Jewish students at Catholic Colleges

Parents Forum
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<p>I’m not quite seeing what you’re seeing. If I understand it correctly, Seattle University, a Jesuit college, is in the same city as University of Washington where Hillel appears huge! It has many staff and leaders, listed on the Hillel link provided. Am I not understanding your needs here, perhaps? </p>

<p>I’m suggesting you might contact the people at U of Washington to find out whether she can join in their activities if she attends Seattle U (my guess is: yes). Then, what is the geographic distance between the two places, can she get there independently by bus or bike, and so forth. </p>

<p>LOL, yes it’s true most of the colleges on the URJ site are east of the Mighty Mississippi. Still, their list includes several publics in California and Arizona. Just more grist for the mill.</p>

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<p>“But -and here is the but- there is no way that non-Jews can truly understand how collective Jewish history is part of the Jewish psyche, and can understand that Jewish continuity is threatened today.”</p>

<p>This Jew calls BS on that statement. None of this is difficult to understand for a non-Jew who is a thoughtful student of Jewish history and culture. They’re perfectly capable of “truly understanding” it. We’re not talking about the mysteries of the Kabbalah here.</p>

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<p>Might offer merit aid, smaller LAC-type schools in Oregon and Washington:</p>

<p>In Washington: University of Puget Sound, Seattle-Pacific University, Gonzaga University. I think Whitman is a reach based on what you have said, but it is a great school.</p>

<p>In Oregon: Lewis and Clark, Willamette, University of Portland. Reed would probably be a reach.</p>

<p>Can’t really comment about the Jewish population on those campuses with much authority, but take a look at them.</p>

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<p>paying3tuitions- from what I understand she would be able to attend hillel events at Univ of Washington.I don’t see her stepping that far out of her comfort zone. She would like to and might apply to Univ of Washington. I think OOS it would be a reach plus probably out of our price range. Just looked it up Estimated Cost OOS traditional student U of Washington is over 38,000.</p>

<p>She has a notion that she does not want to consider any schools in the state of Arizona. The schools in Ca on the URJ are probably all reaches for her. She will not have the grades or class rank for UCLA or Berkeley. I did see somewhere that UC Santa Cruz has a decent number of jewish students and that is definitely on the list.
Boiledegg- Whitman is a reach and Reed is so far out of her range that we haven’t even considered it.
We know many students at Seattle Pacific. While a great school for a Christian student it would not be a fit for a Jewish student.</p>

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<p>^Mom60, I really appreciate your dedication on your D’s behalf. Also, thanks for the above post in which Paras 1 and 2 replied to my many questions in my post #61.</p>

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<p>“This Jew calls BS on that statement.”
I didn’t mean to be so inflammatory! But - we are Jewish so we discuss, argue and have opinions and this is OK! :)</p>

67

<p>Mom60, does your D care that she attends a Catholic college? Is she concerned that she may not fit in as a Jew in a Catholic school? If these are your and other poster’s concerns, but are these your D’s concerns? Will you give her the freedom to choose her school ?</p>

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<p>Wow. So you won’t love your non-Jewish grandchildren?</p>

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<p>“Wow. So you won’t love your non-Jewish grandchildren”</p>

<p>Another example of being on another page and having a different perspective and not understanding what I am saying! Yes, of course I would love them - but I would have failed because they would not be contributing to the future of the Jewish people. You see, this goes way beyond individual love for someone. This is about collective survival of a people.
The American paradigm emphasizes individual choice, as reflected by cbreeze’s post about asking the daughter about her concerns. But the Jewish paradigm emphasizes the survival of the global Jewish community, which is threatened by every “fadeout” of a Jewish young person. Of course, the global Jewish community is made up of individuals, who are born with a special responsibility to keep us going.
Shocking to some, eh? Good thing this is anonymous! :slight_smile:
Anyway, I have done a lot to ensure that this would not happen (having non-Jewish grandchildren) - including keeping many traditions at home and college choices - so I am hopeful that my kids will have Jewish spouses and children.</p>

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<p>cbreeze- the above was not my quote.
I will love my children and grandchildren no matter what or if any religion they practice.</p>

<p>And to answer your question- I hope I have always given my children the space and comfort to voice their opinions. My D is very confused about what type or where she wants to go to school or if she will even be ready to go away from home. She has asked for guidance.
I think I would be open to her attending a Jesuit Catholic college. I can’t answer for her Dad. I would not be open for her to attend a fundamental Christian based college. Her Dad would definitely not be willing to pay for a school along the lines of Pepperdine or Seattle Pacific nor do I see my D wanting to attend a school where other students want to “save” her. She has had some experience with that in HS.</p>

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<p>It was my quote, and I take full responsibility for my “radical” (by cc standards, not by my local community standards) views :slight_smile:
But, please do not let these discussions hijack the thread. I think that we have been helpful to this OP and she has clarified some things in her mind. Please, OP, keep us posted on what your daughter decides to do.</p>

71

<p>My kids are all in theater, in one form or another; and they’ve taught me to watch for the “arc” of the story. From where did someone begin, and how does the story develop through time. So I went back to re-read the Opening Post, in search of new insights.
Again I want to commend the Mom here for her research.</p>

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<p>I think you have to imagine your H sitting at an orientation or graduation event at a Jesuit college, with Catholic symbols everywhere, and priest/educators officiating, wondering why he spent any money there for this education. </p>

<p>I would be careful to make sure he’s not shortchanging his daughter in order to save some money here. Really challenge it now and find out what the budget is. It’s so easy to tell someone else (who’s doing the work of research) to meet parameters of cost-cutting. But what you end up with needs to be a good fit. Remember to think of the money spent, as well as the money you’re trying to save; it should be money spent on something GOOD for your D’s persona. I respect your great effort here.</p>

<p>I also noted that your D expresses more optimism about her own ability to live far from home than you feel at this moment. Truly, she will mature a lot between today and September of her freshman year. You just have to imagine that. If going further away opens up more possibilities for her, even with the plane ticket costs, she might then (not now) be able to “make it on her own.” Don’t underestimate her social maturity, as it will fall into place in the next year-and-a-half. It is very hard to read about these places and realize that your D will be l8 months older than she is now, at the time she begins her freshman year. Maybe, by travelling further from her home state, more options open up where MERIT AID and SECULAR combine at a private school of the right size.</p>

<p>Don’t forget to consider the Midwest, by the way. Poor fly-over states, they get no respect, but there are some hidden gems there for you. </p>

<p>Anyway, keep an open mind but please challenge your H a bit to make sure you’re not being tooo conservative here with respect to finances.</p>

72

<p>Again, the wisdom of paying3tuitions comes through!
I would suggest that you check out the Jewish B students’ thread - some of the schools there give merit aid or are more reasonably priced. We have a very supportive community over there that would be happy to help if you post your question. You don’t have to read through the whole long thread!</p>

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<p>Paying3tuitions has some wise wisdom. Food for thought. Your post reminded me of when we toured Boston college with my older D. H was very uncomfortable with the crosses and statues.
We are very aware that the young woman we are dealing with today will mature in the next 18 months. She is also aware of that. That is why both my D and myself are all about having options. She may very well stay at home and do the CC for a year or two. We have learned with our older kids that there are numerous paths and we all don’t have to take the same one. We have also stressed with her that the choice to go away or stay home will be hers.
Levirm- I have looked at the Jewish B student thread but it is very east coast focused. H and I actually went to see College of Charleston when we were on our vacation based on learning about the school on CC on the Jewish B student thread. Both our older kids applied to schools all over the US.
Paying3tuitions we have not forgotton the midwest. Our oldest is at school in the Midwest. My younger D has done one intensive college visit and it was to a large midwest public. Prior to being in the Midwest my older D was at school in the southeast. Through that experience we know it is difficult to get home. We live a few hours from a major airport so most eastern or southern or even midwestern schools will mean at least 3 flights. Our other child is a 5 1/2 hour drive away from home. Much easier logistics.
My H feels that we have many great schools in our state plus some in neighboring states and he is pushing them big time. He is of the feeling she will bloom wherever she is planted. His preference is she be planted in something in the range of cost of attending a UC or less.</p>

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<p>

It was also just a really stupid comment, not deserving a response.</p>

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<p>Mom60, your H really is making this tough! It’s hard to compete with rates for college tuition when California residents have such a good deal for their publics! I can see why it’s so hard to find something to compare fiscally…and why you got to the place of looking at Jesuit Colleges for a Jewish girl!</p>

<p>The way these things sometimes unfold, though, is you keep believing in your daughter’s ability to do more than even you think she can. So eventually the choices might become: telling D if she wants Seattle as a cool place to go to college , then she could go up there but it’ll be a Jesuit College. So to find other Jewish friends she’ll have to go “out of her comfort zone” (your words for her) and join in with U of Washington Hillel sometimes. Does she like that idea? If not, a bigger California public, or a CC for two years first, can happen. </p>

<p>Or, you tell you H, “unless YOU (H) don’t want to upset your comfort zone and send her to a Jesuit College, then we need to somehow cough up more money for her than the tuition of a public California college for an instate resident, which is about the best deal going anywhere in America.”</p>

<p>OR you change and begin to get excited about sending your D to a big California public AND encourage her to pursue Jewish life so her time on campus can become as cozy as possible. I know a lot of Jewish students at U of Buffalo (a SUNY) who really connect and make a large place feel smaller through Jewish friendships. And the architecture there is disgustingly plain, but they still have a good time when active Jewishly. Really. Encourage her a bit to see herself making a large place feel warmer through Jewish connection among other students.</p>

<p>In an odd way I feel as though your H’s insistence that he not pay more than a California public leaves you and your D with very little choice, other than the Jesuit colleges (which he won’t want to pay for, I betcha) and a wish for merit aid; worries me because you say her acadmics aren’t strong. She could be urged to do all possible to make excellent grades in Junior and early Senior years, in hope of getting some merit aid. But the key to significant (not token) merit aid is to get accepted to a place where she’s well above the average student accepted. </p>

<p>In the end what matters is that she feel you are doing the best possible for HER, as you did best possible for her brothers. Her needs might be very different. Is H writing her off as someone who’ll “bloom where she’s planted” or is he just played out from all the big tuitions paid for the big brothers? </p>

<p>She sounds like a really good kid. The search process you face is really to find something different from a California public…unless your H changes his idea about what’s affordable/worthwhile for his D. </p>

<p>Lately I’m meeting some Dads who insist their D’s go to SUNY’s here when I frankly think the Dads could afford more and better for their D’s but are kind of being … (I can say this) CHEAP. It bothers me. Someone who has an EFC of “zero” after sending all those older boys to college just might be able to afford more than the cost of California instate tuition, but is choosing not to. I hope I haven’t insulted your H here, or if I have, well, I know a lot of Jewish dads and that’s my open question for him this morning. Can he afford more than he’s indicating? Can he not widen your choices a bit? If not, line up to greet Father Xavier :)</p>

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<p>^^reminds me of the people who are demanding their kids go to Rutgers so that they can keep the country club membership…</p>

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<p>Mom60,</p>

<p>I have no specific answers for you, except to agree that Jesuit colleges are: 1. Welcoming, 2. A good source of SOME merit aid for the good-not-great student, but 3. Pricey! (Also, pay attention to their minimum GPA’s for scholarship renewal.)</p>

<p>Levirm,</p>

<p>You and my Irish Catholic mother would get on like a house a’fire. </p>

<p>After Catholic grammar school and high school, I challenged my parents’ requirement to attend a Catholic college (btw: chose a Jesuit one). My mother admitted that, while religious education was vital, she was MOST interested in me being surrounded by lots of Catholic (hopefully of the Irish American flavor) classmates – from whom I would choose a husband.</p>

<p>My 17 year-old self was exasperated and accused her of being controlling - which she happily admitted. Somehow, when YOU say the same thing, it makes more sense because of the cultural implications of the diminishing numbers of Jews. (There’re one billion Catholics in the world now, compared with 13 million Jews.) </p>

<p>And I can TOTALLY hear my mother saying, “If my grandchildren are not raised [Catholic], I will have failed as a parent.” Would she ever repeat that in front of the wonderful grandkids? Nope.</p>

<p>btw: no, I didn’t shop for a husband in college. Flash forward ten years: this lapsed Catholic married a Catholic man who happened to have attended a competing Jesuit college… </p>

<p>Oi vey.</p>

78

<p>Haha, Astonished. Thanks for your story!</p>

<p>OP, could your daughter qualify for Irvine, Riverside, Davis or Santa Monica (how does anyone get any WORK done in that gorgeous place?!)
You already mentioned Santa Cruz.
Here is a thought outside the box: University of British Columbia has a new Hillel (check the site - a Chinese-surnamed Jewish student is featured). I don’t know about the Jewish percentage there, but do you think that your daughter would qualify?
paying3tutions mentioned SUNY - it is actually an out of state bargain with some discount airline service to some of the nearby airports.</p>

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<p>Correction: oy vey.</p>

<p>(So much for my “Some of my best friends are Jewish” credentials…)</p>

80

<p>I do not mean to offend anybody, but in reading levirm’s posts I cannot help wondering what is so important about ensuring the continuation of the Jewish people – when it seems the rest of the world is heading on a path of eventual assimilation into one race of people?</p>

<p>Do not misunderstand me, I applaud such efforts at self-preservation, and I wish it were more at play with other groups, but if (as it appears) the inevitablility of one people (amalgamated from all groups) inhabiting this earth is likely, then what makes Jews so special that they must be ‘saved’ from it? Why must the Jews set them selves apart?</p>

<p>Again, no offense is intended (remember my premise).</p>