<p>Most top colleges recommend 4 years of Foreign Languange. Does this include years studied in middle school? Or kids have to take FL for 4 years in HS?</p>
<p>Thanks for any responses.</p>
<p>I think they would like to see the equivalent of 4 years of high school foreign language. In any case, it is a recommendation, not a requirement.</p>
<p>Middle school foreign language study usually counts if it is a high school credit class (and on the HS transcript). I suggest that you check with the individual college(s). </p>
<p>Most top schools now like to see 4 or even 5 (AP) years of foreign language.</p>
<p>Tenth grade son has two years of Spanish by end of year, and is asking to study French next year for two years. Pragmatically, Spanish is so utilitarian. Plus I’d think top collages like 4 years, same subject. Otoh…</p>
<p>Any advise? TIA.</p>
<p>I believe that this is HS study. I think they assume middle school language is not useful, even if that is not true, but might count if it shows up on HS transcript per Fallgirl. Per PaperChaserPop, it is a recommendation. My son took no years of foreign language in HS but explained why and did other things and got in to a number of highly-ranked schools.</p>
<p>The four year recommendation assumes that a student will reach level 4 of a particular language. S came into high school after two years of Spanish and was admitted to Spanish 3. Most of his classmates went into Spanish 1 or 2, not having worked very hard in middle school. Since he graduated early, technically he only had 3 years of foreign language.</p>
<p>My understanding jives with Marite. In our school system kids have two years of language in middle school, but it only counts as one and kids are placed in Level 2 language courses in 9th grade. My son took Latin 4 as a junior, but certainly didn’t think he needed to take AP Latin in order to have 4 years in high school. High school level courses taken in middle school appear on our high school transcript and the grades are factored into the overall GPA.</p>
<p>Just to clarify: courses taken in middle school do not appear on our school’s trasncripts, and of course, the grades received in these classes are not factored in, either. But that did not matter as far as my S’s transcript was concerned. He was listed as having taken Spanish 4 as well as Latin 3.</p>
<p>I don’t think it matters whether the middle school courses appear on the high school transcript or not.</p>
<p>My understanding is that “four years of foreign language” means “foreign language through Level 4.” My daughter took Spanish Levels 1 and 2 in middle school and levels 3 through 5 (5 was AP) in high school. By my interpretation, this was 5 years of foreign language, not 3. None of the colleges that she applied to complained that she did not have enough foreign language.</p>
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<p>I agree with those who say that at least 4th level is what they seem to prefer to see. A friend of mine called a few schools to ask when his S wanted to drop Spanish for Latin. (He was having a very hard time with Spanish.) He told me that they said that 2+2 was okay, but not preferred, and that if S did it he had better be sure to have 2 years in the second language. I think that what they really want is a certain level of competence in reading and writing another language, and you usually don’t get that in 2 years of HS study. </p>
<p>Whether MS classes count is a grey area. In our system they don’t appear on the HS transcript. (Actually, my S took a HS class in MS, and I don’t think that appeared either…) It seems that the 2 yrs of MS foreign language “count” as one year if the kid gets to the 4th level junior year.</p>
<p>If he likes French, he might do better in it than in Spanish, if that is the issue. On the other hand, French is harder than Spanish, and it is considered harder to go from Spanish to French than the other way round, so if he is viewing French as a potential escape from foreign language idfficulties, it probably is not a wise move.</p>
<p>I think the “four years of language” is a bit of a myth</p>
<p>I only took TWO years of FL and I got a deferral from Yale this year. I know kids with 4 years who got rejected. I hated FL and got nothing out of it. I had very high A’s both year I took it, but seriously, it was a joke</p>
<p>We had a girl from my HS last year who had 2 years who got into Colgate, Hamilton and Oberlin. </p>
<p>As long as you take hard classes in place of FL(I took AP Psych and AP World) I really don’t think they mind</p>
<p>Since my 2yr-FL-only son is applying to college this year, I called all the top schools he may be applying to, and none of the schools I called said 4yr is required. When asked if my son would be at a disadvantage to other kids with 4yr FL, the standard answer I got was “As long as he challenged himself in a different area, the answer is no.” I’m pretty sure there are some colleges that may insist on seeing the evidence of mastery in a FL, but most of the top schools just want to see the candidates have challegened themselves. Mastery of a FL is defintely a good challenge.</p>
<p>Then again, their response may be a snare intended to lured my son’s unsuspecting father to be their accomplice in getting my son’s app into their reject pile to help their admit rate ;).</p>
<p>All of the counselors we consulted told our DS to not switch language and to take his one language to the top level his school offered, which was beyond AP, for the best shot at top colleges.</p>
<p>My school was another one where the guidance counselor told us that 4 years of language basically meant through level four. At my school, you had to take a language all three years of middle school, and that counted as level one. My counselor thought that my stopping Spanish after junior year (level 4) an replacing it with an AP class (but an easy one - Enviro) was perfectly fine.</p>
<p>I got into my ED school, a top LAC (Wesleyan), and none of my interviews at other schools (including Brown) ever indicated surprise or a problem with me not taking Spanish senior year.</p>
<p>Thank you all for replies. They are very informative. My son is in 10th and has taken Spanish since middle school. He wants to take 5 AP classes next year if he does not have to take Spanish. He is aiming at one the top 10 colleges.</p>
<p>Just to clarify, where we are the middle school classes taken for HS credit (FL as well as Algebra and Geometry) do appear on the student’s transcript. Obviously, this isn’t the case everywhere.</p>
<p>dragonboy, if he takes 5 APs but doesn’t take an AP language, I think he’ll be fine.</p>
<p>“All of the counselors we consulted told our DS to not switch language and to take his one language to the top level his school offered, which was beyond AP”</p>
<p>hmom, where would a FL take a student beyond AP in a HS curriculum?</p>
<p>My son started Fr 1 in 8th and would love to stop now in 10th after taking Fr. 3. I had been originally told in MS the 3 yr of French would be fine since it would give him an extra year of lang. Now in HS, the guidance counselor said the colleges only see the number of years they take in HS. It doesn’t matter that he started early. He will only have 2 if he stops now.</p>
<p>What is frustrating is I encouraged him to start the Fr. early thinking he could leave after Fr. 3. If he had waited and just started in 9th he could have. Fr. 4 is honors, so harder, and with his other APs definitily makes his load heavier next year unnecessarily.</p>
<p>dragonboy:</p>
<p>Just FYI. My S took three AP classes in 10th grade: Calc BC, Euro History and Spanish Language. These were hist first AP classes. He found AP SPanish to be very easy. Caveat: He is not a native Spanish speaker but did attend a language immersion elementary school.</p>