Is Wellesley really the #1 women's college? What do Smithies think?

Colleges and Universities A-Z Smith College
21

<p>Depending if Asians are considered an ethinc minority, Wellesley is more diverse. The socio-economic diversity is about the same. Although, I'm not sure of the Wellesley Pell grant #s. I know a few yrs ago they weren't too far behind Smith </p>

<p>Smith</p>

<pre><code> 8% In-state students
82% Out-of-state students
100% Women
1% American Indian/Alaskan Native
14% Asian/Pacific Islander
6% Black/Non-Hispanic
8% Hispanic
52% White/Non-Hispanic
8% Non-Resident Alien
11% Race/ethnicity unreported 

             Wellesley

14% In-state students
86% Out-of-state students
100% Women
<1% American Indian/Alaskan Native
24% Asian/Pacific Islander
5% Black/Non-Hispanic
7% Hispanic
50% White/Non-Hispanic
8% Non-Resident Alien
5% Race/ethnicity unreported
</code></pre>

22

<p>"We also noticed a very different feel while talking to the students. Wellesley students (that day at least) weren't willing to help or talk to us; seemed too busy for visitors. While at Smith, we couldn't have felt more at home."</p>

<p>Ha! When I was eating breakfast at in Hadley, I overheard a conversation between a Mount Holyoke student and a prospective student at both MHC and Smith. The MHC student said that the reason she chose MHC was because when she was on the Smith campus, no one was smiling. When she asked for directions, everyone seemed unwilling to help her. It's amazing how such a small experience can affect one's college choice. When <em>I</em> was on the Smith campus, everyone was smiling. Everyone was helpful. </p>

<p>Why is Wellesley above Smith in the rankings? I suspect the only reason is selectivity and slightly higher SAT scores. (It is said that Smith's scores are lower because they recruit more low income students who haven't had the benefit of SAT study classes, but I don't know that it's true since the differences between Wellesley and Smith aren't that great.) Academically, they are comparable. Prestige-wise, they are also comparable, although Wellesley definitely has a preppy reputation that evokes a certain image of the "Wellesley woman." </p>

<p>Wellesley probably gets more applications because of its location near Boston, one of the most popular areas of the country for college students. Rankings also become self-perpetuating; if USNews says that Wellesley is number 4, then women who want the "best" college possible will apply. With more applications, it can be more selective.</p>

<p>From my d's school, two are going to Wellesley and two to Smith. They are all comparable students; they take the same classes, get pretty much the same grades, and have high SAT scores. The two that applied to Wellesley did not apply to Smith, and vice versa. Each school has a different character, and that should be considered when applying. </p>

<p>Bryn Mawr and Mount Holyoke were both less selective, as everyone in my d's school that applied to those schools got in. That's not to say that those girls are mediocre students - not at all. They are all AP students with excellent grades and scores. They were only a tiny notch below those who got accepted to Wellesley and Smith. </p>

<p>In terms of reputation, Wellesley and Smith do seem to rank above the others. Because of the rankings, Wellesley may be slightly more prestigious among high school students, but not among the general population.</p>

23

<p>When I was eating breakfast at in Hadley]]</p>

<p>Much better for your next visit. You'll love the place.</p>

<p>If you care in the least about your weight, stay away from the bakery. :)</p>

<p><a href="http://www.atkinsfarms.com/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.atkinsfarms.com/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

24

<p><a href="http://www.atkinsfarms.com/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.atkinsfarms.com/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>We stopped there for lunch a couple of summers ago. Yum.</p>

<p>The reason I was eating breakfast in Hadley was because it was in the hotel where I was staying. Breakfast was "free" - and given what I'm going to be paying for the next four years, I'd better take every free meal I can!</p>

25

<p>Breakfast was "free" - and given what I'm going to be paying for the next four years, I'd better take every free meal I can]]</p>

<p>Good point.
Go bless continetial breakfasts. They're free in the better hotels and if you have a goffer(kid) you can eat in bed.</p>

<p>In Paris the CB's in the Hilton by the Eiffel Tower ( with the meat option were 50.00) The French continually find ways to screw Americans.
Neeless to say, we found a way around that :)</p>

26

<p>Sadly, Wellesley doesn't make its Common Data set public.</p>

<p>In 2005-2006, Smith provided $34,721,051 in need-based grants (and $958,700 in non-needbased aid.) For comparison, at Williams the comparable numbers were $21,178,355 (and $0); Amherst $20,548.893 and $0), and Swarthmore $16,279,011 (and $374,352)</p>

<p>As T-Dad notes, likely the major difference in numbers between Smith and Wellesley are the unusually high numbers of Pell Grant, or near-Pell Grant (moderately to very poor) recipiends at the former. (This, by the way, also shows up in the Williams/Amherst comparison, with the former having well more students, but without any significant differences in the total value of grant aid.)</p>

27

<p>You can extrapolate Wellesley’s aid (grant scholarship) by using the 1st yr numbers. 364x4x 26,239= 38,203,908.00. Of course assuming the soph, jr and sr yr numbers are equal to the 1st years is a big assumption; however, I’d be surprised if the figures aren’t close.</p>

<p>Smith does have the Praxis, but with the 2.000 tuition increase, the 1,200 one time donation doesn’t mean much to me. :) </p>

<p>Smith (college hall, Susan Zachery) with a request will fund hotel, airfare, etc., for a student to attend lectures in DC, or any city, if it will contribute to the women’s educational experience and-or personal growth. I haven’t the faintest idea if Wellesley has the same program. </p>

<p>I’m as thrilled as anyone Smith’s aid is so generous (I’ve contribute my share of it over the years) but making the assumption those on substantial aid, or at the income they qualify for a Pell Gant, predicates that student is somehow inheritably different from the majority of the student body is a mistake. Sure, some extremely poor students have lived lives most of us can only imagine. But a kid from a family making 75 k living in SF is far worse off than another student from family making 35k living in Minot ND…..Everything is relative. No cost of living adjustments have been considered when assessing the students place on the financial hierarchy.</p>

<p>I can also assure you, there are more than a few students at Smith on substantial aid who have more disposable income than others receiving little aid. The game is played very well by some families. The grandparents contribute greatly to some students extracurricular finances, including trips to Europe. There’s absolutely nothing illegal about it. Morally? Different issue.</p>

<p>I knew a woman at Dartmouth who was on an almost full ride. No one could figure out how she could eat out, travel to Boston and Burlington for weekends, ski, etc, etc. When she was a sr, she idiotically informed some of us her parents owned numerous rental properties that were never reported on their financial aid forms. Making two sets of tax returns is a breeze--most aren’t notarized.</p>

<p>I was a founding member and on the board of a charitable organization. The stories of attempted fraud, and I’m sure some we never discovered, were ramped.</p>

<p>As Carnegie once proclaimed, making a fortune was easy- giving it away is the difficult part.</p>

<p>Sara, the wife hasen't been ignored. She had other thngs to finish, which gave me time to rant---happy :)</p>

28

<p>Mini, while Wellesley was statistically 5.8 behind Smith in Pell Grant student enrollment, the lower number of Wellesley enrolled students make the actual <em>number</em> of Pell students at each college close enough to be considered equal.</p>

<p>byproportion of Pell recipients, 2000:
Mount Holyoke College 23.8%
Smith College 22.6%
Oberlin College 17.8%
Wellesley College 16.8%Blind</p>

<p><a href="http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache:V_rMhCExFNYJ:www.ticas.org/ticas_d/Need_Blind_Policies_0402.pdf+pell+grant+haverford&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=8%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache:V_rMhCExFNYJ:www.ticas.org/ticas_d/Need_Blind_Policies_0402.pdf+pell+grant+haverford&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=8&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

29

<p>Heehee, I heard the PVTA was called the (change the v to the previous letter in the alphabe]]</p>

<p>You an't change letters to make new anonymous—not kosher. But if you could,what would PUTA stand for?</p>

30

<p>Ohhh dear. The nickname I heard wasn't an acronym, but instead a rather colorful Spanish word...ringing any bells yet?</p>

31

<p>gosh, I really can't say I've heard any of these acronyms. maybe it's something you parents sit around and makeup.</p>

32

<p>gosh, I really can't say I've heard any of these acronyms. maybe it's something you parents sit around and makeup.}}</p>

<p>Hardly, we have better things to do. The Party Van to Amherst (PVTA)has been around forever and was told to me by numeours Smithies.</p>

33

<p>I just found this article in The Cronicle of Higher Education...
<a href="http://chronicle.com/free/v52/i36/36a01401.htm%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://chronicle.com/free/v52/i36/36a01401.htm&lt;/a>
It's always great to see articles that see what great job Smith is doing. I wouldn't be able to attend this great school if I wouldn't get financial aid!</p>

34

<p>Great article. Thanks. </p>

<p>This is interesting too.</p>

<p>"There is one group of students that even Krueger and Dale found benefited significantly from attending elite schools: those from disadvantaged backgrounds. Kids from poor families seem to profit from exposure to Amherst or Northwestern much more than kids from well-off families. Why? One possible answer is that they learn sociological cues and customs to which they have not been exposed before. In his 2003 book, Limbo, Alfred Lubrano, the son of a bricklayer, analyzed what happens when people from working-class backgrounds enter the white-collar culture. Part of their socialization, Lubrano wrote, is learning to act dispassionate and outwardly composed at all times, regardless of how they might feel inside. Students from well-off communities generally arrive at college already trained to masquerade as calm. Students from disadvantaged backgrounds may benefit from exposure to this way of carrying oneself—a trait that may be particularly in evidence at the top colleges."
<a href="http://www.brookings.edu/views/articles/20040902easterbrook.htm%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.brookings.edu/views/articles/20040902easterbrook.htm&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>