<p>You are including top schools that may as selective as the “Ivy schools” in a list labelled “safeties”, which really makes one wonder what’s the objective of this thread? For it definitely doesn’t help much those (Ivy caliber kids) who need advice on safety schools. Many of the schools you mentionned reject Ivy caliber kids. So please, in order to make this thread (which is very well structured, thank you for being so painstaking) more helpful, or less misleading, try to make sure that the schools you mention as safeties or matches are actually real safeties and not Ivy equivalents. Thank you!</p>
<p>^I have made such a clarification after tk brought up the same point. Can you point out exactly where you feel the distinction is unclear?</p>
<p>Nice list 
Thanks, and bump.</p>
<p>On the public honors college, I would include Barrett’s at Arizona State as a great option for Ivy caliber students, including OOS.</p>
<p>Another thing worth pointing out for Minnesota’s low tuition–its 11K in state, 15K OOS, but only 8K for residents of Wisconsin. In return, you can add that whatever Wisconsin’s OOS rate is, its only 11K if you live in Minnesota.</p>
<p>It’s nice to see this thread of mine resurrected. Thanks for the details on MN/WI reciprocity, MSauce.</p>
<p>I personally am still ambivalent about Barrett Honors College at ASU [Arizona]. On one hand, the “perks” are really amazing, even for an honors program; on the other hand, the rigor of ASU’s regular curriculum has yet to improve much, from what I’ve heard. It seems to me on par with UAlabama, similarly putting tons of money into Honors but comparatively straggling if one compares the non-honors rigor to a school like UMichigan.</p>
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<p>I believe you have confused Wesleyan College in Connecticut, which is a coeducational institution - with Wellesley College in Massachusetts, which is an all-women’s institution. Both have many applicants who also apply to Ivies, although Wellesley is more highly ranked in USNWR (#4 vs. #13 for Wesleyan). </p>
<p>BTW, Wellesley has a very substantial Asian population (~25%) regarding this category.</p>
<p>No, I think Keil meant Wesleyan College in Georgia. (Nitpick: the famous Wesleyan in CT is Wesleyan University.)</p>
<p>[url=<a href=“http://www.wesleyancollege.edu%5DHome%5B/url”>http://www.wesleyancollege.edu]Home[/url</a>]</p>
<p>Brilliant post! Can someone please post some more info on public honours colleges?</p>
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<p>I stand corrected. I was surprised that Wesleyan University OR Wellesley College would be on a list of “safety schools” for anyone, including Ivy-Aspirants. Both have their share of people accepted at an Ivy, but not at one or the other of them.</p>
<p>Agreed its a pretty solid and inclusive list with some refreshing names in there. </p>
<p>The only factor that people leave out is the subjective appeal factor, which only the student/parents can determine obviously, since its well…subjective! </p>
<p>Great schools can be rejected by students if they get a vibe that isnt them when they are on campus, or a tour guide is snotty or a dolt. Or like us, when walking through the Duke Library saw something my D1 didnt like. </p>
<p>The great message is that with over 2,000 choices, students have so much to be excited about (instead of being stressed about…), which is my core message to kids. RELAX! You are going to college and will get in. </p>
<p>And to answer Keil’s comment about low percentage of asians at Davidson, I don’t know the answer there…its not the school. People there are from all backgrounds, socio-economic, political and geographical. What I “think” is happening there is that its simply not on the radar of many Asian parents, and Asians are unusually focused on prestige and “name” schools and have an unusual influence on their children’s choices. That is a generalization to be certain, but its also a largely true generalization. I know from my D1’s Asian friends it was absolutely true. They picked Duke and Yale and never even considered Davidson. When we mentioned it, they blew it off as not prestigious enough. We laughed…“silly goose, its every bit as prestigious as Duke, its just a different campus and smaller and not quite as well known nationally.” </p>
<p>While its frustrating for admissions counselors at schools to dispel myths and attitudes about their schools, they also believe fervently that they want kids on their campuses who truly want to be there. Nobody wants people who are smug and cynical and negative karma types because a bad apple can spoil the entire bin of apples. </p>
<p>In this economic climate, money matters more than ever before (and with rising tuition prices). So for many kids, its all a matter of who gives them the best package of aid/scholarships. To that we all acknowledge reality, but also advise that its important to measure (as best you can) the “value of an education” or “the investment value” of an education…and sometimes it might be more advantageous to you to take on higher debt. </p>
<p>I am a huge believer in “fit.” Fit makes for happy and successful students. Fit means good things can happen for you and for the school. Mutual admiration society. </p>
<p>As many of you prepare to head off to college (high school graduations all done but for the cleaning up after the parties), I commend you on your successes, and wish you all the best. Remember to be thankful to those who helped you get there: teachers, parents, friends, siblings, CC’ers, ministers, counselors and neighbors. Now go and have a great time, work your hardest, prepare for a lot of CHANGE, be FLEXIBLE…stuff happens especially in college dorms freshman year, and work to make this a better place for everyone.</p>
<p>God bless.</p>
<p>pbleic, I did indeed mean Wesleyan College in Georgia (with full thanks to curmudgeon for the recommendation). So easy to get all the variations of Wesley/Wesleyan/Wellesley mixed up, though!</p>
<p>Davidson is curious to me because its Asian percentages lag below those of comparable LACs–which, excluding Wellesley, are equally as little-known to Asian parents, trust me. But perhaps the Southern location plays a role in that. Nonetheless, it represents an even-better-than-excellent opportunity for LAC-positive high-achieving Asian students who might otherwise be overrepresented.</p>
<p>Thank you to all who have contributed to this useful guide! My daughter is making her final decisions about where else to apply. Does anyone have updates or additional opinions to add now that we’re in the middle of application season?</p>
<p>If your D has the stats to get into Ivy-type schools, I am not sure why she would be looking much lower than the top 10 LACs or the top 30 universities.</p>
<p>A good way to go about this is to pick the geographic part of the country you want to live in, then determine which schools within these 40 universities are in the appropriate location. Once you have reduced the number of schools down geographically, take some time to visit the schools that stand out. Each university has a different feel and type of atmosphere. This approach should help you narrow the list down to a handful of great schools. You could also leave a state school on your list just in case.</p>
<p>I disagree with Davidson as a “low” reach. I know several NMFs that were rejected and several admitted with no merit money. They are big on athletic recruitment which may skew the admission numbers. Many of the schools mentioned, are safeties for admission, such as Smith, but you need to be Ivy caliber for merit aid.</p>
<p>Also, honors colleges at top state schools such as UNC, are not safeties. Many NMFs are not admitted.</p>
<p>I thought this thread was about Ivy-Caliber schools, not something called Davidson.</p>
<p>Davidson College is one of the LACs tied for #9 in the US News ranking. Informative, by your own standard, someone with Ivy-caliber stats should focus on top 10 LACs (along with the top 30 universities).</p>
<p>But I disagree that this is a good standard for “Ivy-caliber” safeties and matches. For most students with Ivy-caliber numbers, the Ivies are still a reach. For most of the same students, each of the top 10 LACs is also a reach. Harvey Mudd, Swarthmore, Pomona, Amherst and Williams are all about as selective as Cornell, Dartmouth, Brown and Penn. They also are all very expensive. They grant few if any merit scholarships.</p>
<p>For most students with Ivy-caliber numbers, the lowest-ranked LAC I would begin to consider a match is probably Grinnell (#18).</p>
<p>As the OP, I definitely disagree with informative’s standards. But I would also note that NMF means absolutely nothing when it comes to determining an “Ivy-caliber” student. Merit scholarships are also an entirely different tophat of Halloween candy.</p>
<p>The reason I mention merit scholarships is because they can make a fairly significant difference in the out-of-pocket costs for middle class students who are just a little too affluent to qualify for need-based aid. This can be an important factor in choosing match and safety schools. </p>
<p>By “Ivy-caliber” safeties and matches, I don’t necessarily mean a school that offers all the qualities of an Ivy League university. I mean a good school that could be attractive to a student whose stats are in Ivy range, but whose ECs or financial situation is iffy.</p>
<p>I have a question for you all. What would you guys suggest as a safety/ match large public university in or near the northeast that has good academics, and good sports teams? 2300 SAT, published author, etc?</p>