<p>I know that this will sound trite, but someday, none of this will matter. My D, too, was rejected from her first choice school, and we believe it is because of diversity and finances - too many middle class white kids trying to get $ there. Then, the FA at 2nd choice school was terrible! But surprise! She was accepted at Amherst, visited, and fell in love. The FA worked for us. Everything fell into place. She never even mentions the other schools, and can't see herself attending anywhere else. BTW, she was a diversity admit, even though white and middle class. Region and finances placed here there. Just as she has become a major Amherst rooter, so will you of the school wherever you attend. And I hope that it is Amherst, but if it isn't, I know you will find that you will love and be happy wherever you attend. And believe me, I was extremely bitter as well, and now realize that going to the other school would not have been as good for D. But at the time, it really hurt both of us. I sympathize, and understand your pain.</p>
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but who worked their buts off all through high school to get a high GPA and SAT and then didn't fit some demographic niche and therefore didn't get any sort of reward for all of their hard work.
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<p>You have been rewarded and you still have time to reap tremendous benefits from your hard work. Unfortunately the rewards that you were seeking aren't as available as you had hoped and understandibly you are seeking a scapegoat. I only hope that you wouldn't allow this perceived setback to fester and build more resentment. That you would continue to make the most of your other opportunities, and let's face it, you should have some. You have the option of allowing your disappointment to become a stepping stone or a stumbling block.</p>
<p>I truly empathisize with flippinout and other students like him or her. It is disappointing not be accepted at a school you set your heart on. However, the reality is that 80% of the applicants to Amherst and other competitive colleges are well qualified and therefore can do the work and thrive there. All colleges strive to fit niches, and it is probably even more extreme at smaller colleges where they seek to have representation in many programs from sports, academics, arts, etc. despite their small class sizes. Besides demographics (which you have no control over), areas where you have chosen to become proficient acadamically or extra-curricularly may play a role that you may have no contol over. It has been said that being a Classics major may make one an attractive candidate since most schools maintain the department and need majors which are generally few. So if that is your interest, perhaps it may give you an edge. Maybe the same could be said for other areas such as astrophysics or medieval history or whatever area the college may deem attractive and needs students. On the other hand, most colleges will only take a handful of such students. And what if you have no interest is these areas? Likewise, if the first flautist of the orchestra is a graduating senior, perhaps being a star flautist may be an edge. On the other hand, there also could be 10 other excellent flautists in the applicant pool so it may turn out not to be an edge. I guess what I am trying to say is that it is very difficult to predict a priori what precise criteria X college is looking for (other than high grades and scores which you mentioned and which most applicants have) and whether you will be accepted at X competitive college. Some students try to increase their odds and options by applying to many schools which certainly is easier nowadays given the common application. However, I think a student's time is better spent in focusing on applications to good safety and match schools (where they know they would be happy and thrive), in addition to a few reach schools. Additionally, the proliferation of applications only compounds the problem by further decreasing the odds for tops students gaining admissions to the most competitive colleges, and truly gives applicants the impression that it is a lottery.</p>
<p>I agree with Catfish that you should not let college acceptances be the only measure of your high school achievements and hard work. You earned those and should be proud of them! It is disappointing when you do not get into your top choices and it would have been nice to have had an acceptance as validation. On the other hand, those achievements and lessons learned, in terms of self-discipline, perseverance, determiniation,etc. will serve you well wherever you attend college and beyond. I also believe that we have a fairly open system with respect to graduate and professional schools in the U.S if that is where you are later aiming for. If you do well wherever you go to college, you will create good eductional opportunities down the road and should be able to achieve your career goals and dreams. It is tough but do not let a college rejection deter you from them.</p>
<p>saying that AA is dead is nonsense, and somewhat offensive. two african american friends of mine (IRL of course) were accepted to stanford - when i told them i was waitlisted, both consoled me by saying that my resume was better than theirs, and that i should have gotten in over them - that AA screwed me over.</p>
<p>the point is, maybe kristina is overlooking a lot of important things, but the results are still somewhat telling. i saw a few 1700s that were accepted to stanford...and that is annoying and obnoxious. and don't pull the whole not enough money to study properly nonsense. my SAT investment was 0 dollars - i borrowed books from friends and from the library. i self-studied, and improved my score drastically. but my three friends and i who were all accepted to amherst and harvey mudd and pomona were hard-working, well-rounded, and strong applicants - two white, and one asian. i'm sure there was an element of luck, and i do feel bad for kristina. if you want to go buy pie and everyone else is offered apple, cherry, and blueberry, while you are only offered cherry and blueberry, is an obnoxious and annoying circumstance.</p>
<p>i think that overall it is difficult to speculate without having more holistic information, but regardless, kristina has a point...albeit, not a huge or lifechanging one.</p>
<p>So Chrone, the two AA students who were selected over you weren't "qualified" in your view??You assume that SAT scores are the definitive variable? I'm sure that you've read the volumes of literature on admissions committees "creating a class". I suggest you read Pmyen #43's post. It explains in plan English the complexity of the process.</p>
<p>Chone, Stanford may have divined something from your application that Amherst, Ponoma and Mudd missed. Good for Stanford.</p>
<p>Chone, what would you say if the student with the 1700 score was a wealthy, white legacy, whose father made a major contribution to the university the same year that he applied? This happened in my brother's high school class when an academically undistinguished student was "surprisngly" admitted to Harvard. Or what if he belonged to a well-connected political family in which his father was a congressman from Texas and his grandfather was a former U.S. senator?</p>
<p>Unfortunately, life is not always fair even when colleges try to do so in their selection process. Sometimes priorities such as alumni relations and diversity come into play. But as I said earlier, these are one of many priorities in comprising the "ideal" class envisioned by the admissions committee.</p>
<p>Chone, if you come to Amherst you will learn that diversity is very much valued by the student body. On the other hand, I don't know or care about anyone's SAT score. I think Catfish said it previously in this thread, but Amherst wants to create the most enriching academic experience for its students. This would absolutely not involve a class filled with self-entitled white and Asians who think their SAT score actually represents something meaningful. Your attitude will not serve you well here.</p>
<p>I wholeheartedly agree with unregistered. My daughter attends Amherst and she says no one knows or cares about anyone elses "stats". She said everyone works hard. She said you don't know whose rich or who isn't by the way kids dress,etc. She says everyone lives in the dorms so you can't compare houses, etc. It's a rich, DIVERSE and wonderful community. I think these admissions people know what they're doing when they put these classes together. And, indeed, as pymen noted, all of these elite colleges have students they admit due to long family and money ties . Read, Daniel Golden's "The Price of Admissions: How America's Ruling Class Buys Its Way into Elite Collges - and who Gets Left Outside the Gate"</p>
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This would absolutely not involve a class filled with self-entitled white and Asians who think their SAT score actually represents something meaningful. Your attitude will not serve you well here.
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<p>Haha--but, surely, they're entitled to something, aren't they?
Well, like Kristina, they have their Ivy League.</p>
<p>I think they're entitled to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Admission to an elite private college? Not quite.</p>
<p>unregistered: I admire Amherst for its values and agree with the points you have made. But it's not easy being the one rejected when others are accepted who SEEM to have achieved less.</p>
<p>So although I find your point of view accurate and wise, I can understand those rejected chafing a little, although the OP, with two Ivy acceptances, does not have my sympathy.</p>
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This would absolutely not involve a class filled with self-entitled white and Asians who think their SAT score actually represents something meaningful
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<p>Unregistered, it's ironic that you come across as both discriminatory and self-entitled yourself. Way to make a sweeping generalization about whites/Asians, or about the ethnicity of self-entitled people in general.</p>
<p>Attending Amherst or any of its peer colleges, including the ivies, is a privilege, not an entitlement. I think the commitment to provide financial aid by these colleges opens up that possibility to more people than ever before, although some of us in the middle class and upper middle class still feel the pinch especially if they have several children attending college. I think the attempt to increase diversity (racial, ethnic, geographic, economic) by visiting schools, attracting top students that are URMs or from underprivileged backgrounds through diversity programs, and then making sure that they have the resources and support to succeed (like the Tony Jack story, which I found inspiring) is a way for places like Amherst to provide that privilege to some who may never have even considered it possible to attend there. By doing so, Amherst provides a better education for its students(inside and outside the classroom) and also enlarges its social and academic mission. </p>
<p>Knowing this does not make it easier for those high achieving applicants that were not accepted unfortunately. As has been said previously, there are way too many excellent students for too few spots, and each college (particularly a private one) has the right to define its priorities in admissions.</p>
<p>I wholeheartedly agree with pmyen. I'm African American and we pay full tuition for our daughter to attend Amherst (although I'm sure most people think ALL students of color get free rides). This isn't not true and I know many other parenst of color who are middle and upper class who get no aid. Eventhough my husband and I are first generation college, we have been very fortunate in having attended excellent colleges and universities and have good jobs. Still, it is a big financial strain to pay full tuition, since we don't come from inherited wealth, etc. Every penny we have, we earned. None of it was given to us. So, we could also sit around and bemoan the fact that other kids are getting money while our child is not. I think society benefits when these poorer and more disadvantaged youth can break out of that cycle. Amherst has the second highest graduation rate of Black students in the country (95% next to Harvard's 96). This is quite impressive. It means that these students not only persist and do well but they LIKE being at Amherst. Lots of students transfer from institutions because they don't like the social climate. Amherst is an extraordinary institution that I can't say enough positive things about. You need to give these people credit for knowing what they're doing in the admission department.</p>
<p>lmpw: I was very moved by your post and concur with everything you expressed, though I am not a person of color.</p>
<p>And you are also funding poor white students.</p>
<p>Sharing is an important value.</p>
<p>I am not self-entitled, for all my flaws, I never expected to go to a school like Amherst and was extremely grateful and surprised to be accepted. I am not sure what that I said came off as self-entitled, but I would like to know so that I can watch my posts more carefully. I never implied that all white and Asian people are self-entitled (or that all self-entitled people are white or Asian). Obviously there are many people of all races who are self-entitled, and many who aren't. I feel silly even saying it. In the context of the thread, I do not think my comments were at all inappropriate. </p>
<p>Mythmom, you're right. I also can understand the sting, but comments about Amherst "sacrificing everything for the sake of diversity" really bug me. I don't know if OP wanted to go to Amherst or just wanted to collect a lot of acceptances (I am sorry if that is a loaded term) but it is very hard to sympathize. I know my posts in this thread have probably been a bit harsh, but I have felt compelled to speak because so many people have raised this sentiment and, well, this is my beloved school! I don't want to hear a single word against it ;)</p>
<p>What a lovely post, unregistered. And Impw, too.</p>
<p>Thanks. I just know what a difference a good education can make in a person's life - particularly ones who have not had the many advantages of others. This will pay off in a big way to society. These students will inspire others from similar backgrounds to do the same. While I'm sure those students who didn't get into Amherst will not feel this way, it's clear that these rejected and/or waitlisted students have other excellent choices. It's not like it's Amherst or nothing. I just think we need to be a little more generous in our thinking.</p>
<p>Well some have been wait listing or rejected to every college they applied to, and some to all but their in state safeties. So for some, the sting is great.</p>
<p>You are right, though. That does not change the service Amherst is doing to society, both in improving lives of those who don't usually get this chance, and society at large for including these voices in intellectual discourse. Go Amherst!</p>
<p>unregistered: I understand your sentiments and sympathize. And I do understand your questions about the OP. But there are others heart broken they couldn't attend Amherst.</p>
<p>That said, I have said way to many nice things about Amherst for the mother of a Williams student. I hope he never sees this thread. (See winky face. Just kidding.)</p>