<p>I've heard and been told this many times: Stanford has a larger focus on grad students, and it would be better to go to a school with a smaller grad student population or no grad student population at all (i.e. Haverford College, and other small LACs). </p>
<p>What are your thoughts?</p>
<p>What major?</p>
<p>here is a good article on liberal arts vs research [Choosing</a> a Liberal Arts College Versus a Research Institution | Suite101.com](<a href=“Suite 101 - How-tos, Inspiration and Other Ideas to Try”>Suite 101 - How-tos, Inspiration and Other Ideas to Try)</p>
<p>Guess it is a personal preference.</p>
<p>I know quite a few people who go to Stanford and I haven’t honestly heard anyone complain, most are happy and get so many different opportunities available to them.</p>
<p>I plan to major in Biology, so research opportunities are a must.</p>
<p>Didn’t you get lot of feedback here…<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/1317132-choose-stanford-haverford-biology.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/1317132-choose-stanford-haverford-biology.html</a>
and some of them are from the seasoned responders.</p>
<p>I really think it is a personal choice at this point. I know of just one person from my school who chose another LAC (not haverford) over Stanford. It just felt right for her.</p>
<p>Did you visit both schools? Haverford is 1,177 students? That is smaller than my high school. Ok…one thing, Stanford is full of many, many super-achieving students. Maybe Haverford might be a place where you can shine amongst your peers (lesser competition …?) But again, with a smaller school, opportunities are supposedly smaller too.</p>
<p>Do what you think fits YOU. Visit both schools, if you haven’t already.</p>
<p>Simply, yes. There’s plenty of undergraduate focus, although those who know nothing about Stanford or universities like it will assume “university = only grad students matter.” The reality is that both the undergraduate and graduate divisions at Stanford are far more integrated than at most (if not all) universities. You can take grad classes, and grads can take undergrad classes. You have access to the same professors, same facilities, etc. You also work with grad students on research, in student organizations, and the like. The size of the grad population matters little - e.g. Berkeley has 2.5x undergrads as grad students, yet no one would claim that Berkeley is more undergrad-focused. One of the biggest myths propagated on this site is that, by whatever twisted logic, there is some ‘stark division’ between grad and undergrad (and when pressed, people who propagate such crap have nothing to back such a claim up).</p>
<p>Graduate research trickles down to undergraduates. Also do not underestimate the power of a top medical school (research-focused) and world-renowned teaching Hospital on campus.</p>
<p>There is no question that the undergraduate focus/emphasis is going to be stronger at top LACs (Pomona on the west coast, Swarthmore, Amherst, Williams on the east, e.g.). It is also true that the peer LAC’s tend to be a good bit more rigorous (students work harder). You aren’t going to be a physicist without a PhD, so get the best undergraduate education you can and then go to a top university for graduate school.</p>
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<p>Everyone knows that isn’t true at all, so quit the BS and stop trying to make SWA seem equal to or better than Stanford. It’s pathetic.</p>
<p>As a mom of a current freshman, I will say this…Its absolutely mindboggling the amount of research and opportunities at Stanford. We visited many, many schools in the college search process. The majority of them were LAC’s. None can compare to the available research and opportunities that Stanford has. The only problem my S has had this year is trying to limit the number of opportunities he can take. He has made the mistake of trying to take on more than he can chew. Thats how much is available to Stanford undergrads, starting in freshman year. So my advice to anyone attending Stanford is spend the summer thinking about where you want to be in one year. Search for the research, internships and other opportunities in that area and go after them little by little throughout the school year. Again, my S was kinda like a kid in a candy store. He started grasping at everything and then became a bit overwhelmed. Happy but overwhelmed. We had to remind him that it would still be there for him in the future and he has time…</p>
<p>Honestly, there’s just no comparison. Bio has the Bio X, Hopkins, the Hospital etc etc etc</p>
<p>If a LAC-like atmosphere appeals to you, especially in freshman year, check out Structured Liberal Education (SLE). D (a STEM kid, engaged in research right from freshman year) absolutely loved it. If you do a search here, you’ll see threads that give you more details.</p>
<p>One more thing to consider - if you are advanced in your coursework in a particular area, or have an interest in something that is highly specialized, you have the option of taking graduate level courses. That isn’t an option at a LAC.</p>
<p>
Very good point. Many people start taking some grad classes senior, if not junior, year. And Stanford’s grad programs are very strong across the board.</p>
<p>My child is an undergraduate biology major at Stanford. World class. The LACs do not even come close to it. Phanta is right.</p>
<p>I know tons of people who started taking grad-level classes freshman or sophomore year (I took my first one winter quarter freshman year), although it depends on the department. You’re usually prepared once you get past the subfield-specific intro classes (e.g. in CS after you’ve taken the intro to AI class, you can go on to take the grad-level AI classes).</p>
<p>Thank you all for the input throughout my college selection process. Your advice and thoughts have helped so much! I am happy to say that I will be joining the Stanford family :)</p>
<p>^^^Congratulations and Welcome to the Farm!!! The next four years of your life are going to be awesome!!!</p>
<p>Stanford is excellent for biology, as are all these schools. Ignore the ranking, it’s not very meaningful for these small numbers. LACs get a boost due to offering fewer majors than the big schools. To show bio undergrad quality, “Number of Biology Majors” might be better than “Number of Undergraduates” but that hasn’t been tabulated.</p>
<p>Percent of PhDs per gradutate
Academic field: Bio and Health Sciences</p>
<p>PhDs and Doctoral Degrees: ten years (1994 to 2003) from NSF database
Number of Undergraduates: ten years (1989 to 1998) from IPEDS database</p>
<p>Note: Does not include colleges with less than 1000 graduates over the ten year period
2059 5.39% California Institute of Technology<br>
2599 4.77% Reed College<br>
3657 4.40% Swarthmore College<br>
8270 3.29% University of Chicago<br>
11348 3.08% Massachusetts Institute of Technology<br>
1015 3.05% University of California-San Francisco<br>
17855 3.04% Harvard University<br>
2565 3.00% Kalamazoo College<br>
1335 2.92% Harvey Mudd College
2410 2.82% Earlham College
9260 2.68% Johns Hopkins University<br>
11101 2.60% Princeton University<br>
2773 2.60% Haverford College<br>
4936 2.57% Mount Holyoke College<br>
12941 2.50% Yale University
6432 2.47% Rice University
2598 2.46% Lawrence University
4561 2.46% Carleton College<br>
16662 2.45% Stanford University
7067 2.43% Oberlin College
33736 2.37% Cornell University, All Campuses<br>
3229 2.26% Grinnell College<br>
2041 2.25% Hendrix College
2879 2.12% Bryn Mawr College<br>
3740 2.11% Bowdoin College
5840 2.11% Wellesley College<br>
4179 2.06% Amherst College
3578 2.04% Pomona College<br>
2308 2.04% Beloit College<br>
14669 2.02% Brown University<br>
11830 2.00% University of Rochester
2047 2.00% Long Island University Southampton Campus<br>
6751 1.97% Case Western Reserve University
15531 1.94% Duke University
2361 1.91% Hampshire College<br>
1535 1.89% Ripon College<br>
2966 1.85% SUNY College of Environmental Sci & Forestry<br>
2199 1.82% Knox College<br>
5082 1.81% Williams College<br>
3821 1.78% Occidental College<br>
3989 1.75% Allegheny College<br>
2911 1.75% Philadelphia College of Pharmacy and Science<br>
38488 1.75% University of California-Davis<br>
2462 1.75% Juniata College
6901 1.74% St Olaf College
30559 1.74% University of California-San Diego<br>
4113 1.70% Bates College<br>
3945 1.70% Macalester College<br>
56363 1.69% University of California-Berkeley<br>
12784 1.65% College of William and Mary
1363 1.61% New Mexico Institute of Mining and Technology<br>
1971 1.57% Centre College<br>
1092 1.56% Rush University
7081 1.53% Wesleyan University
1277 1.49% Fisk University
1753 1.48% Wabash College<br>
2640 1.48% Hiram College<br>
13887 1.48% Washington University<br>
2081 1.44% University of Dallas<br>
21761 1.40% University of California-Santa Cruz
7162 1.40% Smith College
</p>