<p>Is Latin Honors truly an honor? Does it look all fancy sitting on a resume? Looking at the Engineering program of study, it does not seem possible to both Latin Honors and a minor.
So, just what is the deal with Latin Honors? It looks fascinating and I love how it allows for students to explore all areas of learning without letting them get too carried away.</p>
<p>Latin honors is basically qualifying to graduate cum laude, summa cum laude, or magna cum laude. To qualify, as I"m sure you’ve read, you need to take at least one class in each of the “areas of knowledge” (there’s five or seven, I forget). However to earn Latin Honors you need to not only take the course in each area, but you also have to get a certain cumulative GPA by the time you graduate. The GPA changes every year, but it usually starts in the high 3.7s/3.8s for cum laude and then goes up to 4.0 for. Latin Honors GPA is calculated by looking at the grades in all of your classes, not just your Latin Honors distribution courses. However, classes you take your first year, and classes you take during study abroad, do not count towards your Latin Honors GPA. Your first year grades will count towards your cumulative GPA overall, which is different than your Latin Honors GPA (sorry, this is confusing, I realize). </p>
<p>If you take the Latin Honors distribution courses, but you don’t get a high enough GPA to qualify for the honors, you get a special notation on your diploma to signfy that you took the classes, but you can’t say that you graduated cum laude. </p>
<p>Latin Honors is a little bit like making Phi Beta Kappa – Not doing it isn’t going to count against you, but being able to say “Jane Doe, B.A. Smith College, summa cum laude, PBK” on your resume is of course a plus, though that’s not why I would go for it. I decided to try for Latin Honors because it seemed like a fun challenge, but I didn’t really think about it seriously until closer to my senior year.</p>
<p>Thank you for clarifying!</p>
<p>Apparently, you have to take two semesters of a language… is this true?</p>
<p>Um, I’m not sure. I think you only have to take two semesters of a language if the language is an intro class (intro language classes you need to take both semesters of the language in order to get credit for either semester) but upper level language classes are different. You usually just have to take one class worth four credits in each area, but to be honest with you, I don’t really remember. If you can get your hands on a printed copy of the course catalog when you get to campus (I think they give this to you at check-in) it should have the requirements in the front.</p>
<p>Having a Latin Honors designation on your resume is a nice shorthand about your academic background; it counts with graduate schools and many employers. At least to the point where they start examining other parts of your resume.</p>
<p>It’s not a be all and end all but it’s a nice bauble to have.</p>
<p>Re: GPA’s, I think I’ve counted at least five different ones if you go abroad on a program that isn’t run by Smith (where the units count but as far as Smith is concerned, they’re all P/NP).</p>
<p>Smith overall
Overall (grades at abroad program included in calculation)
Smith Latin Honors
Major GPA (might have two)
Upper-division GPA</p>
<p>The first is the one you generally put on your resume, the graduate schools often want (or recalculate to) the second, nobody but Smith cares about the third, and some graduate programs are interested in the fourth and fifth.</p>
<p>Quite a few classes can count towards more than one area. If you take a class in, say, French literature, it will count for literature or for language. Moreover, for those like my D who are not scientifically orientated, you can find quite a few ways to fulfill the science requirement without doing any science. She took linguistics and a few of her friends took astronomy (which sounds very technical but apparently isn’t).
You need latin Honors to graduate cum laude or more and also for pbk. If you intend to go for an undergrad thesis or think you may be in the running for junior pbk, you should get the requirements done before senior year.
And SaP is right as usual; only intro language courses require 2 semesters.</p>
<p>Note on Phi Beta Kappa. If you read Smith’s requirements, it is basically IMPOSSIBLE to get into PBK if you go abroad on a non-Smith JYA. Basically, you either have to not go abroad, or only go to Hamburg, Geneva, Florence or Paris if you want to be in PBK.</p>
<p>It’s really annoying if you ask me</p>
<p>R6L, I don’t know what you’re referencing but it’s not impossible to go abroad on a non-Smith program and make PBK: D did a semester in Budapest and made PBK easily. Now, she didn’t make <em>junior</em> PBK, when first cohort is nominated or whatever you call it, but she did make it.</p>
<p>TheDad-I meant to go abroad for a YEAR on a non Smith program, not a semester
Sorry for any confusion.
I’ll get out my course catalog and reference my stuff later :)</p>
<p>Hm, I agree that’s weird. I did a semester in England and was inducted into PBK my senior spring. But maybe it’s because you need a certain number of semesters in residence to qualify?</p>
<p>is it hard to get latin honors if you double major?</p>
<p>According to the Bulletin, in order to be eligible for PBK, a student must have 58 credits of graded coursework at Smith, not counting the first year. Junior Year Abroad programs count for Smith credit only if they are Smith programs.</p>
<p>So, let’s say I go abroad for a full year not on a Smith program. I’ll have 64 credits at Smith between my sophomore and senior year. But, if I take more than 1 class in the 5 colleges, i cannot be elected into Phi Beta Kappa. </p>
<p>So, if you go for a full year on a non-Smith program, it’s really hard to get elected unless you take all your classes at Smith</p>
<p>Not necessarily, but it depends what you’re double majoring in, what classes you can double count, and how much extra space you have in your schedule. My advice would be to not worry too much about Latin honors until you’re coming up on sophomore year. Sort out the rest of your classes, your major, your study abroad plans first before you start to worry about paper distinctions. Before you can graduate with honors, you need to get to graduation.</p>
<p>R6L, hmmm…I still don’t know. D double-majored and was away (for just the one semester, not two, other “away” being in Washington. She also sandbagged a few extra units by taking18-20 for several semesters plus a 2-4 J-term units.</p>
<p>If you take only 16 per semester and no J-term, then it could get tight. D did not take any Five College courses.</p>
<p>Well, I take my foreign language through the Five Colleges and normally have taken 2 18 credit semesters. But, first year doesn’t count, so i have zero right now towards that 58. </p>
<p>Next semester, I’m taking 18 credits, but only 12 are at Smith (I’m picking up Uzbek with Turkish) and, odds are, spring my sophomore year will be 12 at Smith, 6 through 5 College Mentored languages. So, after sophomore year I will have 24.</p>
<p>Junior year, none of my credits count, so I’ll have zero.</p>
<p>Then, senior year, I will probably still be taking at least 1 class at 5 Colleges to keep up with my foreign language. SO, for those two semesters, I’ll once again have 24 at Smith, leaving me 10 shy of being eligible for PBK. Even if I do J term sophomore and senior year for 2 credits/Jterm, I’m still 6 shy. Unless I do 20 credit semesters which just seems like bad news since my classes are all math/foreign language, pbk is simply not possible.</p>
<p>But, if I went on a Smith JYA, this wouldn’t even be an issue…just saying it’s not super fair</p>
<p>And, I know my situation is a bit specific, but I know a good number of people who plan to go abroad for a whole year on a non-Smith program and take classes through the 5 colleges who are royally screwed</p>
<p>Well, I agree that that is somewhat unfair, but the simple fact of the matter is they can’t possibly accept every senior who is qualified based on GPA, so they have to make some of the qualifications more stringent in order to have some clear way of cutting down the numbers. Also, it’s fairly unusal to be in a situation where your doing so many credits away from Smith, so I think your situation is indeed specific. </p>
<p>Anyway, IMHO PBK and Latin Honors and all of it are just icing on the cake. Obviously it’s not worth re-orienting your whole schedule and I honestly don’t even think it’s worth getting worked up over. It’s nice to get of course, everyone likes to be recognized, but it’s much better I think to go abroad or to learn a language or to fulfill your overall educational goals, whether or not you get the honors. In the end, it’s just another line on your resume, but it doesn’t substantially change you or help you grow as a person like new experiences and skills can.</p>
<p>What a wise and wonderful comment, S&P! My advice to my daughter is to make the most of her undergraduate experience and take the best and most challenging courses. GPA considerations come a distant third in my opinion.</p>
<p>R6L,</p>
<p>My daughter was encouraged, and at times pushed, by her advisor and thesis advisor to fulfill the Latin Honors requirements. Instead of spending time in classes for no other reason than they ‘counted’ toward Latin Honors requirements, she was much more interested in taking courses she enjoyed, fulfilled her intellectual curiosity, and allowed her to study aboard where, how long, with no consideration or concern if she was going to accrue the necessary credits for Latin Honors.</p>
<p>In the end, and with my support and understanding, she did it her way. She would have anyway. However, it was gracious of her to include me in her decision making process.</p>
<p>My sister-in-law is a renown scientist, researcher and professor at an Ivy med school. She also mentors undergrads. I highly value her opinions and suggestions. She too agreed with, and was in full support of, my daughter’s decision.</p>
<p>Although only one data point of reference, last year my daughter competed against kids from the top colleges in the Boston area and beyond for a very desirable job in her field. She was offered a position, they weren’t. Not having Latin honors, at this juncture anyway, doesn’t seem to have been a hindrance. In the future, if she’s passed over for a job for someone who has, as TheDad would say, a nice bauble, she might regret her decision. So be it.</p>
<p>As usual, SmithandProud is prophetic and wise beyond her years. Her thoughts, among many, should be required reading for all first-years and beyond…and parents.
</p>
<p>Upbeat’s comments are no less inspired. They too should be part of the ‘First-Years Handbook’ of required reading
</p>
<p>Sophian editorial:</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Not even a line on a resume. A quarter line.</p>
<p>B.A., Smith College, <year> <major(s)>, <latin honors=“” designation=“”></latin></major(s)></year></p>
<p>But look, if you’ve achieved that level of performance without taking the designated breadth requirements, your resume is going to shine anyway. The LH designation may help for lazy resume readers and quick sorters…of which there are far too many…but that’s not sufficient reason, imho, to stress over it.</p>
<p>And I think it’s easier in some majors than others to stub one’s academic toe. (Then again, one of D’s friends missed “magna” because of a “C” in a two-unit computer class Senior year.) The biochem/neuroscience and engineering routes can be difficult for the GPA. </p>
<p>Note mostly to parents: D generally didn’t discuss grades though she was kind enough to let us know what she got at the end of the semester. I was certainly aware of the possibility as semester after semester passed but I kept my !@#$%# mouth shut. It was only senior year and then last semester that the notion of it becoming “real” was unavoidable to contemplate; don’t know if she felt pressure, but oddly enough I did. If you’ve seen the movie “Chariots of Fire,” there’s a scene towards the end where Sam Massebini, who isn’t allowed into the stadium, hears the British national anthem being played after the 100-yd. dash is run…it’s the only way he knows that Harold Abrams has won the event. His reaction is kinda how I felt when I read the graduation program though I do not own a straw boater.</p>
<p>I mainly agree with the above posts, and I certainly don’t think getting LH is worth sacrificing a more complete education for. On the other hand, although there is a certain amount of “cheating” in the honors distribution, it does encourage a certain number of students to reach beyond their safety zone and hopefully discover a new passion. One of D’s gripes is about the amount of foreign students who major in a language they already speak perfectly and take a minimum amount of risks in order to maintain a very high GPA. I honestly don’t think this technique, although probably useful for some grad school applications, is worth 50K per annum.</p>