<p>My son has been accepted to the following Massachusetts schools:</p>
<p>UMass Amherst
Boston University
Clark University
Massachusetts College of Pharmacy and Health Sciences (MCPHS)</p>
<p>He is interested in studying Biology, Chemistry, and other sciences, and he may want to go on in a career as a pharmacist, or something in that area (hence MCPHS).</p>
<p>The annual costs of these schools vary wildly after taking into account scholarships and grants (BU is around $51,000; UMass is around $4,000; Clark and MCPHS are in between).</p>
<p>Two questions that my son (and I) are struggling with:</p>
<p>1) Which of his college possibilities are best for the sciences?</p>
<p>2) For getting a job in the sciences after graduation, does it really matter which of those colleges he attends? Does one of those colleges open more doors than the others?</p>
<p>What do you mean by “getting a job in the sciences”?
If you mean a lab technician job, a reasonable GPA, good recommendations, and research experience is what counts. BU will probably better known around the country, but I’m not sure that the difference is worth $180K…</p>
<p>For more serious career in sciences you’d need a PhD, and in that case it is the PhD granting institution that counts.</p>
<p>Thanks for your thoughts. At this point, my son is thinking more along the lines of research positions in science, as opposed to a lab technician job.</p>
<p>So that raises the question: If he’ll be going for a PhD, which of the schools he is considering will help him most in getting into a good PhD program? And (naive question here) does it matter which undergraduate school he chooses; do the different PhD programs look on some undergraduate schools more favorably than others?</p>
<p>With Boston University, you have the advantage of location for internships or part-time jobs. There are a lot of summer internships in the Boston area for biology majors at Harvard, MIT and the pharma companies and being already there may give him a leg up. It could also take care of the housing issue. Unless you already live in the Boston area. I think that BU would be your top choice if money isn’t an issue.</p>
<p>I took a few courses at Clark many years ago and Clark wasn’t really known for the sciences back then. The area isn’t all that great either.</p>
<p>I think that UMass is a good overall choice at a great price.</p>
<p>Don’t know anything about the other school.</p>
<p>I think either BU or UMass will be a good place to start. He will need a good mentor, and extensive research experience to get into top science PhD programs. A good score on a subject-specific GRE also helps.
PhD programs are normally fully funded, so the grad school cost will not be an issue.</p>
<ol>
<li>BU (great sciences, Boston area, well known, college campus is nonexistent)</li>
<li>UMass (inexpensive, 5 colleges in area, large but has a campus)</li>
<li>Clark (small: individual attention, outside of Boston)</li>
<li>MCPHS (sounds like a vocational school, can he switch majors?)</li>
</ol>
<p>If you can swing it, BU is my choice. UMass is next. Have you visited all of them?</p>
<p>Thanks for your responses. They’re all very helpful and give us more to think about and consider.</p>
<p>My son has briefly visited each of the campuses, so he’ll be spending more time visiting in the coming weeks.</p>
<p>Ignoring money, location, campus life, etc. (all of which are very important, we understand), and focusing exclusively on quality of education and post-undergraduate opportunities in the sciences, what I’m hearing from you all is:</p>
<h1>1 - BU</h1>
<h1>2 - UMass Amherst</h1>
<h1>3 - Clark</h1>
<h1>4 - MCPHS</h1>
<p>Would you agree with that?</p>
<p>And would you say it actually makes a difference, in BU vs. UMass, as far as post-undergraduate opportunities?</p>
<p>BC’s analysis is spot on. Boston/Cambridge area is the home to many biotech/pharma companies, and some of them have summer internship programs for college students who are interested in the sciences and have taken several chem and bio courses. I aslo second nngmm: to be successful in research, one absolutely must have a PhD. Where one gets their PhD matters a lot for landing a good postdoctoral position. A productive postdoc under a well-connected mentor usually opens a door to great research positions.</p>
<p>A nice perk for Clark is that it offers a 5th free year, after which a student graduates with a MA/MS.</p>
<p>While a MS in and of itself does not necessarily provide a leg up in graduate admissions, it does provide another year for additional research and CV strengthening.</p>
<p>I can’t speak for the other three colleges, but Clark is actually strong in the sciences and has built a new sciences building in the last 5 years. It also has unparalleled opportunities for undergraduates to engage in research early on due to the fact that it is an LAC embedded in a small research university. Over 300 undergraduate students a year participate in “academic spree day” in which they present their research to the university community (Clark has a total of 2200 undergraduates). Finally, Worcester is home to the UMASS medical center, less than a ten minute drive from Clark, where again there are terrific opportunities for medical and biomedical reserach for Clarkies. I wouldn’t count Clark out only because it is located in Worcester. Clark also has the advantage of small classes, dedicated and accessible faculty members, and a culture that promotes self-directed learning.</p>
<p>For full disclosure, I’m a Clark alum and my D was just accepted in December early decision. But many people overlook Clark (one of the Loren Pope CTCL schools) merely because of its location. I think that’s a big mistake. I’m a physician and doing my undergraduate work at Clark was no obstacle (in fact I think it was a benefit) to getting into medical school.</p>
<p>BU may be ranked number one on the list above, but will he have any money left to even go to grad school after shelling out over $200k for undergrad? UMass at less than 1/10th of the price seems to be the clear winner for someone who will need to go on to grad school. If he does well there I’d think he’d be in fine shape to be admitted to grad school.</p>
<p>I would not pay an extra $47K per year to attend BU over U Mass Amherst as a science student. I would seriously consider Clark, which has a good rep.</p>
<p>UMASS is immense and cumbersome and it takes a certain personality to make that work. I’d consider Clark too-- I hear only good things, and I have a sense a committed student could make relationships there that would make a real difference. BU might be great, but it’s a lot of dough.</p>
<p>IF he is the type to concentrate and not get distracted UMASS has some great science depts which are a great value relative to the other schools. After UMASS I love BU, it has great eng and science depts. It is also located in Boston, a very nice perk for most college students. Very cut throat tough, they try very hard to weed the non performers out by the end of soph year.</p>
<p>U Mass Amherst is 100 miles from Boston and Cambridge so the concern that summer internships would be difficult to get is misplaced. Getting a summer apartment in Boston is no big deal, and depending on your Son’s grades and connections he should be able to compete with candidates from universities in Boston.</p>
<p>Insofar as graduate school is concerned, the application/decision process is very different from that for undergraduates. Grades, test scores, connections are prime considerations. U Mass is well regarded. I doubt that a degree from BU rather than U Mass would make a significant difference in the process. Both universities have exceptional professors for the higher level courses, which are the ones that matter for graduate school.</p>
<p>I recently was reading my physician’s display of diplomas and noticed one interesting thing; he started in a CUNY! It was his graduate work diplomas that displayed the “big schools” names, but his beginnings were with CUNY. He is an internist with a specialty in infectious diseases and is a consultant in the major area hospitals. I would save the big money for grad school.</p>
<p>Thanks for your message about your daughter and BU.</p>
<p>To help my son and I evaluate BU vs. UMass/Amherst, can you tell me whether your daughter’s BU degree has “opened any doors” for her (either when applying to graduate school, or applying for a job)? </p>
<p>I’m asking because one thing we’re trying to get a handle on is whether BU (versus UMass/Amherst) might lead to more opportunities because of its name.</p>
<p>Robert,
I have worked with 2 folks who have graduated with chem degrees from UMASS Amherst. These guys were incredibly well prepared for work in industry. I have a neighbor who recently graduated from their nursing program, it also was very rigorous, not sure if she took the same science classes given to those majoring in bio and chem, but I know she did not coast through those classes.</p>