Life of the student-athlete

Parents Forum
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<p>I'll share a few things to do with her athletics and the college process. I believe to be at the very top of one's sport (beyond the state level), a student would need to do that sport year round, both in and outside of school. It is more than just varsity athletics. Alwaysamom's D's friends are in that league. For my D, she never wanted to specialize in just one of her passions (like her sister has chosen to do). Therefore, she had three varsity sports, one in each season. She used to have four actually, but switched her school sport in spring from softball (which she had played for nine years) to tennis (which until then was a summer sport). Anyway, none of her sports (soccer, ski racing, tennis) were year round for HER. Even so, she achieved at all three, often at the state level. To go the "next level" in either of these sports, she would have had to play it all year long. In soccer, that means playing for an elite travel team, not just a varsity team. In ski racing, it means attending a private ski racing academy (not a normal high school) and while one of the best is near us and she has trained in their weekend program since age 6, she was not willing to throw all her eggs in the ski racing basket, plus for academic reasons would not have chosen that specialized tiny high school, nor given up her other loves like music, dance, tennis. She did compete on both her varsity ski team and in USSA races but became less competitive on the USSA circuit when beyond age 14 when most who still race that circuit are all attending ski academies. Recruited kids in that sport do not come from normal high school but rather ski academies, even though someone like her excelled on the state or eastern level in high school racing. In tennis to be recruited, it would mean having a USTA ranking. She was always the number one singles seed at our school and did well in high school tennis and played on a tour of Europe one summer, she never had a USTA ranking as those events are rarely held in our state and means traveling out of state to obtain that ranking and she was not home in summers, nor played year round. So, she knew she would never be a recruited athlete in any of her sports most likely because while she excelled at each of them, it was not on a national level or something along those lines. Even so, it was important to her to continue playing these in college as they are lifelong passions. </p>

<p>When selecting colleges, ONE of her criteria was that the school HAD to have a ski team at ANY level. She did not care the level that much as long as she did not have to give up this love of her life. She is used to ski training six days per week and so was not ready to give it up entirely but knew she already would be doing it less in college than here. As long as a college had a club or varsity team in that sport, it stayed on her list. For soccer or tennis, in some cases, she felt she might be able to play varsity or JV but if not, made sure they had a club team (these are more common sports for a school to have, as well, than ski racing). She contacted coaches in her sports at her schools, or captains of club teams. </p>

<p>For ski racing, only two schools on her list had a varsity team, Brown and Smith. The other schools had club ski teams and she met with them all and was happy with what she learned of the opportunities with that. At Brown, if it had turned out that she got no indication of being able to be on the varsity team, she would NOT have attended Brown because ski racing was that important to her. I won't get into all the contact hassles with the coach at Brown but eventually that coach did tell her last winter that if she were admitted to contact her and would not meet until that time. I believe she was only allowed one recruit and that was not my D and the recruit was in during ED, and my D applied RD. As well, my D traveled to a ski race that both Brown and Smith were at and not only met up with those teams but also the Smith coach arranged for my D to forerun the race and so they saw her race. When we went to the open house for admitted students at Brown, finally my D got to meet the coach (won't get into the 11th hour glitch minutes before they were to meet) who did indicate that she would be able to race for them if she chose to come there. The entire open house event was full of many positives and this was clearly one of them that made my D say she wanted to go there at the end of that visit. While she was happy to do this sport on a club team at other schools, and academics and other things were far more important in her college selection, the idea of skiing for this varsity Div. 1 team even sounded better and sweetened everything else she already liked about this college that seemed to fit her. </p>

<p>As far as any other VARSITY college teams......while not recruited, she did ask to meet with the tennis, soccer, and ski varsity coaches at Smith on her visit there and all were highly encouraging and she was told she could play for all those teams and met with kids on the team, saw a practice of the tennis team, etc. This was on normal visits, not recruiting type things. In fact, Smith was not one of my D's top or favorite choices but come April when she realized she could be on varsity teams in her three sports there, and then was offered the Stride Scholar there, a "pull" existed that was quite enticing to have people seem like they "want" you and so at the very end of this process, she narrowed her acceptances down to three schools to go back to and decide between and actually Smith was one of them likely cause of all this "wanting you" feeling in all these areas, plus she liked the school a lot. However, she had never wanted all girls even though she liked Smith a lot. She realized after the Open House of accepted students that while she loved it and the opportunities there for her were wonderful, she really preferred a coed school. At Tufts, the tennis coach indicated on a regular visit, that she likely could be on their JV team and that also was good enough to my D, as she just wants to continue competing in her sports but picking a school was more centered on other factors. The Brown club tennis team actually plays the JV team at Tufts so that is an indication to the level of a club team. The Brown club tennis team plays Princeton too and I imagine that might be Princeton's JV team (which the coach at Princeton indicated was a team my D could try out for if/once she was a student there). So, there are opportunities for student athletes beyond the recruited ones. </p>

<p>When my D did some practices with the Club Soccer team this fall at Brown, she said many kids were like her...who were lifelong soccer players who were very good at it in high school who simply were not the recruited athletes from the elite travel teams. She actually loved the people on the club team. </p>

<p>So, that is an inkling to how it can work for a student athlete who is not a nationally ranked player or who plays more than one sport, etc. The way it has turned out for my D at her school, it appears she will play on the club level in two of her sports and on the varsity level (there is no club level at her college) in one of her sports, the one she is most passionate about. She is pretty thrilled with how it turned out. She picked her schools over other criteria and academics and so forth but clearly researched and met with those on campus as well to explore what opportunities there would be for her to continue at SOME level of play in her sports on each campus. Perhaps some kids would only be happy if they got on a varsity team in college but for my D, it mostly mattered if she could continue to play competitively in college. Naturally the fact that her favorite sport turned out to be a spot on a varsity team is even better in her eyes but was not crucial. Many on her college varsity ski team come from ski academies, not normal public high schools, like she does. So, she is happy to compete and train with these kids. She has already bonded with them and it is one "group" of kids she is friends with on campus as she is with them daily but she has an entirely different group of friends there she has made unrelated to her team. Also, over the holiday/Jan. break, the girls and boys' teams will be going away for a training camp for a few weeks to Waterville Valley (I think) which she will love too. </p>

<p>All in all, that is a picture of how it can turn out for a kid who is not at the tippy top of her sport (or not on a national level) but has held a lifelong passion and commitment to it and achieved at a state level in it. I hope this anecdotal bit is helpful to those going through the college process now. </p>

<p>Susan</p>

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<p>soozievt - thank you so much for that enlightening post. I thought we were the only ones going through contact hassles with coaches. My D sounds like she swims at the level of skill and involvement that your D does her sports, and she has the same desire: to keep competing one way or another. I didn't know of any way outside of varsity teams until now and we may have crossed schools off her lists that had club swimming! Not good. Living out of the country outside of the expat network with no chance to visit these schools doesn't help either. What my D will need is what your D got before she committed to a school: assurance that she can be on the team. My D does not want killer swimming; she knows a gal who had to change majors to keep swimming on her D1 team and that is not in her plan. With an engineering course, a Lower Div school would be ideal, but most of them are in areas with weather like she is trying to escape or so tough to get into that she might not make it thru admissions. Then when the need for serious financial aid is added to the package, I sometimes begin to wonder why I ever thought an American school was even a possibility. But thanks for your story as I no longer feel it's just us because we live so far away. I really didn't understand recruitment at all!</p>

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<p>USmominUK--saw your post and I hope things work out for your daughter. A couple of thoughts, besides the "DiSalvo mantra" as far as getting that book. Where is she looking? There are some very good D3 and small D1s in good climates, including Emory, Davidson, Pomona, Claremont-McKenna, Scripps, Pitzer (all the latter Claremont colleges), Trinity in Texas--that have strong academic programs, strong sports, and good weather. Most of the D3s really don't recruit too seriously until about now. </p>

<p>As far as the not being recruited part, there really always is a chance to walk on to a team at the D3 level if you are good. D1 it is a little bit more rare but it can happen if your daughter is really competitive in her sport. You should go to the school websites and see if you can check times in meet result reports and compare to your daughter's. She should by all means be doing the recruiting forms that are available on most of the school websites via email. Also at the D3 level, sometimes it takes a lot of persistence to get the coach to notice--they are very busy always and are often a 1-person show to do everything--coach their kids, plan meets and arrange all of the logistics of the team, deal with the school--that recruiting often takes a back seat to the present demands in their sport. </p>

<p>Hope things work out for your daughter.</p>

<p>Also, a friend of mine whose son plays on the same team as my son just posted the following on another message board and I thought it was worth quoting here for an upbeat thought about college athletics:</p>

<p>"OK, here's the thing I'm hearing over-and-over from my son about his very early college experience.</p>

<p>Team cohesiveness - Never has he played on a team where the players are so "tight" and close to each other. They hang out together, root for each other, help each other, advise each other, lean on each other.</p>

<p>I have no idea if its the norm...I suspect it is...young men away from home for the first time with a difficult job but on a common mission. And it sure sounds fun!"</p>

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<p>D attempted contact with a Div III coach and heard back from them asking for a phone number! The system works! Of course, she still has to be admitted.... Thanks everyone for all the information; it has really helped.</p>

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<p>USMominUK....sounds great...keep us posted!
Susan</p>

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<p>A lesson learned from assorted friends, whose sons/daughters were recruited Ivy League & D1 athletes:</p>

<p>Make sure you love the school above and beyond the sport. The coach who recruited you can leave, and the new coach may not be as keen on you as the recruiting coach. Or, heaven forbid, you get severly injured, ending your athletic career at the school.</p>

<p>This happened to a number of kids I know. All were <em>extremely</em> unhappy, as they had not considered what college would be like apart from sports.</p>

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<p>Great! There were a couple of coaches who needed more than one contact attempt before responding, but once they did, they were very enthusiastic and wonderful, so never give up if you don't hear after the first email or recruiting questionnaire is sent in--have your daughter send a nice email saying that she is really interested, etc. Let us know!</p>

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<p>USMominUK, swimming has a major advantage over many other sports in that you can see exactly where the athlete stands in relationship to the team. Any times that she has (you may have to convert to yards) can be compared to what the college has. If she is well in the ball park in some events, she may well be a recruited athlete at a school. Certainly have her get on the athletic websites and e-mail the swim coaches and fill out a recruit questionnaire that many have right there. </p>

<p>Most colleges I know have some form of intramural or club swim team but if you are looking to use the activity as an admissions edge, your D would need to fit into the NCAA team for the most part, though active participation in athletics is considered a plus even if the student does not become a contributing athlete on the collegiate level. It's just that it can impact the decision much more if the athletic department has her on their recruit list. As Susan pointed out, many teams have limits on recruits, and in such cases, a coach may not want to spend time with a potential player that he knows he cannot get in. Though I am surprised that the Brown coach in Susan's D's case did not show a little bit more interest. Even in a couple of schools where S was not a recruit for quota reasons, the coaches kept in close contact with him and put in a word for admissions in hopes that it might "tip" him in. At Wm & Mary, for example, the team was very limited in the number of out of state recruits, and the coach already had two guys he really wanted to use for that quota. But because S's stats put him in running for admittance in the regular pool, the coach did say that he would send a memo to admissions letting them know that he would be wanted by the team. In that situation he would have to go through the same admissions review as everyone else applying rather than being admitted through a conference between the athletic director and the designated athletics liason from admissions, but the note from the coach would be an "edge" or "tip" factor rather than a fait accompli or "tag". So there are many ways this can go.</p>

<p>I think I posted some schools on the Financial Aid forum for you. I have worked with a lot of swimmers in the past, as one of the US clubs contracted me to work with their swimmers, and I made many contacts as a result. Female swimmers have it a lot easier, and the times do not necessarily have to be that great. If you post some times, I can probably give you some idea where your D would place.</p>

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<p>Jamimom, everything your wrote is EXCELLENT advice and really describes the situation well. As you say, you don't have to be an official recruit but do have to have contacts with the coach who may still have some tip room or at least be able to indicate if your child has a chance to join this team once they get there even though they have a small quota given to them for recruits, they still have other slots available. Continual contact is key. You are far more experienced than I with this but I agree with everything you wrote and you gave superb advice. </p>

<p>Since you did refer to my D's situation with the coach at Brown, I guess I will share more that I did not before, only because the coach has since resigned so I don't see harm in it at this point as she is not my D's coach afterall. While I can share our experience, I can assure you that since our experiences unfolded, we have heard numerous similar accounts about this coach that were not specific to my D whatsoever. So her story about this follows....</p>

<p>As with all coaches, my D did write them letters with info. about herself and so forth and asked to meet when she did the campus visits. Let me say that as far as her sport of ski racing (was not her only sport but will just stick with this one for now), she only cared that she could continue to ski race in college as it is a lifelong passion and she was not ready to give that up. She would not attend a school where she would never ski race. But she WOULD attend a school that had a ski race club team, as sports were not her sole college selection criteria by a long shot but she just needed to keep participating at any level. Of her 8 schools, as far as skiing goes, 6 had club teams and 2 (Smith and Brown) had varsity teams. She met with each club team and liked what she heard and knew she could be on those teams as they do not have cuts. For Smith, she met with the coach and kids when on a visit and he was very encouraging to my D. In fact, while my D originally did not have Smith as a fave school or did not prefer all girls, Smith started to look more and more appealing to my D over time because all three of her varsity sport coaches were so encouraging when she met them and it is enticing to have people come across as WANTING you, ya know? The opportunities added up and then she got the Stride Scholar there and so she preferred that school over her safeties and even over Penn, in part due to some of this I think. </p>

<p>With Brown, she had called to see if she could chat with the coach on our visit junior year but she never returned any letters or calls. During the app process, my D wrote the Brown coach with all her information, sent a resume, wrote about her interest in this school and team, and all that jazz. She sent it via snail and e mail both. She never got any responses. She eventually sent a video as well. No reponses or acknowledgement of receipt or any form letter, nothing. Then my D noticed that both the Smith and Brown ski teams were going to be at a Boston College Ski Race Festival in VT about 90 miles from us and decided she wanted to travel to it and meet up with the coaches (had already met the Smith one on a visit a couple months prior) and have a chance to see the race and talk with girls on the teams. She contacted both coaches about this. The Smith coach was enthusiastic and even arranged with Boston College to have my daughter forerun the race. Ski races have about two racers who are NOT participants in the official race, do the course first to make sure that the course has no problems (kinda like guinea pigs, lol) and they do get a time but they do not count in the race. My D was really psyched that she would forerun the course so the coaches could see her race skills. The Brown coach did not respond to my D's letters about seeing if she could at least say hi at the race or to let her know she would be forerunning it. </p>

<p>Since my D never got any responses, we were not sure the coach was receiving any of the voice mails, snail mails or emails that were sent without a way to even know or be acknowledged...not even a "no thanks". I had spoken to the athletic director who told me to write it all to him and he also was going to talk to the coach. THAT time, my D did get a note back that if she got admitted to Brown in April, she was then to contact the coach immediately. I am telling this out of order as this was BEFORE my D sent letters about asking to meet up with her at the race in VT. When my D never heard back from the notes regarding her traveling to see the Brown team at the VT race, I did talk to the assistant athletic director who was wonderful and extremely apologetic and admitted that the coach should have been responding to such inquiries. She had suggested my D call the coach's cell phone and she did and left message and none were ever returned. The assistant athletic director also told my D that sometimes the coach might not open email if she thought it was junk or virus email but my D had clearly put her name and the heading of prospective Brown ski racer in the headings. The athletic coach was entirely sympathetic and I could tell she did not think it was right that my D never heard anything back on any of the attempts and now that she was going to travel to see the team, she had no idea if the coach knew or just what. When I told her that my D was a lifelong long ski racer and that it was important to her to continue racing in college and that while she LOVED Brown, she would NOT attend if she could not do her sport there and so would need to know that to make a decision should she ever be admitted. She told me that my D should let the coach know this (believe me she tried). She must have talked to the coach and the coach sent a note about the race in VT and that she might not be able to talk to my D due to NCAA rules. I know there are strict rules and all but I don't completely get this because they have never spoken once, it was winter of D's senior year and she was an applicant, and the Smith coach, also an NCAA team, never once hesitated. </p>

<p>When my D got to the race, she indeed foreran both runs and was seen by these coaches and the assistant athletic director from Brown herself was there watching too. My D went up to girls on Brown's team to chat and learn more about the team. She said many of the girls were excellent racers but that she was faster than a couple of them, not the majority, and the girls were telling her that they felt she could make that team (others involved in ski racing have said that about Brown's team too). The assistant athletic director was friendly to my D and met her and so forth. The coach said hello for like a minute but they did not really talk hardly at all. Basically, in any correspondence attempts by my D, the coach really did not respond (though am NOW hearing that others had this exact same experience with her so it was not about my D per se). </p>

<p>continued below...</p>

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<p>When my D got accepted to Brown, she was excited and wanted to go to three schools' open houses for accepted students to decide where to go. In Brown's case, however, there was this one part that would affect if it was in the running though because if she could not ski there, she would NOT go, because she could ski at all her other schools and Brown does NOT have a club team so it was either the Div. I varsity team there or nothing. Why pick nothing when she loved several schools? She did love other aspects about Brown all along and sports again was NOT her main criteria but she does want to keep ski racing. So, when she got accepted, she followed the coach's directions to contact her immediately and she did write her. Again, the coach did not respond in a timely fashion. My D was trying to let her know that she not only got in but that she was coming to the April open house and would love a chance to talk to her about the possibility of skiiing for Brown. The assistant athletic director may have intervened again, I am losing track. So, she did set up an appointment and my D was very excited. She did not know what the outcome would be but FINALLY she was going to talk to her! </p>

<p>I was down at Brown at the time staying in a hotel and my D was doing the overnight in the dorms as part of this open house event. Her appointment was around 9 AM the next morning with the ski coach. My husband calls me on my cell at 8:30 that morning from home here in VT that the ski coach at Brown had just called and said she cannot meet with my D without her transcript IN her hands based on some rule she just found out or something like that! Talk about last minute! The coach said she tried to reach our high school to no avail that morning (our school was on spring vacation). My hubby frantically called me to see where he could find a transcript and my D is SO organized and had folders for each of her colleges and had xeroxed her entire application package for each one that he went into her room and found the transcript and faxed it to the coach minutes before my D was to walk into her office. He also said how lucky we were that he was still home and had not yet left for work as he normally would have by that time. In fact, I have no idea why the coach was calling us in VT when we were down in RI of course at the open house. Also I have no idea why she could not get the transcript from the admissions office, PLUS my D was registered for the NCAA which involved having her transcripts being approved. IF this was some big rule she had to follow before the meeting, I have no clue why she did not mention it when they lined it up and why it came up at the very last second literally. This meeting almost never came off and my D never would have gone to Brown! </p>

<p>Anyway, they had the meeting and the coach was VERY encouraging and told my D she COULD be on the team and they chatted all about it and she gave her an indication about where she would "rank" within the team slots which was in a decent slot (given that so many of the girls had come out of private ski academies) and she only wanted to race and she was not at the bottom even. My D was SOOOOOOOOOOO happy when she learned she could ski if she went there and on a varsity Div. 1 team no less. So many other things at Brown came together on that visit and she picked Brown on the spot at the end of the 24 hour open house. </p>

<p>THEN (you mean there is more???).....over the summer, my D wrote the Brown ski coach to ask two things...one was that the freshmen orientation packet mentioned that there was a required meeting/gathering of all varsity athletes the night before move in day and she was wondering if she needed to go and if so her parents had to line up work and hotel arrangements. Secondly, she wanted to know what specific training suggestions she might have that my D could do over the summer to be in shape for the team. She never heard a word back! My D decided to contact one of the older girls on the team, getting the contact info. on the internet. The girl was SO nice and wrote my D a long letter and was NOT surprised at all about the coach's "behavior". She said she really did not need to go to the varsity meeting and that likely the coach would not even acknowledge her if she were to attend (we did end up going however). There were inklings in that letter from this student that something was amiss with this coach. Our local ski academy and some faculty/coaches there were also telling us some stories about this coach that were similar. The local academy had a student who also was going to go as a freshman racer though my D did not know her (though NOW they have met and are very good friends), and this girl had similar experiences. I heard some other stuff as well. </p>

<p>Then about a week later, in August, my D gets an email from the ski racer on the Brown team who she was corresponding with at that point who wrote that the coach at Brown had "quit" and now they were without a coach! </p>

<p>Now, my concern was that who at Brown was going to know that the coach promised my D she would ski fro Brown and in fact, was one thing that impacted her decision to go there as she would not have if she could not ski in college, as she had 5 other choices she could have picked where she was able to ski race. The athletic director also resigned (unrelated). My D wrote the assistant athletic director who indeed remembered my D and informed her that she was told by the outgoing coach she could ski and she hoped that whichever new coach came in would know that or have a list, as well as that my D wanted to be on any mailing lists of info. that goes to the team. The Assist AD wrote that she would make sure my D's name was on that list and that she was kept informed and that she would be on a list of racers for this year given a new coach when they got one. She could not say what the new coach would say but we could not worry too much about that at this point. </p>

<p>When school started, the team was without a coach. They have practiced seven times per week in dryland training. There are four freshman girls but only one was an official recruit I believe. The girls are very experienced racers. The assistant AD has met with the team and in fact, let the girls do an interview session of their own with the two finalists for the coach position. Brown went with the coach the girls liked. The new coach started about two weeks ago. My D loves the team, both older kids and freshmen, and it is going great, same with the new coach. It has all worked out. </p>

<p>So, Jamimom, that is the explanation to this somewhat weird situation to which you were saying yourself about the Brown's coach's "interest". It is not like she was or was not interested but just was not doing her job it seemed. When she finally did meet with my D she acted very interested and said she could be on the team. But it was an ENTIRELY different approach or process than the one that the Smith coach did! After my D got into Smith, he had the entire team write her a card to hope she would come and each girl signed it individually. They also all met with her when she returned for the open house. That all was quite enticing but my D really likes Brown more so that was the thing. She had NO idea if she could ski for Brown and was in the dark til the last minute and thus was not sure she would attend there. This piece of information was missing, unfortunately until the moment of decision was upon her.</p>

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<p>Patient: can I ask what your son's sport is? Mine was offered a spot on the same school's baseball team, but is hesitant to commit because of the great rush of other activities into the vacuum left by not playing sports for the first time in his life.</p>

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<p>Wow, Susan. Did not mean to pry. I should have known that it was something like that. Similar thing occurred to my son during his athletic search as well. He was dumped from one list when the coach at that college left, and the new one wanted his own recruits. One school dropped his sport that summer which explained why he was dropped after the coaches had assured him he was tops on their list. Another school was not interested in him because they had another prospect which happened to be a former teammate but they were not forthright about the entire thing. So it is not necessarily a smooth road going the athletic route. Many people mistakenly think it is. It so depends on the school, the athletic department, the coach and the sport. </p>

<p>I am glad that your D did get on the varsity team. What a coup that was, being a D-1 team. It is amazing, however, that even at the very top schools there are a few people there involved in admissions that are so disinterested.</p>

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<p>Idler--I'd be happy to discuss this privately with you, if you will activate your private messaging on your control panel.</p>