what it is worth.
http://projects.dailycal.org/grades/