<p>Happy camper here!!! ;):);) (at least for ourselves, though I sometime wonder whether my d. could have commanded a greater rental fee.)</p>
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I also think it is wrong to not acknowledge their leadership in this area.
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<p>I thought everyone knew that UNC-CH was a leader in instituting merit discounting, with the Morehead program that began in the early 1950s.</p>
<p>"at least for ourselves, though I sometime wonder whether my d. could have commanded a greater rental fee."</p>
<p>All it would have taken was to be allowed to keep the merit awards on TOP of the regular package. :D</p>
<p>Although I approve of any money donated to NC schools, I can't help but wish that it had gone to UNC directly. The Morehead is very much a political process, as I have personally heard them admit (i.e. placating certain schools). My calculations inform me that this gift could keep all UNC students debt free for 5.4 years. Instead, it keeps 2% debt free for 50 years.</p>
<p>Heaven forbid it go to the Teaching</a> Fellows program. Goodness knows we need more teachers.</p>
<p>interesteddad,</p>
<p>Why "discounting" instead of "scholarship?"</p>
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Why "discounting" instead of "scholarship?"
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<p>Because that what financial aid is: price discounting.</p>
<p>Just like a red-tag sale at WalMart. Just like selling you a cheaper airline seat if you agree to stay over Saturday night.</p>
<p>College pricing is exactly like airline pricing. They publish a very high sticker price and then offer a changing mix of price discounts to fill the seats and maximize revenue.</p>
<p>The reason merit discounting is so popular is that it provides an inducement for wealthier high-stat kids to enroll based on a $10,000 discount. At a high priced private, keep in mind that each of these kids they entice is still paying $30,000 in revenue....and increasing the SAT scores which in turn attracts more paying customers.</p>
<p>Colleges call it "enrollment management" and hire enrollment management consulting firms. Some schools may even adjust the discount depending on computer model predictions of how likely a given student is to enroll without a discount. Why do you think Emory (for example) has a sophisticated computer database tracking how many times you have contacted the school? Hmmmm?</p>
<p>These colleges are run by professionals.</p>
<p>"These colleges are run by professionals."</p>
<p>I'm so relieved to hear that. Better run by professionals than by a bunch of incompetent amateurs. ;)</p>
<p>"Although I approve of any money donated to NC schools, I can't help but wish that it had gone to UNC directly. The Morehead is very much a political process, as I have personally heard them admit (i.e. placating certain schools). "</p>
<p>Here is what I figured out about the Morehead: There are four Morehead eligible schools in Houston...Kinkaid, St. Johns, St. Agnes (all girls) and Houston Christian. All cost about $16,000+ per year. Assuming my son also attends UNC, I could spend the $65K for a high school education on the off chance he might get a Morehead and thus cover that out of pocket cost and then some. More likely, I would end up paying the $65K PLUS paying the $100K OOS tuition at UNC anyway. When I consider that he attends school in one of the finest public school districts in the state, it doesn't make financial sense.</p>
<p>Don't get me wrong, the Morehead Foundation is wonderful group and I'm proud my d attends a school that attracts $100 million donations. That alone is a huge deal. But because the foundation targets private schools and high performing (usually affluent) public high schools (Palo Alto? Alamo Heights? Highland Park? Mountain Brook?), I do agree it is just not something that can be aspired to by a highly qualified, middle class public school kid. And maybe that isn't right.</p>
<p>ldmom: As I mentioned earlier, the Morehead <em>is</em> open to all public schools in NC. Each public school can make 1 or more (up to 4) nominations, the number dependent on the size of the school. I think they have, in fact, recently opened it up (somewhat) to more schools out-of-state, too.</p>
<p>interestedad: Regarding your post #62, I believe Hoedown was referring to the Carolina Covenant, which you obviously find difficult to acknowledge. (But, of course, I'm sure you knew that already.)</p>
<p>ldmom06, I agree with you on the out of state opportunities for the Morehead. Not much opportunity for a high achieving potential leader from Las Cruces, NM or El Paso, Tx. While admissions can "nominate" someone from those areas, the chances are much smaller than for other Morehead candidates. I know kids who wouldn't even consider UNC-Ch because Morehead was so restrictive for non elite oos schools even though these kids would have probably been very competitive and most ended up with outstanding opportunities in other prestigious programs. Seems to me if the donors really wanted OOS students to make a difference at UNC-Ch (after all, new donor is from Texas, not NC), they would have strongly suggested that a larger variety of OOS students be allowed to compete for this outstanding opportunity.</p>
<p>jack - yes...I think it's wonderful all the in-state kids are eligible for Morehead nominations. The number of eligible schools in Texas is disappointingly low though....very few publics. For this year, no publics in the Houston area, which is kind of amazing since we have some really top notch public high schools in the Katy, Cy-Fair and Houston ISDs. </p>
<p>I wonder...do I understand the rules correctly? Could some of our better public high schools petition to be included as a qualified nominating school for the Morehead? If this is true, I will definitely bring that to the attention of our counseling department; especially in light of the dramatic increase in scholarship funding.</p>
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Regarding your post #62, I believe Hoedown was referring to the Carolina Covenant, which you obviously find difficult to acknowledge. (But, of course, I'm sure you knew that already.)
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<p>So, if I read the numbers correctly, UNC-CH has about 8% of its freshmen qualifying... from families making $37,500 a year or less?</p>
<p>Based on my knowledge of some of the private schools, that's a solid number, but hardly spectacular. We are only talking about a million dollars or so for 300 students in a class to go debt-free.</p>
<p>From unc.edu:
"June 2006</p>
<p>Morehead Opens Nomination to All Out-of-State High Schools</p>
<p>A combination of factors has finally made it possible. The Morehead nomination process is now open to any secondary school, public or private, in the United States."</p>
<p>Continued..
"How will it work? In order to become an eligible school, officials from a high school must agree to promote The Morehead at their school and to conduct a valid, competitive selection process.</p>
<p>Why not just open the process to direct applications from students? The Morehead Foundation continues to place a high value on the judgment of school personnel and on their validation of a student's application form. This is especially important when it comes to evaluating an applicant's character.</p>
<p>Please feel free to contact outstanding schools in your area and, if they are interested, have them e-mail the Foundation at <a href="mailto:morehead@unc.edu">morehead@unc.edu</a> to inquire about eligibility requirements."</p>
<p>"All it would have taken was to be allowed to keep the merit awards on TOP of the regular package."</p>
<p>We pay so little, there is no need to be greedy. ;)</p>
<p>Thank you mkm...this is a fantastic development! I just sent an email to our high school principal with the links. Hopefully, she'll have our counseling department check it out. (Hey...can't hurt to be from Texas now can it? lol!)</p>
<p>interesteddad: I don't know about your numbers (but you can bet I'll check!). I'm guessing the point hoedown was making was that UNC-CH was THE first University to create a much-needed fund such as the Carolina Covenant. Other schools followed (including Ivy's). That's actually what's called "leadership," and what she meant by acknowledging their leadership in this area.</p>
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interesteddad: I don't know about your numbers (but you can bet I'll check!). I'm guessing the point hoedown was making was that UNC-CH was THE first University to create a much-needed fund such as the Carolina Covenant. Other schools followed (including Ivy's). That's actually what's called "leadership," and what she meant by acknowledging their leadership in this area.
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<p>That is exactly what I meant. </p>
<p>The numbers served by the Carolina Convenant may be small, but that's not entirely NC's fault. There are a number of barriers (some just perceived, some real) that keep lower-income students from even applying to a state flagship like UNC. Barriers also exist to admission. But this is an important start, in my opinion, and efforts like the Carolina Covenant may help increase the number of students from poor families who are willing to apply to elite institutions. That's certainly Michigan's aim--getting more of these kinds of kids to think that Michigan is where they should be, and can afford to be. Graduating with no debt is no small thing for these families, and many people also think it's an important component to furthering their post-baccalaureate degree aspirations.</p>
<p>The fact is, NC started this program and inspired a half-dozen others like it, some of which do not just eliminate loans for the poorest students but reduce loans for families making up to $70,000. It is entirely need-based. No merit component. And they and their peers with similar programs have gotten private donors on board, which not only prevents tuition dollars being spent on this "discounting" but also has put the affordability of the poorest students on the radar of more philanthropists. These are all good things, and things done directly in service to the very thing you say UNC--and everyone else--doesn't do . I remain confused about how the Morehead inspired this kind of sniping comment, in this context.</p>
<p>interesteddad: I did check your numbers. The percentage figure was actually at 9% for entering class of 2005. Also, in 2004, the University "extended the reach of the Carolina Convenant by expanding the program for families from 150 percent of the federal poverty level to 200 percent."
<a href="http://www.unc.edu/carolinacovenant/%5B/url%5D">http://www.unc.edu/carolinacovenant/</a></p>
<p>While I know that poverty is a serious problem in this country, and certainly in NC, where the poverty level is currently ~14% (although I don't know the percentage at poverty level who are college-age), I do think that UNC has made great strides with the Carolina Covenant. The State of NC has also substantially increased their need-based financial aid, since 1999.<br>
How's your state (and your state university) doing?</p>
<p>hoedown: We cross-posted. Thanks. And, yes, I am also perplexed by interesteddad's negativity and "sniping" here. His "generic" gripe, it would seem to me, needs its own thread.</p>