<p>It does seem that the frat scene is dominant. Like I said, I didn't really experience any of it, but I definitely felt separated from the rest of the prospies and the other students. I got some weird reactions when I said I was staying in East Wheelock (which I would definitely apply to if I go to Dartmouth next year) and I got some very unsupportive reactions when I mentioned I was going to the 10:00 mass at Aquinas House on Thursday. However, it was only when I was hanging either with the East Wheelock "nerds" or over at AQ that I felt really welcome. While both communities seem really great, I'm not really sure if I want to go to a school where my social status will segregate me from everyone else. Don't get me wrong, everyone on campus seemed very friendly, but it just didn't have the community feel I have observed at some other colleges.</p>
<p>Speaking of East Wheelock, I was wondering if anyone knows how difficult it is to get housing there. Apparently there's an application process, but it is it just a formality--does everybody who wants to live there get the chance to? Or is it a competitive application?</p>
<p>75% of those who apply for East Wheelock get it</p>
<p>Shellzie,</p>
<p>I definitely would not worry about it as you only spent 3 days on campus. While some students do form fast relationships that last, I agree with Raspberry that once you meet more people, you will be suprised as the number of students that have the same interests as you and will find your niche.</p>
<p>
[quote]
75% of those who apply for East Wheelock get it
[/quote]
</p>
<p>That is not a true assumption as there are only 120 slots available to the first year class so it would depend on the number of first year students applying for housing. There are a number of students who applied for EW freshmen year, did not get in, applied again during sophmore year and still did not get in.</p>
<p>The best part of Dartmouth for me was the relaxed nature of the place as opposed to other schools. Relaxing and hanging out with friends, hiking up to the firetower, jumping off of the river ranch into the connecticut during summers, study abroad, hilarious fun people just talking for hours, and skiing, etc were my favorite things to do at Dartmouth.</p>
<p>The sad thing is that drinking happens on almost every campus in the country some at higher rates than others. But the otherside of the coin is that you will also find a lot of students at any given campus who are non-drinkers.</p>
<p>Article from today's Newark STAR-LEDGER discusses recent incidents of alcohol abuse at Princeton:</p>
<p>*Following reports of sex crimes and other dangerous incidents, Princeton University officials and students are looking to curb alcohol-fueled problems at the Ivy League school. </p>
<p>Reports during this school year include some of students drinking each others' vomit and requiring emergency medical treatment. </p>
<p>This month, members of the Tiger Inn, a fraternity-like eating club with a reputation as Princeton's "Animal House," pledged to ban alcohol and reform its policies to keep its parties from getting out of hand.</p>
<p>The club's new policies, prompted in part by an alleged sex crime during a party in November, even forbid any sexual activity beyond kissing on club premises and require that rooms outside common areas be off-limits and locked on party nights.</p>
<p>"In the fall, winter, early spring, there were a number of events that took place that we weren't too happy about," said Hap Cooper, a 1982 Princeton graduate who is president of the Inn's alumni-run board of governors. "That typically resulted from social situations where alcohol was served. In a number of cases, property was damaged, things happened."</p>
<p>On college campuses, alcohol is a factor in most sex cases, according to university Director of Public Safety Steven Healy and the Mercer County Prosecutor's Office.</p>
<p>In the Tiger Inn incident, Princeton Borough police charged junior Stuart E. Anderson, 20, with sexually accosting a female student inside the club....</p>
<p>The university's health department has seen an increase in students reporting sexual assaults. Robinson-Brown said that doesn't necessarily mean there have been more incidents. It could be a result of increased efforts by health services "to encourage students to come forward...."</p>
<p>From 2002 through 2004, Princeton University reported 21 forcible-sex offenses that prompted criminal investigations, according to the most recent college crime data available online from the U.S. Department of Education. Eight of those alleged incidents occurred in 2002. Ten were reported in 2003 and three in 2004." *</p>
<p>Shellzie,</p>
<p>Good to hear you enjoyed AQ. It's a very special place, and they always have a ton of stuff to do. It's one of my favorite places on campus</p>
<p>I had my doubts about Dartmouth. After Dimensions though I am completely in love with it(faxing my enrollment paperwork in tomorrow). I love the students, the teachers, the light-heartedness, the food EVERYTHING. And, yes, there was alcohol and smoking...but there was so much more than that. Hopkins always has some show going on (in fact on Saturday I went to a Bossa Nova concert there). The different performing groups also put on shows . I seriously had a blast at Dartmouth...I did not think I would like the Greek scene a lot, but the 90s party was awesome, lol. I guess I got kind of lucky because my host was very detached and did not want to do anything with me(it's okay she's very busy with lots of activities), so I got the freedom to walk around and go to several classes and really explore what Dartmouth has to offer. It was such a wonderful experience for me. I'm so sorry that some of you did not get to see past the drinking and smoking....</p>
<p>DJimaeW87,</p>
<p>Your experience is, by-far, more typical of the Dartmouth vibe and life than those sincerely stressed and worried posting above: you will find what you seek at Dartmouth--looking for a bad time?...if you need one, you will find one, of course; to a weatherman, only inclement weather is really news.</p>
<p>I love every day here, really.</p>
<p>
I think it's important to realize that in college, you will find a subset of like-minded people to hang around with, as opposed to the entire campus. If you felt comfortable at AQ and EW then you have already identified a group. That's a wonderful first step!</p>
<p>Thanks for the input, sjmom- that is the main reason why I still cannot make myself turn down Dartmouth just yet. I loved a lot of things about it- but it seemed like a lot of the people I met looked down upon the subsets of people with which I would most likely identify and I'm just not sure if I want that either. And, whether its the only thing to do or not, the frat culture still seemed very dominant and several times I found myself in groups of otherwise nice people that I had nothing to say to- as they were busy talking about all the frats they had been to.</p>
<p>Dartmouth is called a happy ivy for a reason. To be honest, the fact that students have fun as opposed to studying 24/7 is one of the reasons I applied to begin with.</p>
<p>If you seek a cloistered environment in which you are chained to the library, go to Caltech. If you seek to surround yourself with misfits, oddballs and nerds, go to Caltech.</p>
<p>If you seek to meet and go to school with the most awesome people in existence, go to Dartmouth. If you seek to work hard AND play hard, go to Dartmouth.</p>
<p>With that said, I can't wait for the fall to roll around. Dartmouth's gonna be awesome.</p>
<p>Shellzie--</p>
<p>If you want to talk about it, send me a PM. As someone who identifies with some similar group, I may be able to help.</p>
<p>I lived in East Wheelock, I went to frats, I am now happily a brother at a frat, and honestly nobody cared what dorm I lived in. It wasn't a big deal. I only chose to live in East Wheelock because the rooms were huge and there were private bathrooms, and as it turned on I had an all-freshman floor that was really ragey and awesome. That said, I didn't choose to live in East Wheelock again this year, one of the reasons being how far it is from everything else on campus, frats included. I also know plenty of people that don't drink and don't go to frats, and they enjoy themselves at Dartmouth, too. Quite frankly, they just find things they are passionate about or interested in and get involved in that. Nobody at Dartmouth whines that they are miserable or that there isn't enough to do. Everybody, whatever their interests, whether they drink or smoke or don't or whatever, seems really in tune with D.</p>
<p>With that said, a word of advice to the people in this post that were bothered by the fact that there was drinking and smoking going on. That's going to happen at every college in America (discounting places like Brigham Young and Bob Jones) and it's simply put a part of typical college life. Nobody is going to force you to drink or smoke pot or do things that you don't want to do. If you don't want to drink or smoke or go to frats, here's an idea, don't. There are going to be other people that aren't interested in frats and partying and it's just a matter of making the friends that are right for you, just like it would be in any other situation. I don't understand what use it is to get bent out of shape that other people are getting drunk or high. Other people aren't going to dictate your life for you. I'm sorry if this seems harsh and I don't mean to sound like an ******* although maybe I do a little bit right now, but I just don't understand this attitude. There's nothing revolutionary about Dartmouth's social scene, it's just like 98% of other colleges: lots of people drink and lots of people don't. You are free to make your own choices about how to act and whom to associate with. That's part of the point of college. If you are going to go looking for a school where everybody else is exactly like you, you are going to be looking for a very long time. Just some food for thought.</p>
<p>Xantos, I appreciate what you have to say. I am an alum. However, every student (especially with a $45 k price tag) has a right to feel comfortable. What a few of the posters are saying is they did not. They felt that the decisions they are making would put them at the bottom of the social hierarchy. I respect that and encourage those students to ask a lot more questions. I think there is a place for everyone at Dartmouth, but I respect that there are folks who may not be as comfortable with a Greek system on a remote campus. Trust your gut in this process. Don't get caught up in the name. These next four years are some of the best of your life, trust your instincts.</p>
<p>Xanatos,</p>
<p>I definitely agree with you that that is the type of social atmosphere that you are going to find present at many colleges. But here's the thing-- most of those other colleges are not two and a half hours away from the nearest big city and cultural center. While there may be other things to do at Dartmouth, I know that my main concern, as well as that of others on this board is simply that should we choose to skip out on the frat scene, we will be missing out on a large portion of campus life in general. At other schools, the partyers can take it off campus to an apartment or a nearby bar, or other people can go off campus to avoid things like that. At Dartmouth, you can't. We aren't looking for a school where everybody else is exactly like us, but we are just trying to make sure that there are plenty of options.</p>
<p>So does that mean that if you go to a college with a city nearby, you would escape to the city every weekend to escape the potheads that proliferate the campus, thereby missing out on everything that is college? </p>
<p>There are a lot of drugs and alcohol on campus, and you'll find that anywhere that is not (1) a service academy (2) BYU, Grove City College, etc.
And perhaps as you age, you'll either realize that this isn't a big deal (people do whatever they wana do, ain't got nothing to do with you) or you just become desensitized. BUt that's not necessarily a good thing.</p>
<p>In any case, let me tell you, when you say that it seemed like these people at D seemed to look down on the subset of people that you'd identify with--it's likely not true. Drugs are surprisingly prevalent at Dartmouth, but it's still definitely not a majority of the people. I think that you'll find, as far as drugs go, people don't really care. Like someone pointed out above, smokers will chill with smokers, and therefore that would have made it seem like everyone at D was a smoker (and the 420 thing too).</p>
<p>As for the drinking, this is one thing that I've noticed (and dislike)</p>
<p>There are two kinds of non-drinkers at D.
1) Are the anti-alcohol, anti-greek kids who hate life
2) Are the kids who really don't care. They can hang out at a house without having a beer and have fun. Or they can hang out at Lone Pine and eat their crappy burritos and have fun. </p>
<p>There's no lying that Greek culture dominates Dartmouth. 60% of people you meet will be a part of the system. I'm not saying go out and drink, cuz you don't have to. And you won't be pressured or forced, nor will you feel all left out because you didn't partake in the powerboot competition last weekend. But if you're always gonna be ****ed off about it, and "feel uncomfortable", then don't come to Dartmouth.</p>
<p>Hear, hear, sologigolos.</p>
<p>These people that whine and complain about a fact of life at ANY college need to either get over themselves or go somewhere else. </p>
<p>IMO, Dartmouth is a love it or leave it situation. If you're not sure you'll love the school, don't matriculate! I know there are people on the waitlist who would gladly and without apprehension take your spot.</p>
<p>Look, I respect everybody's opinions on this thread. I'm not forcing anybody to do anything, quite frankly. But there are some what I consider to be strange attitudes here that I felt like pointing out. I just feel that a lot of the people on this thread are approaching their college decision with a high school mentality: "Oh no, I have to drink to fit in, otherwise everyone is going to think I'm a freak." This is college and everybody is an adult. The vast, overwhelming majority of people here are accepting of a broad range of different preferences, even if those preferences are not their own. I've honestly never seen somebody at Dartmouth act like a douchebag to somebody else's face because of the clothes they were wearing or where they lived on campus or whether they chose to drink or not. If anything THAT behavior is looked down upon here more than any other.</p>
<p>But of course, if you really feel you will never get comfortable here, it probably will be a mistake to attend.</p>
<p>oh another note about alcohol:</p>
<p>a lot of athletes can't/don't drink during the season. even when they're pledging a fraternity. not to say all of them (all 40%) don't but many, many, don't.</p>
<p>like xanatos pointed out, no one's going to point finger at you if you choose not to drink or roll or whatever. the issue would be to make a big deal out of it all. as long as you ain't pointing fingers at the dude booting in the corner or that quad down the hall that seems to be filled with smoke 24/7, no one's gonna point fingers at you either.</p>