<p>Anyone know the answer to this:</p>
<p>And if Dad II’s S gets a true full ride, then will his EFC for his D still be halved?</p>
<p>Is the EFC halving determined by the amount of kids in college without regard to the COA?</p>
<p>Someone answered this question very eloquently once before-- but I can’t find it right now. My recollection of the explanation was that this is one of the (many?) silly aspects of the FAFSA, as yes, FAFSA does NOT take the COA of the second student into consideration-- just the fact that they are in college. So if you have 2 kids in college, even if your OOP expense is ZERO for one of the 2, your EFC will be adjusted to reflect 2 college students. Totally unreasonable, but thats the way it is. They don’t consider the cost of private HS nor do they consider paying for a child’s grad school (even if they are still a dependent)-- just the kids in college, even if it costs NOTHING to send them. Unfair and stupid, but well, thats the government for ya.</p>
<p>*** edit*** additional comment-- I have no idea if this is why DadIIs dau’s EFT is being halved for 2 yrs. He didnt make that entirely clear in his description of her scholarship offer from Stanford in post # 45. My post is in reference to the silly FAFSA rules in general.</p>
<p>^ depends and the way I understand it- while your package is connected to COA- your EFC is not.</p>
<p>If both schools use FAFSA only- and in the unlikely event that they both met full need , this is how I understand it to be handled ( assuming schools DO NOT expect additional contributions from students)</p>
<p>Say EFC is $20,000 with one student.
With two students- the EFC would be essentially halved.
Need can be met with any combination of grants, loans & work study.</p>
<p>However- with schools that use PROFILE/their own financial aid forms- they generally assume for students to make a monetary contribution from summer income. Say $3,000.
They also may identify additional assets to be use as financial resources.</p>
<p>Again how I understand it- say both schools meet 100% of need- but use PROFILE & their own forms & assume student assets/income seperate from parents.</p>
<p>With $20,000 EFC (parent ) & school expenses of $40,000 for each school.
student A- will be offered a package that is roughly $17,000 made up of grants- loans and work study.
Student B will be offered a package that is roughly $17,000 , made of grants, loans and work study.
Parent contribution is same, but student contribution is calculated as well.
Also- since it apparently can’t be repeated too many times- most schools don’t meet 100% need & they generally offer less to juniors and seniors than freshmen.</p>
<p>Yes, EK- The post I recall reading was describing the FAFSA rules only-- not the CSS.</p>
<p>Thanks!!!</p>
<p>DadII’s D is going to a PROFILE school. Those schools reserve the right to do what they please with the info. Some of the most selective schools with the most generous fin aid will treat families at certain break points as pretty much full ride with no loans in the package. These schools have the most generous financial aid out there. Many PROFILE schools will truly count “every friggin’ cent” in coming up with the institutional EFC, and the packages can be truly measly. All FAFSA does when your child goes to a PROFILE school is get eligibility to government funds which means guaranteed PELL at certain income levels, some other state and federal programs out there, most often linked to PELL eligibility, and ability for the student to get Stafford Loans, maybe subsidized if the EFC is less than COA, unsubsidized in any case.</p>
<p>I’ve heard directly from parents whose family income would be high(one doctor+one engineer) that their students only pay 10% of Harvard tuition.</p>
<p>I believe the Harvard policy of 10% of tuition is for families with AGI of $180,000 or less.</p>
<p>^This is why it did not make sense to me, I would think they are over the $180K boundary because of the professions they are in.</p>
<p>Dad- your son has a better shot at full rides at merit schools if you focus on rural and southern schools (and a few in Maine and Vermont) where ethnic diversity is an institutional priority. The other “trick” is to go against the grain- an Asian male interested in poetry and classics is going to do better than an Asian male declaring an interest in computer science. I don’t mean to engage in racial stereotypes… but the more of a high quality outlier your son can be in his applications, the more interested colleges will be in attracting him to their campus.</p>
<p>I would encourage you to be a little more holistic in your approach. It’s probably worth some extra money from you per year($1K ? 3k? 5K?- especially since your D will be halfway through with college by then) to get your son in a place where he can thrive rather than just grit his teeth and get a free degree. We know a family whose D got into Dartmouth with modest need aid, Brandeis with a nice merit scholarship, and a small LAC with a full ride (and I mean full… laptop included.) The D was reluctantly agreeing to the full ride although the school was a poor fit for her in virtually every way- but she had got an invitation to apply based on NMF and since the app was free she filled it out.</p>
<p>I think the family wisely decided that although Dartmouth was a very steep stretch financially, Brandeis was virtually everything their D was looking for (not enough snow, but it gets cold enough in Boston to simulate NH!) It was worth it to them to pay what turned into a very doable amount and the D is thriving.</p>
<p>I would also encourage you to make your son a participant and not an observer in the financial process. He will most likely take this on with enthusiasm if your goal is to get him to a campus where he will thrive which is affordable for all of you. He will likely be resentful that his sister got all the goodies and he’s stuck with a full ride to a school he’s never heard of in a state he’s never visited if you don’t allow him to control the parameters. Who knows- he may have ideas you hadn’t thought of- live at home and commute for the first year then transfer; attend school in Canada with lower sticker price; ROTC; etc. Make this about him and not your checkbook and you’ll all have a better outcome.</p>
<p>There is no way the son would be happy to go to just any school because of finance when his sister gets to go to Stanford, not after 18 years of propaganda. This is very surprising he would be getting less than his sister, considering he is the only son to carry on the family name.</p>
<p>
Well said, blossom.</p>
<p>This is all about the parent’s checkbook, there is not enough spinning that could make it look like anything else. Kids are not stupid.</p>
<p>Brandeis is a good bet. I know a number of kids who have done well with Brandeis packages.</p>
<p>Somehow I don’t see DadII being comfortable with his son at Brandeis… but JMO. BTW, where is ol’ DAdII anyway???</p>
<p>Some additional information for post #66 about FAFSA at a profile school. Certain states that have the educational lottery require you to complete the FAFSA in order to get the lottery money. In Tennessee, which has a lottery, I will have to do FAFSA and CSS for D’s application to Vanderbilt. This is a merit scholarship worth $4,000 to $5,000 per year, depending on your kids GPA and SAT/ACT scores.</p>
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<p>Completely agree, oldfort.<br>
It would be different if something unforeseen had happened (major illness, layoff, etc.) between dd and ds – sometimes, those are the breaks and life happens. But to make dd’s search about prestige and ds’ about money? What a sad message that sends to ds.</p>
<p>My kids are very aware of the change in the economic climate. We did not talk cost with the older two when it came to colleges. The younger three understand things have changed in terms of priorities with money even though it is not a major family event that has occurred. We have kept an open dialogue about these things. These equality among kids just doesn’t happen in our family because we have too many kids with such different wants and needs. I have yet to even sniff a whiff of jealousy about these things. I have been very concerned that each of them get the best possible thing for themselves without rocking the family boat, and they understand this. My kids have issues and problems, but they do know how things work here and our thought processes. My 4th son feels that he would just as soon commute. My friend’s son said the same to her when she was worrying about college costs. His sister is at a $50K+ school in CA with no aid, her dream school. He did not have any problems in working the finances into a college choice, and it just wasn’t that important to him.</p>
<p>I admit- for someone who has earned a Ph.d in the US & who has been in this country for over two decades- albeit seems to have chosen to live in a pricey competitive area, Dad II is a study in contrasts. examples below- I realize that DadII is confused about the reactions to some of his posts & I wanted to help him understand why others may be confused by his mixed messages.</p>
<p>I agree however, that to slight his son because he is slightly less academically inclined than his daughter, would be hard to understand.</p>
<p>*This morning I asked my wife for some spending money. She gave me 8 quarters and then went to hide the coin jar. </p>
<p>This economy really sucks.*</p>
<p>( why do you ask your wife for spending money? It helps to have a budget so that can be factored in, although if you needed change for the bus- I wouldnt call that " spending money" I would call it change for the bus.)</p>
<p>We really enjoyed our AI vacation to Paraiso Maya last year, we have dicided to do another one this year. Our target - Punta Cana area of DR and about 7 days in Nov 15 - Dec 15.</p>
<p>( that nice that your family takes regular resort vacations- however- I have never heard of another " self-described", low income family to do so)</p>
<p>*In all my communications, I always say our DD is the first one from our family to attend a 4 year college in US. </p>
<p>Yes, I do have an earned Ph.D. from a US institution. However, we still do not understand many things in the 4 year college application process such as loans, housing, work study etc. </p>
<p>Her mom had only an AS degree and my under was done outside the US.*</p>
<p>Does she correctly state mention your job title or education level w university affilation on application?
If so, then earning your undergrad degree outside US, is semantics- but if you don’t mention your Phd from a US school, you are being selectively dishonest .</p>
<p>Schools generally ask, if either parent has a college degree- NOT if that degree was earned outside US.</p>
<p>*We would like to do something about our kitchen.</p>
<p>The house was built in the late 1960’s and the kitchen is about 10 x 10, next to the dinning room. We are thinking about breaking the wall and make it one bigger kitchen, installing new cabinet, counter top, and appliances. </p>
<p>*</p>
<p>Well, have to say, my house was built in 1901 and we moved in about 25 years ago- we did replace the kitchen sink- ( but I wish we had just had it repainted), but again, most low income families don’t spend money on remodeling, especially hiring the work out.</p>
<p>*On one hand, I would like to think we are extreme good savers - living way below our means. That includes old domestic cars purchased used and an old house. OTOH, our credit card bills have been on the raise lately. Especially after DD decided to forgo her expensive dream school, we have made some purchases that we could live w/o. *</p>
<p>I think many are bemused to hear Stanford * not being * described as an expensive first choice dream school.</p>
<p>I’d like to see a sample of US 4 person families earning $10,000 (even after taxes) and saving $4,000 per month.
We do!!! Our income is not quite near $10,000/month before tax. By my math (new math - including company matching and cash pension plan), we save at least 4k/month. That even includes our DD’s college cost.</p>
<p>This statement is confusing to me- by saying you " save" $4,000 a month- are you including aid that is not paid by your to Stanford?- I wouldn’t include that as savings, since it isn’t money you would be spending otherwise.</p>
<p>*I have been in US for over 20 years now and I have yet to see a Harvard or another top med school doctor. Where do they practice? </p>
<p>CC do have a comprehensive spread, we are on the bottom end.</p>
<p>I have started car pooling since Jan of this year. Walk to store whenever we could. Cut DS 's plan for school visit during the summer.</p>
<p>Are you venting because your child could not afford his/her #1 choice? Most of the people don’t. Our DD will not attend her dream school because we could not afford it. The meirt aids are so competitive.</p>
<p>Are you venting that poor people had it better than you? Come to live a couple days in our shoes. Evenso our DD could enjoy an excellent need base FA, lower income families like us struggle every day for basic things. <a href=“Basics%20like%20a%20plasma%20TV?%20:rolleyes:”>/i</a></p>
<p>*Tomorrow, we are taking a road trip to see some schools for DS. Our van’s tire pressures were low. I took an airpump for bike and started pumping. Why? to save that $0.25. </p>
<p>Like many others have stated, just be grateful that you have a high income and you have choices.*</p>
<p>DadII I totally agree with your last statement.
:)</p>
<p>Dad II, what was your D’s “dream school”?</p>