<p>And also, I believe 300 is an outdated statistic, as it’s probably more these days.</p>
<p>Hmmm. Are kids getting smarter? Or are the SATs getting dumber?</p>
<p>Judging by what I hear from teachers I know, I rather doubt it’s the former.</p>
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[382</a> in the Class of 2010, according to this thread.](<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/sat-preparation/997703-382-class-2010-students-aced-sat.html]382”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/sat-preparation/997703-382-class-2010-students-aced-sat.html)</p>
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Maybe the kids are getting more numerous? Or prep is more popular?</p>
<p>My son had a 36.0 ACT (single sitting), a 240 PSAT (didn’t take the SAT), dual 800 SAT IIs, a 1 in 400 class rank and absolutely killer letters of recommendation. He got rejected by MIT, Yale and Princeton.</p>
<p>He took it in stride. He’s still annoyed, however, by being waitlisted by Rice University. The heat must be getting to them down there!</p>
<p>Nevertheless, he did get accepted at Brown, Amherst (early-write), Williams (early-write) and Northwestern, so we’re not crying, given that the acceptance rates at these 4 schools ranged from 8.7%-18.0% this year. It was a very bloody year to be applying to college!</p>
<p>Well, even if it is two and they reject one that is still 50% :-)</p>
<p>Somebody mentioned Princeton’s U’s statistic earlier. While it is true that perfect GPA has a 14.8 % rate, and 2400 22.4%, if you get lower than those, the percentage dramatically decreases. For example, from 3.9-3.99, it’s 9.5% and for 2100-2200 also 9.5%, and they got lower from there. So, how is it not advantageous for you to get perfect GPA and 2400 on the SAT???</p>
<p>Honestly, whether or not 2400-applicants are appealing in every conceivable respect, some of them are going to get rejected. Yes, scores aren’t everything, but one would expect that on average, people who score 2400 are admissions-savvy enough to put together a convincing app. The fact of the matter is that colleges will reject 2400s because accepting them all would make a statement about the weight of standardized tests (even if they were actually desirable applicants, people would say, “Look! 2400s get 75% acceptance rates into Ivies!”). Colleges love to talk about the qualifications of students they reject.</p>
<p>I am dead serious that I know 4 kids who got a 2400 first try and 1 went to Harvard, 3 went to Yale. 3 of these kids were former students at my high school and 1 of them is a family friend. I’m defintely not saying 2400 guarantees anything, but it sure beats a 2200 or even a 2300 when it comes down to admissions. And all 4 of theses weren’t presidents of 10 clubs but were good people to be around, and that beats “leadership”</p>
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<p>I think your son’s experience with Chapel Hill proves rather than disproves the emphasis top schools place on EC’s and leadership. For a student to prioritize those over schoolwork would be foolish, but to ignore them entirely would be foolish too. I have no doubt that if H and P lined up their apps from Best Stats to Worst Stats that I would not have made the cut, or barely made it. My accomplishments in debate, French, and creative writing, however, prove I can perform inside and outside of the classroom, that I can meet challenges head-on and perform well in academic-but-not-school-related situations. </p>
<p>Frankly, as an adcom, I’d feel a lot more confident admitting someone who had EC’s–whether those be something as academic as math and science competitions or as non-academic as fundraising–that demonstrated accomplishment outside a classroom environment. Outside performance would make me more confident about their ability to bring something into the classroom. But that’s just me, and I’ll admit that the extra-academic element of college admissions makes the process much more stressful in its unpredictability.</p>
<p>It’s quite possible.</p>
<p>Look at silverturtle. Man do I feel bad for that kid.</p>
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Pretty sure he said he got into Columbia…</p>
<p>silverturtle also got into Brown.</p>
<p>The 36/2360 in this household was rejected Harvard and Yale, but in at Stanford and Princeton. So I don’t know if a .500 batting average supports or contradicts the OP’s premise.</p>
<p>The fact that silverturtle did not crack the top tier (HYSP) shows that the system is capable of a false negative.</p>
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I would say that a “top tier” consisting of four schools is a flawed view. Aside from this website, I’ve never heard the term “HYPS” or “HYPSM” or any other combination someone might be inclined to put together. What are you basing your “top tier” on?</p>
<p>silverturtle’s rejections at HYS are not anomalies of 2400er college admissions outcomes. I (4.00/2400) had the exact same results as he did at HYPS this year.</p>
<p>It is also worth noting that humans are reading these applications, and it is quite possible for them to overlook a perfectly wonderful applicant. Additionally, the college application process is not an exact science. You may prepare and get a 4.0/2400/great recommendations/ECs and so on, and then not get into your top choice school. Someone with almost identical stats might. There are many unfair things about the entire process, but if you work hard and truly do your best, I am certain that you will get into a school at which you will eventually be very happy. My personal belief is, if you have a 4.0 (which, lets face it, is not really rare or as difficult to achieve as a 2400) and above a 2250 on your SAT, you will fare well enough and any decision will depend on all the other parts of your application.</p>
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<p>Things could be much worse. The difference between HYPS and Brown/Columbia is quite small in the proper perspective (which probably isn’t College Confidential). Deep disappointment for highly qualified applicants is more likely to be a product of misguided goals than admissions officers’ follies.</p>
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<p>And my son got rejected from the YPM portion of HYPSM, the 3 he chose to apply to, all with perfect academic stats, as I posted on an earlier page. </p>
<p>The problem with these schools is that raw academics just aren’t enough. If you’re a URM or athlete with such stats, you’ll probably get in. If you come from a known feeder school, your school will already have competitive teams and special coaches who can put your kid in a position to win one or more impressive state or national awards or titles. If you go to an typical public school, no one knows about these opportunities, so you never get to prove that you’ve got national-class talent – unless, perhaps, your parents start reading CC when the kid is in 7th grade and start grooming him/her for the acceleration necessary to get into these competition.</p>
<p>Now let us ponder the unintended consequences of this situation over the longer term. It could well be that the true hotbed of creative activity over the next decade may well turn out to be the top-20 colleges just below HYPSM: Those non-URMs that managed to get into HYPSM are quite used to having a boatload of opportunities beyond the classroom. The public- or religious-school kids who had top stats yet few special opportunities might well react like kids in a candy store for the very first time: “Wow! There’s that and that and THAT – I want to try ALL of it.”</p>
<p>There’s that old story about the wise Chinaman who, when offered sympathy for his child’s immediate misfortune, responded “How do you know it is misfortune?” Maybe having to “settle” for Brown or UPenn or Swarthmore or Northwestern will turn out to be true blessing in disguise!</p>
<p>Hi Silverturtle!
Great to hear from you.
Hope all is moving all well for you.
Great attitude.
Thanks for all you have contributed to CC.</p>
<p>I completely agree with the fact that high/perfect scores should be the end-all, be-all to college admissions, as much as people like LadyDianeski want to cry about it. I’m honestly your “average” applicant GPA/score wise to top-20 schools (3.86 UW/33 ACT), but my extra-curriculars, essays, and teacher recs were very good, almost incredible, if I do say so myself. Being president of 2 of the largest clubs in my school and in the state while winning awards in both areas (debate/HOSA), working 70 hours EACH in neurology and cardiology practices, volunteering at the local hospital, etc while having an essay that really PORTRAYED (I emphasize this word because showing, not telling, is imperative to writing a college essay, which is where a lot of top students go wrong) myself as not only a student, but as a person, is really what got adcoms to consider me.</p>
<p>I got accepted to Northwestern, Notre Dame, Emory, Wake Forest, UNC’s Honors Program (1/300 students accepted), NC State’s Honors Program (1/175 accepted), Case Western (80k scholarship), and Tulane (100k scholarship). And I’m an Asian male with NO hooks from a relatively affluent family.</p>
<p>This is proof that scores aren’t everything. Honestly, there’s more to a person than a number on a standardized test. What does that portray? A person who gets a 2150, persay, is honestly at the same level as a person who gets a 2280, because that’s a difference of a couple of questions/section. SAT/ACT tests are used, as a previously poster stated, as BARS to filter out those applicants with very low scores. After this point, honestly, a 2400 can get you past the next few rounds, but when those adcoms SIT AT THAT BIG TABLE and DISCUSS your resume, and all they can come up with as to why they should accept you is just your perfect score, you can bet that your application will be thrown into the waitlist/reject pile.</p>
<p>Now if you have a perfect score along with a great GPA and solid extra-curriculars, then it’s a HUGE push towards acceptance; but if a perfect score is all you’re riding on, then don’t bank on acceptance or you’ll be in for a major surprise. I know some students from my school the past few years who rode solely on ONE part of their app (either strong rank, strong scores, or strong ECs) who applied to just the top schools and 1 safety (no matches) and ended up going to their safety school with the kids who “bummed” their way through high school because of their cockiness. </p>
<p>Remember, a picture is worth 1000 words. And if the adcom can picture you at their school AS A PERSON, not just as a student, then you’re golden. I hope this cleared up some misconceptions as opposed to fueling more debate :)</p>