Middlebury College or St Andrew's University (Scotland)

College Search & Selection
1

Hi, I’m a British citizen that has lived abroad and attended American schools my whole life. I have recently been accepted to both Middlebury and St Andrew’s but am torn between the two options. I like the campus and some of the courses at Middlebury, but I think that St Andrew’s maybe a safe option given that I have citizenship in that country and it has a renowned Economics program (which I have been admitted to unconditionally). Given that I wish to study economics and geography, which institution should I attend? Which is more reputable with graduate schools? Which is better with finance sector employers?

PS the financial packages I have been offered to both schools are similar in price when taking into account accommodation at SA.

2

You seem to know you cannot count on being able to work in the USA after graduation.
St. A. would be better known in the UK and may offer better preparation for work in the UK (which is not quite the same as saying it is or is not “better” for any specific field of study). Consider opportunities for relevant internships, relevant networking/“connections”, and the value of the degree in your expected location. With all that in mind, I’m inclined to recommend St. A. (even though Midd is one of my favorite colleges, after having spent 2 wonderful summers there.)

3

@tk21769 Thanks for your reply. I am more looking at being able to work internationally rather than in the UK as I wasn’t born in the country and have never lived there. And yes, as of the moment we are not green card holders so working in the states is not definite. I am wondering which would be more valuable to International firms and employers in the economics field (ie Consulting firms (EY, KPMG, Deloitte, Accenture, BCG), IBs (GS, MS, Barclays, BNP, etc) or Multilateral development organizations (ie World Bank, IMF, Bill and Melinda, etc))?

4

St. Andrews is the better choice for your situation & in light of your career goals.

P.S. Did you consider the College of William & Mary joint program with St. Andrews ?

5

@Publisher Having lived in DC for a long time I actually applied and was accepted at W&M. I also applied to SA and got in (I decided to apply there because it was close to my grandparents). I did not however do the joint degree. Should have looked into it before hand :frowning:

6

It may still be an option. Contact W&M and ask.

7

We were down in Williamsburg over break last week and I asked that but they said that it is not open. Nevertheless, they said I could go to SA or stay at W&M and then do a year at the other institution.

8

IMO, both would be fine for career goals. Middlebury would be better known in the States. St. A’s much better known in the UK.

Do you care about studying other subjects?

Disregarding recruiting (Middlebury obviously better for US placement; St. A’s obviously better for UK and Europe placement), what pro’s and con’s do you have for each?

9

An Economics degree from St A’s is very rigorous and highly regarded by employers. I am sorry I know nothing of Middlebury other than it is a highly regarded LAC with a strong language program.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/0/uks-highest-paying-degrees-according-graduate-salary/

10

@PurpleTitan My concerns are fitting in with the student body, facilities, courses/modules on offer, and location in that order.

In terms of Middlebury:
Pros

  1. Liberal Arts education allows for more flexibility in courses of study
  2. Excellent environmental studies program which I would like to draw upon for my economics major
  3. Excellent facilities
  4. US education system and american students are what I am more used to
  5. Language program is excellent
  6. Small college a bit like high school, making it possibly easier transition
  7. Location is beautiful
  8. Great US grad school placement

Cons

  1. No Guarantee of work in US afterwards
  2. Potentially isolating
  3. Low international student body
  4. Cold winters
  5. International reputation?
  6. cost (although considering I would be flying back to the US a couple times a year the price is within $3000 of each other)

In terms of St Andrews:
Pros

  1. UK and EU reputation
    2.£9250 per year tuition
  2. Guarantee of being able to stay
  3. great internship opportunities
  4. Econ & IR are very good there
  5. weather is more moderate
  6. Come away with MA
  7. family members close by :frowning:

Cons

  1. Lack of flexibility
    2, New education system (to me)
  2. Old facilities
  3. fitting in (I’m not really scottish, definetly not english, not really american, not really international)
  4. Brexit and future in EU
  5. Probably wont study a language
    7.Graduate school acceptance???
  6. family members close by :frowning:
  7. parents over the atlantic
11

^ Are you sure on the tuition? Those are domestic fees, fees are based on residency rather than citizenship. If you are a UK citizen who has never lived in the UK not sure how you qualify for home fees,worth checking out.

1 Like
12

I would add two cons to Middlebury:

  1. In the middle of a culture war.
  2. Currently under the financial strain of attempting to correct their budget imbalance.
13

@elguapo1 I don’t want to sound like a toff, but we have property in the UK and pay tax there on that. We hence qualify for rest of UK fees.

14

@AriBenSion when you say culture war are you referring to conservative establishment vs first-gen students?

15

@130601kid I don’t think there is a conservative establishment at Middlebury. The war is between the center left and the extreme left. Search CC and you will see all the various controversies.

16

@AriBenSion Ok got you!

1 Like
17

^^ You might own a property in the UK, but are you ordinarily resident there which is one of the conditions for qualifying for home tuition.

18

This is what I got as my fee letter:

"Thank you very much for your completed Fee Status Classification Questionnaire.

Based on the information provided in your application, your fee status has been assessed as RUK (England, Wales, N.Ireland) for fees purposes. In 2019/0 the tuition fee for this status for all programmes will be £9,250 and this fee will be fixed for the duration of study.

If you disagree with our decision you may appeal by emailing the Academic Registrar (fees@st-andrews.ac.uk). The appeal should be made before you accept an offer of admission. You should indicate how you believe an incorrect decision has been made, making reference to the Education (Fees) (Scotland) Regulations 2011. The Academic Registrar will review the case and inform the applicant of the decision by email within seven working days.

Application Process

For all applicants other than those studying Medicine or transfer students, you should expect to receive a decision on a complete application as soon as possible. In the event that we require additional documentation prior to making a decision, we will contact you through the applicant portal, outlining exactly what is required. This will provide you with a secure way of uploading your documentation. Please do not send us any personal information or documents by email.

You can follow the status of your application online via UCAS Track at www.ucas.com/apply.

If you have any queries relating to the status of your application, please contact us at myapplication@st-andrews.ac.uk. Please remember to include your full name and your UCAS application number in any correspondence.

Other information
Further information about the University and the programmes and facilities that we can offer is available on our website at www.st-andrews.ac.uk/study/ug.

Once again, I would like to thank you for applying to the University of St Andrews.

Regards

Michele Goodwin
Registry Officer - Undergraduate and Fees
Registry

University of St Andrews
Old Burgh School
St Andrews, KY16 9LB
Fife, Scotland"

19

You’re golden !

20

Many small LACs including Yale, are having a huge emphasis on debate about freedom of speech versus hate speech.
Middlebury is in the fray, unfortunately as are all smaller LACs on the east and west. (Middlebury counts as east coast even though its not near an ocean.) The middle of the USA is more free of this hyper focus on freedom of speech versus hate speech. There is also a problem in the USA with offending people of other races and its dwelled on so much that it detracts from education to some degree.

St. Andrews I bet is free from this. Quite a few Americans attend St. Andrews. Some have ties to the UK as you do.
i think you will fit fine in St. Andrews, without having ties to Scotland.

William and Mary, is much more conservative compared to Middlebury College, so you will meet all sorts of Americans if you choose to take a semester in Williamsburg VA. Its not DC for politics, many very conservative students attend William and Mary. There is less debate about free speech at conservative universities in the USA. Less distracting
than I bet Middlebury College might be right now with this fierce political infighting in our US Democratic Party.

Its very unfortunate that fine schools like Middlebury are caught up in the national political scene and it really distracts students from learning calculus, economics etc.