Lefty Academics

Parents Forum
41

<p>Shy and overmatched or overwhelmed. Hmm. That's not good. I wasn't shy.</p>

<p>OP what about my suggestion to look for your fellow wrong-hea....I mean conservative kin? If you give me the name of the school I bet I can google up some likely hiding places. P.M. me. Remember, I'm a fellow 10%er.</p>

<p>For those who were like me on the other side of this equation</p>

<p>the fine arts departments
the film society
english journal or review
the creative writing bunch in general</p>

<p>and these departments always did well for me:
sociology, social psych
history
poli sci
IR (or as my D's school calls it IS) </p>

<p>I wouldn't have been looking in the Business School. (Of course my best friend got a BBA and would vote for Mussolini given the chance.)</p>

42

<p>Ah! Thanks, cur!</p>

43

<p>What's a "GDI"? A resident of Mallett Hall. Maybe it is a Southern thing Curmudge.</p>

<p>My D is a relatively conservative person at NE institution. She has run into one or two instances of profs, always, sadly women, who seemed to insist on their party line vs any other opinion. Usually in the realm of some event in history or change occurred because of the oppression of women, not economics or politics or the fact there was a bubonic plague. My D tends to be feisty in class, but I think she has had to modify her position in papers for grade reasons, rarely. These instances have been isolated, however - you are always going to find some people with prejudices, even those who think they have none. On the other hand, she has had more profs who are looking for other opinions, you can't have a discussion without opinions, and you can't learn to form an argument without practicing. </p>

<p>That's why I always liked science, not a lot of room for political opinion in acid-base reactions ;). Theoretical physics is another thing, though.</p>

44

<p>OP,</p>

<p>I don't doubt your assessment of the political environment there. I think you should consider transferring. There are some "moderate" colleges out there that don't go too far the other way (USC comes immediately to mind), and I think you'd be happier at one of them. I would.</p>

45

<p>"</p>

<p>Quote:
Most American college professors are WAY too conservative for my taste, and would be seen as such by their international colleagues.
It depends upon which "international colleagues" you are referring to. Europe, yes. Middle and Far East, they are far more conservative than anything we have around here."</p>

<p>I have lectured in India and in Thailand, and was in school in Europe. I know professors in Africa. I'll stand by what I wrote.</p>

46

<p>
[quote]
What I see -- a lot -- is that conservative kids learn their argument style from conservative talk radio

[/quote]
</p>

<p>This cracked me up, btw. Do you really know "a lot" of kids who actually listen to talk radio???? I didn't think any kids even listened to music on the radio anymore since IPods were invented!</p>

47

<p>iPod batteries die! And iPods are still relative luxury items.</p>

<p>College kids don't seem to listen to the radio much, unless they are on it. High school kids -- who spend more time in cars and in busses -- are a different matter. But your point is well taken -- technology has dated my response. The people about whom I was thinking are probably in their mid-20s now.</p>

<p>Still, maybe it's conservative internet blogs, but even on CC I think you see a certain deliberately outrageous, self-satisfied style to a lot of conservative arguments. Not that liberals are completely exempt from it, but they (we) tend to whine and cajole more.</p>

48

<p>I would think that if you studied in Jordan, Pakistan, or Indonesia, you might have had a different experience, mini.</p>

49

<p>
[quote]
I know that there is a lot of political diversity throughout the U.S., but New England seems to be much more liberal than my region, at least in general.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>That is quite possible. I live there now, and it is certainly more liberal than the region I came from (which from my perspective is relaxing since I had never been in the majority before, but I do sometimes feel guilty about not being on the front lines).</p>

<p>
[quote]
I would never disrespect any gay student, if for no other reason than that I know there would be consequences for doing so.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Hmm. It worries me that you imply that your main reason for respecting gay students is fear of consequences. I'm hoping you didn't mean that the way I read it.</p>

<p>
[quote]
My professors routinely find fault with western civilization, while glorifying Africa, the Middle East, etc and sugarcoating their histories and cultures. While the west has not been perfect, it isn't right to ignore the many great contributions it has made. Or the contributions of white men, rather than learning about how racist and sexist they were.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>While I don't doubt that there are people as biased (not "liberal", but "biased") as you say, I have to wonder whether your interpretation of what these particular people are saying has involved running their comments through a mental filter, since by your own admission, you have not been exposed much to these viewpoints before. Perhaps your interpretation is correct, but I have heard people describe any exploration of historical racism or sexism, or criticism of the West, as what you are saying.</p>

<p>
[quote]
One of my professors this semester is constantly bashing Evangelical Christian perspectives (there aren't many Evangelical Christians at my school). While I have no problem with free speech, if she did this to any other group (racial, sexual orientation, etc.) she would be severely reprimanded.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>There's nothing wrong with bashing a viewpoint, as long as you are clear that it is your opinion (e.g. "I strongly disagree with the Christian Coalition's position on [issue] for blah blah reasons, and think that their leaders are bigoted against [group] based on these things they have said!"). The problem is when you attack the people (e.g. "Evangelical Christians are a bunch of ignorant bigots!") or overgeneralize (e.g. "I strongly disagree with the evangelical Christian perspective on [issue] for blah blah reasons, and think they are all bigoted against [group]!"). Are you sure that you're making the distinction?</p>

<p>Anyway, if you haven't done so, I would suggest trying to start a dialog with your liberal colleagues. You can end up friends with people who have very different worldviews - that's one thing I learned from growing up in red states. Again, if there's actual harassment or other crime/policy violation, report it to the proper authorities. If you really can't tolerate it, transfer, but if you're not going to transfer, report as necessary, fight for your rights, and learn to deal.</p>

50

<p>Oh good grief... a little liberalism will do you good, OP. I feel NO PITY for you -- some of us liberals have had to put up with conservative b-s of our states, our newspapers, our bosses, our government FOR YEARS AND YEARS! I say, grumpily, suck it up boy. It's what my family and friends have been doing longer than you have been alive...</p>

51

<p>OP,
Do not despair, however right you are! There are more like you than you think. Unfortunately, we are too quiet.</p>

52

<p>It's funny how our views are colored by our backgrounds.</p>

<p>In the early 1990s, I moved from the Boston are to Texas (DFW). People there hate Ted Kennedy. Funny thing was that I never could get one single specific thing they did not like about him - one policy they could name, for example. </p>

<p>I was also amazed at the intolerance levels down there. Fortunately, there were a lot of "equal opportunity" bigots. They did not just dislike the traditional minorities, like african amaricans and latinos. They also disliked catholics, jews, mormons and anyone from up north. We yankee expats, many of us doubly or triply cursed, had our fun.</p>

<p>But the most interesting thing for me was the long discussions I had with many colleages (yes, holding all of these biases) about the background for these things. We did not agree, but I learned a lot, and have a better understanding of why, for example, our politics is so polarized.</p>

53

<p>"I would think that if you studied in Jordan, Pakistan, or Indonesia, you might have had a different experience, mini."</p>

<p>Not very large parts of the world, is it?</p>

54

<p>Not a large part of the world, but those 3 countries (Jordan not being that big in and of itself) have more population than the US and Canada and before the latest expansion of the EU had roughly the same population.</p>

<p>The point here is that the muslim world (primarily dominated by conservative tribal governmental institutions) is actually larger in population than the Christian world. IIRC there was a recent news article (can't find it right now) saying that Islam has passed Christianity in the number of followers on the planet.</p>

<p>And those countries are growing fast in wealth and world political influence. While we in the west think so grandly of our world dominance of the last millenium, there are other cultures that seek to take that leadership from us. They are developing their own ideology and schools to propogate their thinking. While western institutions may not recognize their scholarship, we will have to deal with their cultures in this increasingly small world.</p>

<p>And their cultures are far more tribal and not at all like our liberal western thought.</p>

<p>Your experience is in what you think of as the bigger part of the world, but the world is a changin...</p>

55

<p>goaliedad, I may not agree with mini all the time, but given his background (not all of which is discussed in his prior post), what you posted above looks awfully silly.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
the muslim world... primarily dominated by conservative tribal governmental institutions...And their cultures are far more tribal and not at all like our liberal western thought.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Geesh. Does goaliedad know anything about Indonesia? Malaysia? Or even Egypt or Turkey? Each is a "muslim" country, yet no sane person could say these countries have "tribal" or conservative governments, unless you are willing to concede that the US now has "tribal" conservative government. It is interesting to note the similarities between the religious battles in Turkey over religious expression by traditional muslims and the battles in the US, led by evangelicals, over religious expression here, especially in schools, with issues such as prayer in school and creation science. </p>

<p>What makes goaliedad's post all the more sad is that in a number of ways we have even less in common culturally with India. It is easy to be misled by the common language, especially when one realizes English is only a language of the upper classes/castes in India.</p>

57

<p>JHS,</p>

<p>I know mini is far from the OP in political bent and from his post calling most US academics conservative compared with internationals, I am simply questioning what his definition of internationals is. </p>

<p>Yes, while typically most university environments are more liberal than the culture surrounding them, the cultures of the Islamic world are far more traditional (read that in most views conservative) than our most conservative areas. And in those areas, the concepts of free speech are not as well developed nor defended as they are in the west, so the degree of departure from the political center of their culture is much more limited than western departure from the political center of western cultures.</p>

<p>And I spend my days on a campus as well, in one of the more "conservative" regions of the country. The academics here are considerably more liberal than the students they instruct. Yes, there probably is more diversity of thought (read that more conservative views) in the faculty here than where I went to school on the west coast, but the bulk of the faculty here that I've met would not qualify as conservative at all. Plenty of John Kerry bumper stickers in faculty lots and not as many W stickers as you would think. Now the small privates in my region are quite different, but they are smaller and command a smaller share of college market share than the publics.</p>

<p>Mini has his view of the world, what is big and small, conservative and liberal. I have seen different and how I measure the outside world is different from mini.</p>

<p>To say my view looks silly does not take into account our different views of the world.</p>

58

<p>newmassdad,</p>

<p>I would hardly classify any of the countries (even Turkey) as anywhere near liberal in their political outlook. I'll give Turkey a lot of credit for managing a difficult situation in their Kurdish regions better than most who have ethnic (loosly translated tribal) issues. It is still a government that uses its institutions (military, police) to stifle political dissent that is tribally oriented.</p>

<p>I'm not sure where you get the idea the we have a tribal government. Last I've seen they haven't been calling out the national guard here to subjugate any particular ethnic group. </p>

<p>Those of you who think we have the most conservative culture in the planet and academia to match are truly blind to how free and liberal we truly are.</p>

59

<p>Duerre</p>

<p>"One of my professors this semester is constantly bashing Evangelical Christian perspectives (there aren't many Evangelical Christians at my school). While I have no problem with free speech, if she did this to any other group (racial, sexual orientation, etc.) she would be severely reprimanded. It's a double standard."</p>

<p>Take notes. Keep a record of the specific wording, and the specific dates. Take this to the Dean.</p>

<p>There is no excuse for double standards.</p>

60

<p>OP, were you able to visit this college before choosing to attend (sorry if you've already addressed this; I just skimmed the last few pages of the thread)? I always thought that liberal arts schools were just colleges/universities with "curricula aimed at imparting general knowledge and developing intellectual capacities, in contrast to professional, vocational, or technical curricula." It wasn't until I visited a LAC that I realized they tend to have "fairly" liberal student bodies, as well. After three days at the particular college, I knew LACs wouldn't be for me (as a right-leaning moderate)... Perhaps you could transfer, or be more vocal about your own personal views (they can express their opinions, they same way you can express yours)?</p>