<p>I agree that cheating is bad but can any1 tell me if it's okay to add hours of transportation time to activities, hours of work done on activities outside activities, etc? Do these hours count?</p>
<p>Patiently, his mother is a secretary at our school. It was his parents' idea to start marking the ethnicity, so they've had it on all the forms since high school. It is, sadly, air-tight.</p>
<p>I think that a good number of people lie or exaggerate. I really doubt they would check, or could check to verify things like ecs. Atleast he's not lying about grades, I've heard of a lot of people doing that on their uc apps. So maybe he won't have earned his acceptance, but then maybe he'll be underprepared and screwed in the end.</p>
<p>Willywonka-
That is disgraceful. Wonderful role model this parent is being. But, it is not "airtight" if somebody anonymously notifies the adcomms at the colleges to which this kid is applying. Whistleblowing is appropriate in many situations, and this looks like one of them. I'd encourage you to either do it yourself (contact the colleges) or notify some appropriate authority in your school. Most schools require students to sign Honor Codes. Both the student and parent failed on this one, and there should be a consequence for the parent/secretary as well. Sets a terrible example for the school, and administration should have the right to look into it. After all , it effects the high school's reputation. Each college can decide if this kids lineage qualifies as "hispanic". Gee, all you have to do is go back a few generations and then boatloads of kids can qualify as some sort of minority.</p>
<p>I could never do that. I would just... I don't know. I have faith in him not to use it for scholarships, especially local ones where someone could know who he is. And like I said, my only real stake in the whole situation is t he local scholarships.</p>
<p>Survival of the Fittest. Even if you have to cheat a tad:)</p>
<p>For instance people whom do more then one sport and only make varsity on one sport then the rest jv, make themselves appear that they made varsity for all. I.E; Varsity soccer, football, track. Though they only did varsity for soccer, it appears as if he/she did straight varsity.</p>
<p>It happends all the time. It's up to the colleges to determine the fate of it.</p>
<p>Willywonka-
As Howard K. Smith said, "if you are not part of the solution,you are part of the problem". Is the story you describe about the student claiming to be hispanic when he isn't documented and/or public knowledge? Are you ssure his isn't of Spanish heritage or something?? Does it pass the "smell" test?? (ie-- does it stink??). Surely there must be some way this can be addressed. If it is more than a stretch, it becomes a lie-- fraud. That can and should have serious consequences. I really hope that just because it may not affect you directly that you don't just sit on your hands. I believe there is some say of determining what percent you have to be of some ethnic group to be able to meet criteria for being considered to meet criteria for classification as that ethnic group. Anyone know??</p>
<p>What's the big deal about lying about your race on an application? Logic would seem to indicate that what colour you are in no way affects how intelligent you are, or what kind of personality you have. If someone wants to stretch the truth a bit, more power to them. I'd do it myself, if I wasn't whiter than a sheet.</p>
<p>"i'm sorry to say, but your classmate is f***ed because high schools indicate the applicant's race on the official transcript they send to colleges."</p>
<p>No they don't.</p>
<p>What if you joined mid-year or late that year, can you say that you did it that year?</p>
<p>Education should be based on merit, not all that stuff. If the person has such low self-respect to lie about his or her ethnicity, or even his or her activities, that person just doesn't deserve a decent education. Also, the whole idea of affirmative action is a big problem with me, even though I myself am an immigrant. I don't think it is right for such a thing to exist. I would never use my status as an immigrant to get ahead of someone in a competitive college. I don't think anyone should, since it should be based on who is most fit for the position, not whos ancestors have struggled the most. Anyways, just my 2 cents.</p>
<p>Don't get me wrong, I'm a supporter of "affirmative action." I believe it's about more than just minority % in the student body-- it is, like everything else, about building a community.</p>
<p>This person, as Peter described himself, is "as white as a sheet." He was a bit more talkative about it last year, when he told me that his great grandfather is hispanic, and his grandfather is hispanic-american. Starting with his great grandfather, the ethnicity has been halved with each generation.</p>
<p>His applications are sent, and I really am not interested in ruining his life for this youthful indiscretion, practically forced upon him by his parents. Scholarships, like I said, are a different story. I found out today that he's the only person from my school (1 of 3 from my county) who moved on to the next round of the Coca-Cola Scholarship. It's difficult to say this in any way without merely sounding jealous, but he did not deserve this honor in the least. I'm going to talk to him about at least not applying to the scholarships in this way. The rest I'll leave to fate, and I suppose that makes me a coward.</p>
<p>The score: Jediknight- 1 , PeterSGC- 0. I am glad to see some students, Jedi, still have integrity. How refreshing. I hope Peter was kidding. Some funding/scholarships are earmarked for certain individuals, and to lie on ones application can cause problems. Not to mention it is outrageous and wrong, and would probably catch up with you at some point.</p>
<p>People cheat and lie all of the time. They also steal, assault and murder. And a number of them get away with it. So if you are asking if every cheater gets caught, the answer is "no" which I am sure you already know. </p>
<p>It is bad to lie and cheat because it starts to define who you are and the way you operate. It is a short cut that can become more addicting than any drug. And most of you kids are so promising that to lie about a few things on your app will likely do you no good or little good, and can really get you into trouble if you get caught. The world of academia is much smaller than any of you can possibly believe. I know as I have been in it for most of my life, and the craziest coincidences happen and people get caught all of the time. What a ridiculous way to start your reputation and your independent life!</p>
<p>If ethnicity didn't play a role, it wouldn't be on there. If GPA didn't matter, it wouldn't be on there either.</p>
<p>You know that really *<strong><em>es me off. I'm a bright guy, and I put a lot of commitment into my activities and that someone can bump me out of the college I have worked so hard for is disgraceful. Especially for me, coming from a small school in which I didn't really know about math contests and the like, the adcoms may think that all of my stuff is made up because I don't really have anything to prove it except for my school and a couple regional awards. Really *</em></strong>es me off. Anybody who thinks that they deserve to go to a selective college, yet lie on the application is a serious hypocrite. Submit your application fairly like everybody else.</p>
<p>That's really my point. If you can't look at your application and think "Wow, I've accomplished a lot in my four years of high school, and I know I would be able to work nicely and be a good contributor at this selective college," you shouldn't bother applying. If you can't say that, why do you even want to go to that college? For the education, or for the reputation? There's an extremely big difference. If you want to go to a university where you think you have no chance, and you think you will once you lie, I frankly have a big problem with that, since now, you're taking up a place from someone who deserves it so much more than you, like scm007.
[quote]
Survival of the Fittest. Even if you have to cheat a tad
[/quote]
My ass. Survival of the fittest? How is that survival? If you want your later life to be based on a lie, knock yourself out. But please don't take a spot from a person who really deserves to go to the college. That's taking away someone's dream college, someone's dream life. So, don't even say the words survival and cheating in the same statement. Thanks.</p>
<p>Zxchen, I would say "no" to transport time but "yes" to before/after stuff, like changing into/out of clothing for sports, dance, etc.</p>
<p>As for most of the other issues raised, I hope to see the liars and cheaters on perp walks some day.</p>
<p>Yeah, these guys who have all these "math awards" and sooo much time devoted are probably going to shaft me. Oh well, you'll all reap the reward of wherever you go, its not like going to Harvard guarantees success, or more money than say a state university. Especially if you go to Graduate school, then it doesn't really matter all that much at all.</p>
<p>Adding ECs you can lie about won't help you much with admissions. Most of the ECs that can be fabricated are usually just generic memberships in a club or activity - nothing interesting that will seperate you from everyone else.</p>
<p>Lying about winning Intel, Siemens, or some other nationally recognized award is different. However, those are soeasy to verify that it's foolish to even try.</p>
<p>So, what your friend's doing is dishonest, but don't worry. It really doesn't help him much and doesn't put you at a disadvantage. He's just running a huge risk of getting an auto-reject while giving a marginal boost to his app.</p>