This post from another thread asks a good question. Do you agree? What’s your impression of the admission readers/admission committe staff (not student interviewers/guides) you’ve met at top schools? Were they elitist? Were they frustrated Ivy Leaguers? How did you feel about being “judged” by the people you met?
<p>Michele Hernandez (former Dartmouth adcom and author of "A Is For Admission") had this to say about Ivy League admission officers "They may consist of graduate students, former teachers, spouses of professors and college staff; and career administrators. The majority of this group did not graduate from any highly selective college, let alone an Ivy League one. . . . [Many] are not expert readers . . . and most of them are not scholars or intellectuals. . . . What I am trying to say without shocking too much is that the very best of applicants will often be brighter than many of those who will be evaluating them." </p>
<p>For those of you who believe this, you may want to take a look at Jay Matthews' column "Confession of a College Interviewer" <a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&contentId=A28553-2002Oct15¬Found=true%5B/url%5D">http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&contentId=A28553-2002Oct15¬Found=true</a></p>
<p>Harvards adcoms are all Harvard graduates. At least one senior admissions officer, David Evans, is an expert in his academic field, which is, I think, anthropology.</p>
<p>When it comes to Harvard alum interviewers, they span all professions. Their official training for interviewing students comes from a booklet that Harvard sends all alumni interviewers. Some are excellent and even include people who teach interviewing techniques or who routinely interview as part of their jobs. Some are well meaning, but not very knowledgeable about interviewing techniques or what the college is looking for. My impression is that the interview is usually not a major factor in the university's admissions decisions. </p>
<p>Texdad's quote in Yalebound's post was unsubstantiated.</p>
<p>I'm really asking about the admissions staff: the full-time readers on the commitee, and the person who visited your school. The guy from yale i met, for example, was an assistant Dean of Admission. He seemed like a well-rounded, bright guy about 30 years old. can't recall if he was Yale grad. He reminded me of a really good high school teacher, who liked hs students. He also seemed a bit cocky, but not too bad really.</p>
<p>At Harvard, the staff (with the exception of clerical help) are all Harvard grads. I think that Harvard profs also are asked to read some apps and/or look at some technical submissions (music compositons, art work, etc. when appropriate. </p>
<p>I met a person who had been a Columbia or Brown adcom. She was a Stanford grad.</p>
<p>I know that one of the Adcoms at Amherst is a Stanford grad and I met one who was an Amherst grad, One of my good friends at Cornell is a Duke grad who did their graduate work at Columbia. All of the Adcoms I met at Williams are Williams grads, Almost all of the Barnard Adcoms are Barnard/Columbia grads. Even those who may not be graduates of the schools which they represent more than likely have graduated from an equally selective school. Some schools like grads from other colleges as it helps to prevent inbreeding and provides a more balanced perspective in the process. </p>
<p>As more people are going into higher ed, you will find more Adcoms who obtained either undergrad or graduate degrees at the schools they represent.</p>
<p>I think it might be better if they went by SATs and grades (adjusted for school quality) only, instead of letting adcoms judge you "as a person." Like they really can tell....</p>
<p>My experience has been that the students who have little going for them except test scores and grades are the ones who think those should be the only measure of applicants. Meanwhile, students who have a fuller understanding of what colllege offers -- including the importance of the interests, backgrounds and personalities of the students -- are the ones who understand why character, interests, etc. are important.</p>
<p>One also can figure out a lot about a student's character by reading their essays, recommendations and by talking to students.</p>
<p>It is something a brilliant kid just has to get used to. Some of these kids are so brilliant they are surely much smarter than their high school teachers. High school guidance counselers? Not the cream of the crop. So why would you expect college adcoms to be any more surperior? Eventually when they are CEOs of major corporations, at least then.... oh dear, then they will have to report to a board of directors... most likely populated by cretins. I guess it never ends.</p>
<p>" Some of these kids are so brilliant they are surely much smarter than their high school teachers. High school guidance counselers? Not the cream of the crop. So why would you expect college adcoms to be any more surperior? Eventually when they are CEOs of major corporations, at least then.... "</p>
<p>? As far as I have ever read, high grades and test scores do not correlate with one's ability to be a good adcom or CEO. In fact, I think that top CEOs tend to have had average grades.</p>
<p>High grades and test scores as the sole criterion for college admission would work well for places such as European universities. That's because ECs are not a part of the university experience in such countries. That is very different from what most US colleges consider the university experience. US colleges, with rare exception, want students who not only can perform the academic work, but who also can develop themselves and enrich the campus atmosphere by participating in ECs and by having relationships with other students as part of dorm life, etc.</p>
<p>I myself have been very impressed with the reps we met this year, highly likable, knew how to put students at ease ,yet get their point across and most were people with great social skills. Also 80% were graduates of the schools they were representing .</p>
<p>I liked the reps, my daughter and I met. Most top schools have so many qualified candidates that not all will be accepted so the impact of mistakes is small on the college, albeit great on the denied individuals .</p>
<p>Some good points here, but it's notorious that some schools, like Brown for sure, maybe Amherst too, reject consensus top kids and accept others of less stature at the same high school. They say it's because the lower-ranked students possess "intangibles" they are looking for. This, I submit, is a joke. The teachers, the other students, and even the lucky holders of "intangibles" are usually mystified by the admissions decisions from Brown, Amherst and I've heard Harvard also to a lesser extent. The intangibles, I suspect, are actually some artifiact of the Adcomm's imagination. face it, with 5000 to 10000 applications, you don't get real personal knowledge of anyone. I say go by the SATs and the grades, with a sanity check interview. It's got to be better than the arbitrary system we have now.</p>
<p>Yalebound, two students, one with supportive parents with the means to pay for private school, or at least private SAT prep classes and with the help of a knowledgeable college counselor is pushed and prodded into establishing credentials for an application. He interviews with the college representative in a room at school. Great ECs in school clubs and sports. Lets say 1350 on the SAT. 3.9 cum</p>
<p>The second student is the first in the family to get through high school and is passing some very difficult classes. Although English is a second language this student gets a respectable 1290 SAT with a 3.2 GPA. No ECs after 10th grade because of an after school job.</p>
<p>A college could miss a really great student if they only looked at the SAT and the cum.</p>
<p>There are lots of other cases...Students with lower scores but a talent on the french horn or with a paint pallet or a student who started a service club or was a national speech and debate champ.</p>
<p>Geographic diversity and cultural diversity are also important considerations when casting the freshman class.</p>
<p>Yalebound72, you fit in Ivy well I guess... Acadmic Index only....</p>
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Yalebound72, you fit in Ivy well I guess... Acadmic Index only....
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Ouch...But the Ivy adcoms don't stick to AI as much as they should either, in part because of grade inflation and the recentered SAT, which has made 1500s too easy to get.... They need a tougher test.</p>
<p>Ivy adcoms don't stick to AI as much as they should either</p>
<p>Adcoms build classes of people, while there are some guidelines there are not nor should there be formulas or sticking to the AI. Sad that people don't always fit into nice little boxes because some of the best candidates may be out of the box.</p>
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A college could miss a really great student if they only looked at the SAT and the cum.
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You completely ignore the costs of this arrogant ADCOMM policy. What about the students on this board with impeccable credentials who were rejected or deferred ED/EA from their first choice school because some ADCOMM thought he knew more than the objective data. Ever "great student" accepted on the conceit of some ADCOMM keeps another great student out, one who had higher SATs and GPA.</p>
<p>Yalebound72, would you kindly tell me what does SAT measure? </p>
<p>and should all my peers then all transfer to a poor public school just to get a boost on gpa?</p>
<p>Adcomms don't make perfect judges but isn't SAT even worse at measuring what it claims to measure?</p>
<p>The SAT's evaluate how a person did on a particular day or days and doesn't demostrate their flexibility or humor or any of those hard to quantify yet important human qualities. College adcoms aren't looking at individuals as much as they are looking at casting a play and they need a variety of people so the production will be successful. Don't fall into the trap that a high SAT score means you are a better person, or even a better student. Was it Alantic magazine that found Shakespear failing the standardized reading test?</p>