Ivy League Candidates: Don't Apply Early!!

Applying to College
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@ccprofandmomof2

Hi! I think my timeline was fairly typical for most students. I applied to 14 schools in total.

Over the summer, I filled out my Common App and started brainstorming CA essay topics. I was at an intensive academic summer program for the majority of the summer (4 hours of reading a night, research paper, etc.) so I couldn’t start essays then. I imagine that most high-achieving students are doing something over the summer, whether it is working, travelling, marching band, attending a summer program, etc. However, I was done with my CA, essay and all, by mid-September. I did not feel rushed at all and had a lot of time to edit my CA essay. I then went through my applications one by one. I did my supplements for Yale, edited, and submitted, and then moved on to my other EA schools, many of which were safeties. I was done with all 6 EA schools by mid-October, and then began working on all of my RD applications.

In the months I spent in between EA and RD applications, I found a lot of resources online, particularly on YouTube. There are a ton of valuable videos on there, and many, many school-specific advice videos from students, admissions panels, and the schools themselves, all of which I found pretty late into my application process. Before doing anything, I would recommend binge-watching the more general videos about the CA and what admissions officers look for; they resonate much, much more than a College Confidential post or a PrepScholar article, as helpful as those two resources are. It’ll give someone an idea of what they need to do, and also give them a resource to go back to when editing their application.

Again, I would recommend waiting to do the more heavy-hitting schools. After applying to Yale, I applied to all of my EA safeties and a few EA targets (all public schools that I wanted to hear back from). In the RD round, I applied to my targets first and saved Brown, UPenn, and Harvard for last. For example, the UPenn supplement, which I wrote last, used whole blocks of text from 3 different supplements and incorporated a recent life experience. I think it was the best essay I wrote. Throughout the whole process, I was constantly making edits to my CA activities section, changing wording to make my actions really stand out, per the advice of YouTube videos.

With this timeline, I didn’t know that my Yale EA application was weak when I submitted it. It didn’t occur to me, at the time, to change this or that or switch the wording or alter the order or write about that thing that I did that time. That really came with time and practice, which I got after applying to my 10 safeties and targets.

Obviously, this is just advice for my timeline. If someone can start early in the summer, watch the videos, read the articles, and begin writing essays for safeties and work their way up, power to them. They will probably have a very strong application by November 1 and could apply EA with the same confidence that I applied to Harvard, Brown, and UPenn during the RD round.

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@billscho My application definitely wasn’t rushed–it just wasn’t good. I had a month to complete it. Applications, like anything, take practice, experience, and research. The time between EA and RD gave me valuable insight that made my later applications very strong. I imagine this is similar with many, many kids.

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I generally think that despite what the schools say that EA does provide an advantage. The Ivies and other elites do want kids from crummy public schools. But then again having resources does provide a distinct advantage. So it is a mixed bag. A lot of where you get in is how you present yourself. I also don’t think Essays by themselves make a huge difference. It is the whole package that makes a difference. It is holistic admissions

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@lesjubilants again, very valuable advices and thank you for sharing. U sound so grounded and well-versed, u will be a great asset in any schools u apply to.

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@planner03 - @worriestoomuch said that the school district in which the Intel winner was educated was “poor” which is not the same thing as “crummy.” I was a student in a poor school district - just like the one @worriestoomuch describes - through 8th grade, but received a full scholarship (as a white student ) to attend a very demanding, competitive, private high school. I was very lucky to get into Yale SCEA.

My friends - white, black, hispanic and asian - who remained in my former public school, some of whom were Intel or Siemens finalists/winners, also got into great colleges. They didn’t have “significant outside financial support.” They did however have the support of incredibly idealistic, hard-working and talented teachers. Those who needed financial aid to attend college received it. None us us spent a cent on private college counsellors. What we all had in common as students was a passion for learning, a thirst for knowledge and an established record of interests, hobbies, that surfaced at a very early age, and which morphed over time into personal accomplishments well before we were aware of college or its various admissions hurdles.

So, as @skieurope wrote succinctly above, “People from crummy public schools needing FA get into Ivy League colleges every year. However, they probably worked on the application for months ensuring that their essays were as perfect as they can be.” Based on my own, as well as my peers’, college application experiences, I would whole-heartedly agree. So, my advice tor those students who have all their academic and testing “ducks in a row” during the summer following their junior year, use your summer to outline, draft, write, re-write, edit and re-write your college essays, short answers, etc., and if you are convinced the written portion of your application is the very best you can do, go ahead and apply EA or SCEA, but also try to get as many of your other applications submitted before you receive your SCEA, EA decisions!

I wish the OP the best of luck!

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A month is likely not enough to research the school and write an excellent essay, particularly for the “why this school” essay if there is one. The CommonApp opened on August 1 which is at least 2-3 months before the deadline. Many applicants would spend the summer to look up the prompts for CA which are available months earlier and also the school’s supplemental from previous years. I would rather say: “Ivy League Candidates: Do Start Early!!!” That is where you get the extra months you need instead of start late and wait for RD.

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@zoebrittany “What we all had in common as students was a passion for learning, a thirst for knowledge and an established record of interests, hobbies, that surfaced at a very early age, and which morphed over time into personal accomplishments well before we were aware of college or its various admissions hurdles.” I Agree!!!

As a parent with two children, each accepted early to an IVY (no SAT prep or college counselor, Naviance had very little or no data for their school choice, public school), the keys were institution match, intellectual curiosity, academic record, relationship with their teachers and long term ECs that tie their holistic application together. I can’t imagine the same level of passion for the academic departments and student body at 14 different institutions. I only read one common app essay, with our second child choosing a peer editor to keep his personal story private.

We helped along the path of finding their first choice school with travel and scheduling, and in both cases their second choice was not an IVY, but a school with the same type of teaching style. We demanded a second school visit and a department appointment before applying early. The essay contents may be important, but a student’s humor and voice is what reaches an admissions officer, stories must be repeats, there can only be so many…

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As I recall, a year or so ago, there was a thread discussing the degree to which applying SCEA provided an advantage at Yale. Using real numbers (and someone’s insider knowledge), I believe the group concluded that if you were unhooked, the SCEA admit rate was something like 10-11% (as opposed to the stated overall SCEA admit rate of 16-17%). In other words, the advantage over applying RD was meaningful, but much less than you might think if you were unhooked, particularly when you consider that SCEA applicants tend to present higher-quality applications on average (they understand the game better, are more organized, tend to be higher-SES so probably go to better schools, have had access to more opportunities, etc.).

Having been to this rodeo more than once, I’ve observed that: (i) your essays can always improve, so start working on them as early as possible (preferably in the summer), keep revising and get the perspectives of smart people who are motivated to help you; (ii) spend A LOT of time on the “Why us?” essays that so many schools have - this is how you persuade schools that you’re a match (and, frankly, come to understand which places are the best fits for you); (iii) don’t expect great results from applying early if you need that senior fall semester to validate that your grades are where they need to be; (iv) understand that applying ED gives you a MUCH greater advantage at many schools than applying EA to others (and consider carefully where you use your early bullet); and (v) use Naviance and any other tools available to you to ensure you’ve got a mix of reaches, matches and safeties- that you can afford.

Finally, try to tell yourself that the college search process isn’t a romcom - there isn’t just one true match. You can be happy at many places, and what you get out of your college experience is ultimately much more about you, your attitude and work ethic than which school you attend.

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I recommend this book. I think it’s the best guide to getting into a top college I’ve seen. https://www.amazon.com/How-Get-Into-Top-Colleges/dp/073520442X

I don’t mean to be rude to the OP–it’s hard to get “tone” across on a message board–but until the results come in there’s no way anyone can know whether his “new and improved” app will yield better results.

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@lesjubilants - Your post had two points. One was good, and advised students to work hard on their essays, short answer responses, etc., before submitting their applications. The other point, the very first one you made was “I am a white, upper middle class female who goes to a mid-grade public school. I have the qualifications and the essay topics, but I don’t have the private school diploma, or the $4,000 college counselor, or the nationally-ranked public school.” This statement obviously resonated with a lot of CC users who found it “refreshing” that you would express your class resentment so openly. I don’t dispute that kids from wealthy families have enormous advantages in general, but also specific to college admissions, primarily because they go to better schools, know how to be “good students,” have information that helps them prepare for the college application process, etc., But as a “white, upper middle-class” student, you are also more privileged than the majority of graduating seniors in the US. After all, you chose to apply to Yale SCEA, which shows that you have great self-confidence as well as a great academic track record. Most economically disadvantaged kids have neither. My point above is that the best students, whether they are socio-economically disadvantaged or priviledged, and who are lucky enough to have the confidence and ability to attend community college, state schools or private colleges/universities, all have one thing in common: they are passionate about learning for its own sake and, as a result, will achieve academic accolades no matter where they go to high school or college.

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I think people here underestimate the social and educational capital involved in knowing how to effectively start writing the CA essays, activities descriptions, and individual college prompts. As the OP noted, there are a lot of resources online, but it can take a lot of work and time to even know where to begin, and to sort out what is most useful for an individual. Writing for these prompts is a different form of writing than most of what students have written before (and for a good fraction, unlike anything they will write again). A typical HS doesn’t have those resources available - counselors stretched out over many students very few of whom think about tippy top schools, same with teachers, etc. One can argue all of that is the reason for “holistic” admissions, but it can leave many feeling left out of the game.

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I’m not sure that anyone is arguing that - at least I’m not. The OP admits to finding resources online. The issue I have are the explanations being made, e.g.

Well, pretty much no successful applicant to an Ivy League college is sitting around on the couch all summer writing essays. The OP had an academic program. That’s great. But few summer academic programs run from the last day of classes in June to the first day of classes in August/September. No matter how intensive it is, there is still downtime to do other things, as many applicants who worked or went to summer programs managed to do. Time management is key, and will be needed for any successful applicant to an Ivy League school.

and

So the OP admits the application was not that good. So I give her props for self-awareness, but she needs to own the process. If it was not good and she got deferred, it’s not because she’s a “white, upper middle class female who goes to a mid-grade public school.”

The OP does give a lot of great hindsight advice, but her message is lost, IMO, but the blanket-statement headline of her thread; perhaps applying SCEA to Yale and EA to 6 colleges was not the best strategy for her, but does not mean that others should not apply early to a reach school.

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@skieurope Funny, I took her post entirely differently. I thought she WAS trying to “own her process” in explaining the very steep learning curve that is inherent in this application process even for a bright, privileged applicant. I don’t think she said she got deferred because she’s white, upper-middle class, and/or female. I think she’s wondering what might have happened if she had used a different strategy, and she was genuinely offering up some advice to people who might be like her. I appreciate when high school students write about their experiences, and I’ve learned a lot from hearing their perspectives as they are in the thick of it.

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It is indeed an interesting sharing by the OP. Just the title of the thread is not a correct generalized conclusion. Obviously, there are plenty of students applied early and got accepted. So applying early is not the reason to be blamed. The title could be “My regret of applying early to Ivy Leagues” as it is a personal experience.

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I agree that someone should spend a lot of time on the application. I disagree that means waiting to apply in the regular decision round because applying early hurts you. I don’t think it does–especially at Yale.