<p>Would you agree that good writing skills are the most important hard skill needed to succeed in college?</p>
<p>It seems to me as if improving writing ability is much harder than improving any other hard skill? </p>
<p>For me, it took years and tons of effort to become even a decent writer. </p>
<p>What do you think? Also, in your opinion, do college freshman have enough writing ability to succeed in college and in life afterward? Or do you think that most are vastly underprepared?</p>
<p>I certainly knew engineering majors in my college years at a top university who were poor writers, but went on to have perfectly successful careers without good writing skills. And I have a sibling who is an excellent salesman but can’t write worth a darn… he did fine in college at a middle of the road state university.</p>
<p>I think time management is by far the most important skill to succeed in college and helps a heck of a lot in life.</p>
<p>kiddie, time management is undoubtedly an important skill. However, I was referring more to hard skills than soft skills.</p>
<p>Totally depends on your major. Writing is always a great skill to have no matter what - but it’s not as important if you’re an engineering major or a music major. Sure, you have to write a few papers - but not near as many as you would if you were a political science major, English major, etc.</p>
<p>D2 got a 720 on SAT writing portion, and has always done EXTREMELY well in writing. She’s now in her sophomore year and her profs give her 100s on her papers. So yes, she was a prepared freshman. She’s exceptional, but I think most college bound kids have the writing skills they need.</p>
<p>No, I’d say it’s analytical skills. I don’t know any major that doesn’t require intellectual rigor of some sort. You can skate by without it if you get enough multiple choice tests in college, but to be really successful as a student, you need to be able to think your way through a complex topic.</p>
<p>From what I’ve seen in several tech workplaces and my friends’ experience at various tech companies, writing skills are actually far more important than many undergrads or sometimes even their parents believe. The ones who write well tend to be noticed positively, especially if they’re STEM majors. </p>
<p>On the other hand, I’ve seen many who were fired or failed to even get hired because of poor writing skills. This very issue is one of the reasons why one financial company I worked for refused to hire undergrad business majors from schools lower than the elite level occupied by schools like Wharton, NYU-Stern, UC-Berkeley-Haas, UMich-Ross, UVA-McIntire, etc. They were burned by too many graduates from lower-level undergrad b-school graduates in their local area in the past. </p>
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<p>None of the veteran Profs/TAs I know who currently teach nor most employers I know would agree with that. It also doesn’t jibe with my own experiences as an academic tutor during my undergrad nor my observations of my TA friends’ freshman essays* while I was visiting them. </p>
<p>From all of that, the consensus seems to be that only a minority of incoming college freshmen, even those at top 30 schools have writing skills adequate for college-level work. Assessments tend to be worse among long serving Profs who taught college before the 1980’s. </p>
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<li>Some of them are grad students at the Ivies so this issue isn’t limited to lower-tiered colleges.</li>
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<p>If you can’t write to save your life, all the analytical skills in the world won’t save you :).</p>
<p>I don’t agree and don’t know the point of the question.</p>
<p>Multiple skills are required at different times with varying importance depending on the task at hand. Writing wouldn’t be the most critical skill for a math major most of the time. Writing is also a secondary skill in many cases when faced with a writing assignment where critical and analytical thinking are really the primary capabilities and the writing just a means to an end in portraying proficiency in the particular analysis.</p>
<p>You can have all the written skills down pat but if you don’t understand the subject the pencil will be at rest on the paper. Adequate written skills should already be in place well before college. At many colleges, especially the more selective ones, most of the college Freshman are prepared adequately. </p>
<p>Writing skills can be honed and improved over time and an adequate level of skill can be more difficult for some than others, just like math capability can be honed, critical reading can be honed, knowledge in any subject can be honed, but I don’t think the vast majority lack the level written skills they need to succeed in college unless it’s a college with a very low selectivity practice that regularly accepts students not even at an 8th grade level of skills or if the student is an ESL student who has a low level of capability in the English language.</p>
<p>Reading comprehension?</p>
<p>GladGrandDad,</p>
<p>Check out this book by Emory University history, Patrick Allitt:</p>
<p>[I’m</a> the Teacher,You’re the Student: A Semester in the University Classroom: Patrick Allitt: 9780812218879: Amazon.com: Books](<a href=“http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0812218876/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=0812218876&linkCode=as2&tag=hubp0dc7f-20]I’m”>http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0812218876/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=0812218876&linkCode=as2&tag=hubp0dc7f-20)</p>
<p>In it, he bemoans the middling writing skills of many of his students. He also gives brief writing advice to students/young people and thinks that high schools should provide more writing instruction.</p>
<p>My computer science son had to take three courses in his entire college career that required writing and he doesn’t need to write in his job now that he’s graduated either. He’s not a bad writer, but he loathes it. He reads extraordinarily fast BTW and got 800s on every verbal test he ever took. He knows what good writing sounds like. :)</p>
<p>My younger son writes all the time several papers a term in nearly every course he takes. He’ll probably need to write in any job he gets as well. (IR major.)</p>
<p>For me as an architect - I don’t do a huge amount of writing, but do a few zoning / architectural review boards each year which require some writing and also oral presentation skills.</p>
<p>DH (cancer researcher) does a lot of writing (grants and papers) and a lot of oral presentations at meetings. Probably more than he realized would be necessary when he got into the field. He learned a lot about scientific writing from the guy he did his dissertation with.</p>
<p>"None of the veteran Profs/TAs I know who currently teach nor most employers I know would agree with that. It also doesn’t jibe with my own experiences as an academic tutor during my undergrad nor my observations of my TA friends’ freshman essays* while I was visiting them. </p>
<p>From all of that, the consensus seems to be that only a minority of incoming college freshmen, even those at top 30 schools have writing skills adequate for college-level work. Assessments tend to be worse among long serving Profs who taught college before the 1980’s."</p>
<p>If only a minority of incoming college freshman have adequate writing skills - why are they graduating from college? Pretty simple - if they are not prepared, they should fail, no? </p>
<p>Since this is not the case, I am thinking that most students are “adequate”.</p>
<p>Cromette, music majors write plenty of papers, believe me. A music major in a BA program is an academic major, not a performance major, generally.</p>
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<p>Actually, engineering students and engineers have to do plenty of writing in the context of lab reports, project plans and documentation, research papers, PhD theses, etc…</p>
<p>However, writing about technical subjects is somewhat different from writing about humanities subjects, and writing for others in your field is different from writing for those with no special knowledge of your field.</p>
<p>I bote for analytical skills and reading comprehension. I would put writing skills directly beneath that. </p>
<p>Writing skills are something that can be learned but if you can’t keep up with the reading or understand the material, you are more likely to fail.</p>
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<p>Writing is certainly an essential skill for a math major – if a math major cannot write down the proof that s/he is thinking of, s/he will have a hard time convincing others of its validity. Now that paper and computer storage are widely available, a mathematician should not have the excuse that there is not enough room in the margin of the book s/he is reading.</p>
<p>Of course, writing mathematical proofs and the like is extremely different from writing about humanities subjects.</p>
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<p>However, most colleges, including the more selective ones, do have graduation requirements that include college-level writing or writing-intensive courses. That implies that the colleges do not think that the writing skills that high school graduates should have are sufficient for college graduates to have.</p>
<p>At less selective colleges, many students have to take remedial writing courses before being allowed to take the college level writing courses.</p>
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<p>Not necessarily. First, some students pick those skills up in college. However, most old-school Profs I’ve had were of the opinion that college was for the refining of writing skills to a fine edge not for the teaching of writing basics which they felt should have been covered during K-12. </p>
<p>Secondly, I’ve known of plenty of older business exec/engineer relatives, employers, and HR colleagues have bemoaned the poor writing skills of many college graduates…especially those who were STEM or business majors from schools other than top ones like Wharton or NYU-Stern. </p>
<p>In fact, this was one key reason why one former employer refused to hire undergrad b-school graduates outside of the elite tier. </p>
<p>Also, one former supervisor who was an engineering major (1978 graduate) himself recalled that so many employers have found prior engineering grads from his and other schools had severe writing skill deficiencies they wrote/called into the Engineering school deans to complain and demand curriculum changes to address those problems. It’s a factor in why his incoming class was the first at his college to be required to take more writing and non-STEM writing-intensive humanities courses than prior ones. </p>
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<p>I don’t think you can separate analytical skills and reading comprehension from writing skills. If you are deficient in either skill, your writing skills will not be up to tackling college-level work nor the requirements of many workplaces. </p>
<p>IMO, taking either out of the equation is like saying one can be a good writer without knowing the language or the underlying alphabet.</p>
<p>I would say: 1) reading, 2) writing and 3) time management.</p>