Looking for Safety/Match Recommendations?

College Search & Selection
1

<p>Hello everyone! My name's Diana, and I'm a senior currently looking to whittle down a list of safeties and matches. I'm currently applying through Questbridge to most of my high reaches (Columbia, UChicago, etc.), but I'm not 100% sure I'll even be a Questbridge finalist. So, I'm looking for some help in choosing some safety and match schools in the likely case that none of my high reaches work out. Here are my stats:</p>

<p>Hispanic (Central American) Female
Location - Washington State
Single parent household
Income - < 40,000</p>

<p>UW GPA - 3.89/4.00 (I've had a 4.00 GPA since 2nd semester Freshman year; I got a 3.663 GPA 1st semester... I also got a B this past summer taking Precalc at my community college, which bumped my GPA down again.)
W GPA - My school doesn't weigh.
ACT - 32 (35 E, 31 M, 34 R, 27 S)
SAT IIs - 630 Bio E, 700 Math I, 690 USH (taking Math II and Lit in October)
AP - 2 Junior Year (APUSH 5, AP Lang 5), 5 Senior Year (AP Lit, AP Bio, AP Physics, AP French, AP Calc AB), and 4 honors classes
Ranking - Top 13% of class</p>

<p>Extracurricular:
- Competitive figure skater of 10 years: Novice-level in both Freeskate and Moves in the Field
- I volunteer at my local hospital, currently at 325+ hours. Also volunteer monthly with children with disabilities.
- National Honor Society; secretary Junior year.
- Participant in Washington Aerospace Scholars (a NASA program)
- Took Precalc over the summer at my local CC</p>

<p>Honors/Awards:
- National Hispanic Recognition Program Scholar
- High School Honor Roll
- Questbridge College Prep Scholar
- Ventures Scholar</p>

<p>Planning on applying to:</p>

<p>Through Questbridge:
University of Chicago
Princeton
University of Pennsylvania
Columbia
Dartmouth
Brown University
University of Notre Dame
Northwestern University</p>

<p>Outside of Questbridge:
Yale
Harvard (my mom's making me)
Cornell
University of Washington</p>

<p>As you can see, I am in dire need of school safeties/matches. xD</p>

<p>(Just some extra info that might make a difference: my sister (who lives with us) is severely mentally and physically disabled; I have to help my mom take care of her constantly, and my mom was diagnosed with breast cancer a couple of years ago, and underwent treatment for that for two years. My father passed away a couple of years ago.) </p>

<p>Location: Anywhere in the US except in the South, or where it's too hot. (I know this is ridiculous, but I want to be somewhere where it snows at least once a year.) I'd love to be on the East coast if I could find some matches over there.
For my safeties, I'm assuming that they should probably be here in Washington state, or in neighboring states such as Oregon. But I'd also like to know if there'd be any out of state, where I could get a comparable amount of financial aid, but a better education than at the U of Washington (Seattle), for example. Same thing for matches. My mom's willing to pay for transportation.
I'd like to find a match on the East coast, if at all possible?</p>

<p>Money: No money saved away for college. Financial aid is of the UTMOST concern; it is the MOST important factor of all. Looking for schools that could give me good financial aid for ACT scores or being a Nat'l Hispanic Recognition Scholar, if that's possible. I would like to avoid loans if at all possible. My mom's EFC is about 700, I believe. I'd die for a full ride, but I don't know of colleges other than Ivy Leagues that give full aid?</p>

<p>Looking to study Biology, as I'd like to go to medical school to study to become a physician in the future. But I like keeping an open mind to other majors. I'm not really looking into Liberal Arts colleges.</p>

<p>I think that that's pretty much everything... if I left something out, please let me know!
Thank you so much for taking the time to read this (and for leaving safety/match recommendations if you do!!)</p>

<p>I hope you have a beautiful day! :)</p>

<p>Diana</p>

2

<p>Just asking this as a reality check… who will help your mom with your sister when you are away? Is your mom in remission now from her cancer? Are you sure you want to go so far away given your family issues? All great schools on your list, but just asking. Maybe adding some west coast schools might be a good idea, as you may feel differently about going so far away when May 1 comes (and gives you options in case something else comes up in your family between now and then). Also… your odds of achieving the high grades needed to get into med school may be better at some safety/match colleges. </p>

<p>I know you also said no LACs, but there are some LACs (especially those in the range of 20-50 in the US News rankings) that give nice merit aid packages, so you could end up with fewer loans. Important for someone who has to go on to pay for med school.</p>

3

<p>

</p>

<p>Try looking at the automatic-full-ride-for-stats scholarship schools here (that you qualify for) to see if any are suitable for you: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1348012-automatic-full-tuition-full-ride-scholarships.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1348012-automatic-full-tuition-full-ride-scholarships.html&lt;/a&gt; . If you do like any of them, they can be safeties.</p>

<p>Try the net price calculators on the various schools’ web sites to see if their need-based aid will be sufficient to make them affordable. The most generous tend to be either wealthy highly selective private schools, and in-state public schools in some states (you better hope that Washington is one of them). Out of state public schools are usually not good with financial aid (possible exceptions: UNC-CH and Virginia). If the school’s need-based aid is insufficient, check to see whether it has sufficiently large merit scholarships that you have at least a chance for – and then assess reach/match/safety based on the merit scholarships, not admission.</p>

4

<p>Washington State if they have merit/fin aid for you</p>

5

<p>Hello, intparent! Thank you for replying! :slight_smile:
My younger brother helps take care of my sister; we also have a lot of family members that help, also. If I leave the state, my mother told me that she won’t be impacted (in terms of my sister’s care) greatly. My mother has also been in remission for five years now (woohoo!). I’ve discussed this with my mother at length, and she’s stated that she wants me to seek better opportunities than I have here, and she wants me to study out of state if I can.
Yes, I need to add some west coast schools; I was hoping someone would pop in and give their opinion on schools here in Washington, but I’m definitely researching it myself.
Do you think that maybe it’d be better not to go to such a high-caliber school such as an Ivy league in terms of med school admissions? I’m very unsure about this part; would my chances be better if I went to a smaller/match school?
Thank you very much for your response!</p>

<p>Hi, ucbalumnus! Thank you for the link; it’s very helpful! :slight_smile:
Yes, we’ve been going through various net price calculators, so I have an idea of what I’m probably going to end up paying for various colleges in my region and also on the East coast. By Virginia, do you mean University of Virginia, or another university?
I was wondering if you’d be able to clarify: do you apply for merit scholarships while attending the college, or is the college able to say how much they’d be able to give you in merit scholarships before you accept an offer of admission? (I’m sorry if I seem so ignorant… I’m trying to get familiar with a lot of aspects of the college process in terms of financial aid.)
Thank you, again! :)</p>

6

<p>Virginia = University of Virginia</p>

<p>One normally applies for merit scholarships when applying to the college as a freshman or transfer applicant, though some are available to students already enrolled. For scholarships applied to during the process of applying to the college, the offer of the scholarship should be given before the deadline to decide whether or not to attend. There may or may not be a separate application process for scholarships, or a separate application process for some scholarships but not others.</p>

<p>Large merit scholarship opportunities are most generous for freshman applicants, since the offering of large merit scholarships is a way for colleges to compete for and attract students whom the college thinks are desirable. Once the student enrolls, such competition is limited only to the possibility of transfer-out or drop-out, so scholarship opportunities tend to be much less after enrolling. Merit scholarships for transfer applicants tend to be less available than for freshman applicants, because transfer applicants tend to have fewer choices of schools willing to accept non-trivial numbers of transfer students at all.</p>

7

<p>Colleges will let you know about merit scholarships from college before you have to decide where to go. The timing varies from college to college; generally the information is sent separately after your actual acceptance. Most merit scholarships are renewable over four years of college, although most have a minimum GPA that you have to maintain to keep it. Some schools show possible merit aid in their calculators, but some do not. Be sure you are looking carefully at how much you will have to take out in loans as you run each calculator; you really want to limit that as much as possible, as you will surely need to take out loans for med school.</p>

<p>Others may disagree, but my simplistic view of the med school admissions process is this:</p>

<ul>
<li>GPA is important to med school admissions. In general, it is easier to get a higher GPA at a school where you fall in the top 50% of the students in terms of test scores (SAT/ACT).</li>
<li>Obviously you also need to do well on the MCAT, so the school has to be strong enough to prepare you well for that. My sense is that any top 50 LAC or top 40 university in the US News rankings can do a good job of preparing you for med school if you also work hard. Your list is heavy on “name brand” reach schools; it is good that you are looking to expand your list beyond that.</li>
<li>Many students (of course) go on to medical school from the Ivies and top universities; however, poor grades can kill your chances even if you graduate from a top school.</li>
<li>Biology is an intensely competitive major because it has so many pre-med students in it who know they need very good grades for med school. You can definitely also go to med school with other majors as long as you also take the pre-med prequisites and are prepared for the MCAT. But you do still have to take those core med school prerequisite classes with the other pre-meds no matter where you go.</li>
<li>I do have some bias toward LACs (freely admitted), although I attended a highly ranked public university. The reason is small class sizes and classes taught by professors (not TAs). I know other posters will debate this (CC discusses this topic ad-nauseum), but just want to make sure you have considered this factor in selecting schools. Find out the size of intro Bio and organic chem classes at each college on your list as part of your research process. Consider that at some colleges you may end up with TAs teaching the lab or sections, and sometimes English is not their first language (French speaking TA in Chem 101 made that class VERY difficult for me at the large university I attended). Big schools offer more courses, but you can only take so many courses in 4 years anyway.</li>
</ul>

<p>Sorry I am not giving you more concrete school suggestions at this point. :slight_smile: But these other topics warrant some discussion as part of generating a school list.</p>

8

<p>Thank you for the clarification, ucbalumnus! I was under the impression that one would be awarded merit scholarships after accepting a school’s offer, but it’s much better to be able to know what merit scholarships one could get before accepting!! Thank you, again! :)</p>

<p>Hi intparent, thank you for your detailed response! :slight_smile:
You seem to be knowledgeable about LACs. Would med schools look down at you at all for going to a LAC versus a larger research university? I’m hesitant to apply to LACs because I’m under the (I’m assuming false) impression that they might not fully prepare me for medical school. (After I just typed that previous sentence, though, I think I should probably read up a little bit more on LACs.) I’m also worried a bit about the competition if I have the opportunity to attend an Ivy League school; all of the students at those schools are incredibly driven, as am I, and I can see it becoming somewhat cutthroat. I believe that I’m going to stick with Biology as my major, because it’s what I’m really interested in: I entertained the thought of majoring in something else while still fulfilling my medical school requirements, but I realized that I might end up dragging my feet halfway through another major.
I was researching the University of Washington here in my home state, and I found out that some of the entry-level science classes can be about 400 students, and can get to the point of students stealing other student’s homework. I was thinking about looking at relatively smaller schools where that could be at least partially avoided. Would you happen to know if these sort of classes would show up at LACs, or even the Ivy Leagues?
Thank you so much, intparent! :)</p>

9

<p>For class sizes, you can see if the college has an on-line schedule of classes that lists how big the classes are.</p>

<p>LACs, being small, may be limited in course offerings in some subjects (not the same at all LACs, as they have different emphases), but pre-med courses (which are similar to or the same as the introductory biology major courses) are very commonly offered even at non-science-oriented LACs. As biology is a rather broad subject, the more advanced course offerings in the subject may vary considerably from one school to another (LAC or otherwise).</p>

10

<p>Oh, I never thought about checking class sizes online! I definitely need to go do that.
Would some of the top-ranked LACs perhaps have more course offers than lower ranked or smaller LACs? You mentioned, ucbalumnus, that there are also non-science oriented LACs; would you say that the majority are science-oriented, or should I look specifically into each one to see if they focus more on the sciences?
Are the more advanced course offerings at LACs comparable to those at research universities? Does the fact that LACs don’t offer graduate course work affect those course offerings at all, or any other facet of the school?
Thank you for the replies! :)</p>

11

<p>Here is what I would say about LACs and course offerings:</p>

<ul>
<li><p>Take a look at the course catalog and read the Biology department website at some LACs to see what is offered. Remember, you can only take 32 courses at most colleges in 4 years, and you generally have core requirements to fulfill in other areas as well. Most majors only require you to take 8-9 classes in the major. You will also be taking some chem and physics as well to get ready for the MCAT. So whether a college offers 15 courses or 50 may not make a huge difference in your undergrad experience.</p></li>
<li><p>Different colleges DO have different focus in Bio, so look at the websites and course offerings to determine this. Bio is so broad these days that there are tons of options.</p></li>
<li><p>The thing about large research institutions is that (1) you may not get much opportunity to research as an undergrad – sometimes grad students get most of the research/lab time, and (2) those same grad students are often teaching your classes (see TA discussion above). Many LACs offer research opportunities, and there are only undergrads there to do the research with professors. One of my kids is going to be a science major (senior also this year), and major in either Physics or Bio. One thing she is interested in is colleges that encourage (or even require) a senior thesis/project – Bio majors who do these usually do a year long research project with support from faculty. Good prep for med or grad school.</p></li>
<li><p>Med schools absolutely do NOT look down on LACs for admissions. LAC grads often have better communication skills than science majors from research universities (not always, of course). They can fulfill the same course requirements and score well on the MCAT. </p></li>
<li><p>I don’t really think the higher ranked LACs offer more courses than the lower ranked ones. Stay in the top 50 LACs, and you will find them pretty comparable. As stated above, I think lack of grad students ADDS to the undergrad experience at an LAC (no grad student competition for professors’ attention, almost all classes taught by professors).</p></li>
<li><p>LACs do have a smaller “social pool”. For some people that is an issue to have only a couple thousand students on campus.</p></li>
<li><p>Another benefit of LACs is that many of them are committed to helping any student who wants to study abroad (if you are interested). Your financial aid generally goes with you. The LACs often make an effort to make sure science/pre-med students can go abroad. Those are the hardest majors to study abroad with typically (so many requirements for med school, hard to take those classes in a foreign language). Most LACs will work with you on that if you are interested; some even promote that science students can study abroad.</p></li>
</ul>

<p>Here is a link to a thread I started a few years ago on strength of Biology departments at LACs. I think it containst some pro/con discussions, also some links to resources about different colleges. <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1035344-lacs-strong-biology-departments.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1035344-lacs-strong-biology-departments.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

12

<p>Wow, thank you for that informative post! :slight_smile:
I hadn’t really thought to look much into LACs until now, but I think that I’ll start looking a little more indepth. I, personally, would probably thrive better in a smaller environment such as a LAC, but I assumed that I would get a better quality education at a research university. Your points of being able to interact more with professors isn’t something I’d really taken note of, but now that I’ve been reading a bit more into LACs with the links I’ve been provided, that seems like something important as a pre-med. I’ve been looking on LAC websites such as Williams, and seeing the tutorials with professors that they offer, and it’s really piqued my interest.
Thank you so much, again, intparent; you’ve really been a great help! :)</p>

13

<p>Great, glad to hear it. Just to say, though, Williams is nobody’s safety or match school! I would dip down to a few in the 10-25 US News Ranking to consider for matches. Remember, you want to be able to get the GPA you need for med school. And have a few schools you are more sure of getting into. Going to the 25-50 range might net you some very good merit aid in addition to need based aid, and might make it possible to come out with very small amount of loans. Med students often end up with $250,000 in loans, so this is a very serious consideration. Run the calculators for all of them, and read up on possible merit aid as well.</p>

14

<p>I totally agree with Intparent. I graduated from Carleton as a Biology major, and then got into Northwestern Univ. Med School. I truly feel that I had just as good preparation and research experiences as kids at the “big research universities”. In fact, as Intparent mentioned, I felt that I had an added benefit in getting into med school: working in small classes, very directly with the professor, helps you to learn the material much better. Also, the teachers know you quite well, so it is easy to get good letters of rec for med school admissions. I’ve heard stories of kids at big universities, even top students, having to struggle to get an overworked professor to take the time to do their letter (or will that prof even remember the kid, even an A student, when he/she teaches classes of 200 or more). So I’d definitely suggest considering good LAC’s!</p>

15

<p>Yes, LACs are looking appealing to me in terms of being able to connect more with professors, and I’m understanding that it may be easier to get a good GPA, depending on the LACs’ rank.
I’m also afraid of getting lost in a class at a big research university, as jennieling mentioned. I’m not an incredibly gregarious person, so trying to get a professor with hundreds of students to write me a letter of recommendation might be difficult.
I’ve been looking at the websites of some LACs, and a lot of them advertise a close-knit atmosphere, which appeals to me greatly.</p>

<p>Thank you for enlightening me on the topic of LACs! :slight_smile: I’m still trying to look for matches, but I’ll be looking through the top 50 LACs and see if any colleges interest me there in addition to the regular university list.</p>