Ivy League vs Distinguished Scholarship

Our child was recently accepted EA to a top Ivy for which we are rightly proud of her years of exemplary effort and of her character and values. Currently attends a rigorous and selective independent school. Also found out our child is a finalist for the Morehead-Cain at UNC-Chapel Hill which is a prestigious scholarship that only 30 out-of state students receive. It covers full costs and expenses for all four years plus four remarkable summer programs/internships and mentoring.

We have money saved to pay for a private college, yet we aren’t of that rate group where a savings of $250K means ‘nothing’. (The money need not be the deciding factor.) Certainly, though, we ‘save’ could be used for grad school or help our child in other ways down the road.

We went to top Ivy League schools ourselves and know how the people we met and the network we have as a result
and the name on the diploma
continues to open doors our whole lives.
Yet, our child is different than we are, of course.

The questions are: what should she use to make her decision if, indeed, she is fortunate to be awarded the Morehead? Will that network serve her well enough in international work? How does one weigh the differences in the education received and out-of-classroom experiences between an Ivy and Morehead-Cain/UNC? Is the money saved an important factor to concern or short-sighted? If she’s a very motivated and stand-out kid in general, is it worth taking a plunge into experiencing a great and larger Southern state university or will she regret not having as fine teaching and remarkable professors at Yale? Will the Morehead network be sufficient since there are fewer alum (75/year) but they ‘pull’ for other Morehead scholars so much more directly than Ivy alum? Can she have this experience she wants of leaving the ivory tower (she was in a small private school for hs) and make up for whatever she might give up in educational classroom experience via graduate school and her out-of-class experiences and summer internships that Morehead offers?

We know there’s no right answer and it depends on her weekend visits and personal choice. And we know many have given up Ivy acceptance for Morehead in the past.
Hard to measure apples vs oranges.

If your D gets the Morehead-Cain scholarship that is quite the achievement. That will open doors and distinguish her from day one where at an Ivy, she’ll be just another excellent student (at least to start).

Don’t underestimate the benefits of being a big fish in a smaller pond.

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What may the student be interested in post graduation?

If “grad school”, does that mean PhD (should be free) or professional school (JD, MD, etc.; expensive)?

First, congratulations on your daughter’s outstanding acheivement. You must be thrilled and proud beyond belief.

There are many similar threads on CC debating this topic (may be with different schools but essentially the same issues). I mention that only to say you can expect to receive lots of support for either position. Lots of it will be rooted in anecdotal experiences (My kid did just fine at XYZ school, and HYP brought me more benefit than one could ever realize). You’ll also get a lot of “advice” based on the finances involved, your savings, your retirement, your values (towards education), etc. It always amazes me how others weigh in without really knowing your circumstances, but you are asking them to do so.

From my vantage point, I think you need to separate the issues: expenses vs. education / overall experience. If money was not a factor, what would yo do? How big of a factor is it?

This would be easy if you couldn’t afford Yale. UNC is awesome and Morehead- Cain is incredible. But you can afford it or it least have monies set aside.

My only question for you to ponder is: How will spending 250k - 300k affect your life, both current and in retirement? Will it change how you live in retirement, when you can retire, if you can retire? Will it require you to do things differently now? And in total, if it does require a difference, is that difference worth it to you? That’s essentially your issue.

Both educational experiences will / can be phenomenal. Your daughter will be quite successful if she continues her trajectory of excellence. And of course, she can’t experience both programs in parallel worlds so you’ll never know the reality of one of these fine choices.

This is a personal decision, and not an easy one regardless of what you will hear. Best of luck to you and your family. Hapy New Year!

Your daughter is quite remarkable, and will do remarkable things in life, even with a State U education.

What majors are your daughter considering? What are her potential career interests?

I think you are asking some good questions.

One question I would ask is what type of college experience does your daughter want?

UNC is going to be a different college experience than attending a HYP. UNC is a fairly large and homogenous campus (83% of students have to be from NC). It’s your quintessential college town, big school spirit, D1 sports, large Greek presence, with southern hospitality.

HYP will have a much more diverse, international student body with world-class faculty and facilities, huge endowments, and as you mentioned, world wide prestige that can open doors, connections.

Lastly, I would compare and contrast the actual type of 4 year education she will get at UNC vs the ivy. In your situation cost of attendance shouldn’t be the difference maker as you have already saved and ear-marked the money for a private college.

Its great that she has two fabulous options and will thrive whatever choice she makes.

I don’t really have an answer for you but wanted to share that we are facing the same dilemma between Stanford and UNC for our daughter. Money is not a huge factor but we do wonder about ROI, is it worth spending if the level of education and opportunities are similar? Now if she does not get the Morhead-Cain scholarship in the final round, we’re set on Stanford, but if she does, decision is tough.

Morehead-Cain is super prestigious. Congrats to those here whose children are in the running. I am quite certain that every single M-C finalist has other excellent options. Only truly stellar students make it to that stage. My kids have had high school classmates that have gone the Morehead-Cain route and it appears to have been an excellent decision for them. In addition to the free, on campus education, they have had very interesting and compelling summers. M-C will open many, many doors for anyone choosing it.

I can’t believe no one has mentioned Frank Bruni yet! So I will – he opted for the Morehead route. I believe he writes about it in some depth in his autobiography (which, btw, is a great read). I wouldn’t be surprised if he wrote about it in his book about college “Where you go is not who you will be” (approximate title!).

Here’s a thread from last year from a student who chose UNC over Stanford and Princeton: http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/international-students/2056643-finding-an-intellectual-college-for-a-clueless-17-year-old.html

This is a personal decision. But know that if your student wins the Morehead-Cain, their opportunities will be equal to or greater than that of a regular excellent student at Yale. My D took another prestigious cohort scholarship over full pay at an Ivy and is very happy with her decision and would make the same one if she had to do it over again. Almost everyone in her cohort got accepted to top 10 schools. From a purely financial perspective, I don’t think any school is worth $200k more than a scholarship like the Morehead-Cain, so I disagree with those who say ignore the financial aspect. That said, if ROI isn’t a key determinant to you, let your student choose based on fit.

No matter what you decide, conformation bias will set in and you will be convinced that you made the right choice.

Conformation bias is a good thing :). In this scenario it’s going to be a win win no matter what so best to just embrace the choice.

Although UNC is comprised of 82% NC residents, I believe it is a greater cross-section of socio-economic groups and more diverse than HYP. The UNC system draws from all corners of a state with a highly qualified applicant pool. It all depends on the student’s preferred criteria. They are two very different universities. As one of the more affordable public universities, UNC out of state tuition (if M-C is not on the table) will still be an attractive choice and if this student is as intellectually curious as I imagine, they will likely attend grad school. More expensive doesn’t mean a greater ROI. Frank Bruni has a good point.

The opposite of confirmation bias is in-law bias. No matter what you choose will be wrong.

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Masters in International Affairs; perhaps a pHD. Thinking of conflict resolution and regional studies. Maybe working for an NGO or think tank? All of this could change, of course, but seems pretty sure.

MA in Intl Affairs or Conflict Resolution and Peace
maybe a phD. To work at a think tank or ngo.

Morehead is better than HYPS for prestige.

Frank Bruni of the NY Times writes he was lucky to get rejected by Yale which sent him to UNC instead. Get a copy of his book.

Morehead will provide extra special mentoring, support and experience as compared to a regular student at HYPS.

Morehead is better for the money.

Fit/experience depends on your kid.

In most years, Morehead would also provide a much better basketball team. But that’s not true this year.

My daughter’s really good friend received the M-C scholarship but chose to attend Princeton. In this case money wasn’t an issue at all so the decision was purely an academic one and no regrets.