<p>Hi, I'm a rising junior interested in swimming in college. I've looked through some of the Ivy League Athletic sites and compared my times to theirs (I'm waiting on filling out the recruiting questionnaire until after I take the ACT/after this upcoming swim season) and I seem to fall in the middle of the pack - not the fastest, but faster than a few of the girls on the team. Can anyone on this forum confirm if ALL Ivy League swimmers are recruits, or are there a couple walk-ons? I've always assumed that since the Ivies were DI and academically prestigious, they would have more than enough competitive prospective student-athletes... however, stats/times seem to say otherwise.</p>
<p>In general, about 3/4 of Ivy athletes are recruited (LL) - a little less at Yale. My guess is that ratio holds true in women’s swimming as well.
To get an idea of where your times fall, take a look at the Ivy League championships this year
<a href=“http://static.psbin.com/t/0/34dnzp5pgt96ig/20120223_Ivys_Day_3.pdf[/url]”>http://static.psbin.com/t/0/34dnzp5pgt96ig/20120223_Ivys_Day_3.pdf</a></p>
<p>It really depends on schools. For example, Princeton takes walk-ons, but Harvard, in general, doesn’t.</p>
<p>Cornell has “qualifying times” posted on their web page that you must meet to even “walk on”</p>
<p>Hi there–my d is a swimmer (rising senior) and we’ve talked to a few Ivies. I can tell you that Dartmouth takes walk-ons. I don’t know about any of the others specifically.</p>
<p>Also, I think Cornell has a list of qualifying times on their recruitment form? I believe they said these times apply to both recruits and walk-ons…but don’t quote me. It’s been awhile since I looked–you might want to just go click on their recruitment link and see.</p>
<p>oops, csdad, thanks! we must have been posting at the same time.</p>
<p>The teams are getting more difficult each year–Harvard’s men’s team --according to CollegeSwimming.com-- had the 6th best recruiting class in the NATION. I think the women are around the same. Pton is equally as good-- the others less so, but still improving. This has been a huge transformation in a matter of just a few years. Not sure why–perhaps the large scholarship funds made the lack of athletic scholarships per se less distinctive vis a vis the usual national powerhouses.<br>
Yale is different-- their women’s program is in disarray. The lost both their coach and assistant coach in a few months of each other. Rumor is that Admissions was being very very hard on recruits. Not sure exactly if that is the case for Cristina’s leaving, but Levin has made it clear and overt that he does not want there to be so many recruited athletes on campus. Simmons at Brown has done the same. Whereas Dartmouth seems to be in the recruiting business as is Penn. I don’t know about Columbia or Cornell.</p>
<p>Thanks for all the input. My times seem to be pretty competitive for the Ivies (with the exception of Harvard/Princeton powerhouses, who both seem to have significantly stronger W teams…hmm). I looked at the Cornell Womens’ time standards and compared those to the actual times their swimmers were going at dual meets - some swimmers weren’t even close to the time standards set by Cornell. Not sure if anyone on this forum would know the answer to this, but are those athletes walk-ons? Or were they recruited, despite being a few seconds slower than the supposed “cut off” times?</p>
<p>Etondad - Do you think Yale’s new coach will benefit the W swim program? I heard he’s pretty good, especially coming from a national powerhouse school like Texas. He talked about potentially capturing an Ivy title in the future… It seems a little ambitious as of now (since Yale is 4th in the league after HYPC? Don’t quote me on this!) but who knows.</p>
<p>Swim18, the dual meet times are not accurate reflections of many swimmers’ ability since they are pretty beaten down by the weights and training program during season. Most of the time they won’t taper, shave, and suit up till the championships meet (or HYP meet) and this makes a big difference in the performance for college swimmers. Check the Ivy championships times. Those are the times the coaches will use to gauge your attractiveness to them.</p>
<p>Swim18, I dunno. I knew Cristina when she was an age group coach for my daughter’s former team before heading to Yale. She also spoke strongly about winning the Ivies, wanting girls to make Trial cuts-- all of the things one would want to hear. While her style could be brusk, her intentions were in the right place. As I have been told she wasn’t “pushed”, she resigned out of frustration. I have no ideas what representations Yale made to the new coach–(just as I have no idea what they said to her before she came on board). </p>
<p>But as the name of Yale’s oldest women’s a cappella group puts it" “The Proof of the Pudding” is, well, you get it.</p>
<p>On the positive side, both the head coach and assistant coach at Yale are capable of developing one of the best teams in the Ivy League IF there are given a reasonable amount of support by the school. On the negative side, one of the main reasons that Yale athletics is not as successful as it could be is due to the current administration and not the quality of coaching. Even if Yale had facilities comparable to H & P, it is hampered by a small number of recruiting spots and a relatively tough admissions policy.</p>
<p>Swim18, I don’t want to identify the schools that d has talked to…would hate to say something negative and have it come back to her somehow…but in the spirit of being helpful (we have been helped repeatedly on this forum by people willing to share), I want to say that I personally agree with you that the qualifying times for various programs don’t seem in accord with the way those teams <em>actually</em> perform.</p>
<p>etondad is correct about how the level of Ivy swimming seems to be going up, so perhaps the pool of recruits this summer has shot through the roof in terms of speed and academics. If that turns out to be the case, then some of what we’ve been told by various Ivies will make sense. But I must admit I was astonished when one particular coach told my d that they were only interested in swimmers who would qualify for A-finals at Ivy Champs. This school is in the bottom half of the pack, so I understand what they “want” but they are chasing away good swimmers with great grades who swim faster than their current roster.</p>
<p>We weren’t offended, mostly bemused. Some of the recruiting coaches seemed VERY young, also. :)</p>
<p>My suggestion would be to email and then email again later in the summer when they have a better idea of who might actually come to their program.</p>
<p>H just announced its class of 2016. Might be useful read. <a href=“http://www.collegeswimming.com/news/2012/jul/16/harvard-womens-swimming-and-diving-adds-11-for-201/[/url]”>http://www.collegeswimming.com/news/2012/jul/16/harvard-womens-swimming-and-diving-adds-11-for-201/</a></p>
<p>Thanks for the link! That’s a very strong class…</p>
<p>I’ve actually competed against one of the 2016 H girls!</p>
<p>I agree that some coaches turn away swimmers that are better than current team members. One reason that this happens is that each Ivy team is allowed to bring eighteen competitors to the Ivy Championships. Each swimmer counts as one and each diver counts as one-third. Most schools will take sixteen swimmers and six divers or seventeen swimmers and the divers. For this reason, four of five swimmer who are expected to make the Championship team may be more valuable to a coach than ten slightly slower recruits. </p>
<p>Still, there are coaches who overestimate their ability to get the swimmers they want and end up not getting some of the swimmers that they might need. Not surprisingly, many of the swimmers at one teams Junior Day attend their competitors events as well. Coaches, like athletes, sometimes misjudge interest and end up wishing they had made different decisions. </p>
<p>On some teams, over one-half of the teams season ends with the last dual meet. Although these swimmers dont go to the Championships, they do compete during the year. At least one team tapers the swimmers who arent going to this meet for their final dual meet of the season.</p>
<p>interesting info, hangNthere…and really useful for the high school swimmers out there who are debating what kind of swim experience they want in college. on my d’s club team there are swimmers with cuts for the big champ meet and there are swimmers without cuts…the swimmers without cuts still swim and still get something out of the experience. It all depends on what you are looking for.</p>
<p>Bump!</p>
<p>10char</p>
<p>Just back from dropping my D off at college (NESCAC)-- spoke with several other swim families–had the same experience and choices-- Ivies or NESCAC. Both conference’s teams are getting stronger each year. and on my D’s team, there are a number of Ivy recruited swimmers who chose NESCAC. </p>
<p>As a parent of another swimmer pointed out that when they were deciding one of the things they always checked was look at the times of the girls when they were freshmen and then when they were seniors…are they getting much faster or is the coach just recruiting well but not improving his/her swimmers. A number of coaches get terrific swimmers-- but they don’t seem to improve them much. Not much fun is one’s times don’t drop. </p>
<p>Also to what extent does the swimmer want to compete at post season meets such as NCAAs both individually and as part of the team. Which colleges can provide that? Which treat the student athlete as student first (and not lip service)–after all the Ivies are not Auburn, Georgia, Florida State or Texas…</p>
<p>Some of the increased competitiveness of the Ivy teams may be a product of the new-found recruiting abilities the Ivies have had these past few years. I am new to CC and this athletic forum, so this article may have been posted and discussed last December when originally published.<br>
<a href=“Financial Aid Changes Game as Sports Teams in Ivies Rise - The New York Times”>Financial Aid Changes Game as Sports Teams in Ivies Rise - The New York Times;