<p>My daughter age 15 has just recently decided to pursue music. She is a good cellist, but not so advanced. She is in Suzuki book 8. She would really like to attend a summer intensive and work very hard to take her playing to the next level. Does anyone have good recommendations for her ?</p>
<p>If she wants to really progress in her solo work (which is something she needs to do if she is in Suzuki Book 8 at age 15) a camp may not be the best environment for her. Camps can be terrific for advancing orchestra and chamber music skills, or even musicality. But I can tell you, after 9 years of attending summer music programs, my daughter who is a sophomore at a conservatory is considering staying home to roll up her sleeves and really work. She learns a lot at summer programs, but 6-8 weeks with a lesson once (or twice if lucky) a week with a new teacher is not, she feels, enough time to get done the work she feels she needs to do. I think it is different for students who follow their own teachers to programs. They are able to continue work on various projects in an unbroken way. But if your daughter’s goal is basic woodshedding for the purpose of improvement AND if she can get the supervision she needs (i.e., her teacher is around at least part of the summer), she would probably be better off at home. </p>
<p>There are a few “practice camps”, such as Meadowmount. Your daughter may not be competitive for admission at her current level (Meadowmount does have some great cello faculty.) </p>
<p>If your daughter were looking for a great musical experience I would recommend a program like Kinhaven. But their emphasis is on ensemble playing and she would not receive the kind of lessons she needs to advance as quickly as she needs to, with college auditions in the not-so-distant future.</p>
<p>Thanks GH, you’ve articulated many of my concerns. She is going to apply to IU and Meadowmount since the focus at these seems to be on practice, but I’m thinking she may not be competitive. I’ve not heard of Kinhaven, but I’ll take a look.</p>
<p>I can second Kinhaven and also Greenwood for ensemble playing in a small environment (they are both 5-6 weeks long). My D did both Kinhaven (as a junior camper) and Greenwood Senior camp. At the time, the strings faculty at Greenwood lived on campus and were avaiable for lessons more often if requested. Might be worth a call.</p>
<p>[Greenwood</a> Music Camp](<a href=“http://greenwoodmusiccamp.org/]Greenwood”>http://greenwoodmusiccamp.org/)
[Welcome</a> to the Kinhaven Music School](<a href=“http://www.kinhaven.org/]Welcome”>http://www.kinhaven.org/)</p>
<p>I would encourage the application to IU’s summer program–as you mention, there is ample time for practice there and there is a serious concern for improving skills. I believe that IU’s summer program is not as competitive for admission as Meadowmount’s. </p>
<p>For a very comprehensive list of summer programs for string players, you could check the website violinist.com. There are probably around 100 listed there, but, of course, some would not allow/offer enough practice time or lessons for a serious student, and others may be too restrictive in their admissions (e.g. Aspen, MAW, Meadowmount, Perlman etc.).</p>
<p>A camp experience can be useful, if only in terms of clarifying whether or not a person wants to eat, live and breathe music 24-7. A short term camp, perhaps a local chamber music camp, might offer a group experience for a couple of weeks that could be paired up with some intensive practicing or working with local cellists.</p>
<p>Not sure about cello, but some of the Suzuki Institutes have intensive teen programs for advanced Suzuki students. Ithaca, for example, has the Preludio program for violinists…not sure if there’s something parallel for cello.</p>
<p>Kinhaven,Luzerne, French Woods, Encore Coda and Eastern Music Festival might all be possibilities.</p>
<p>Look at Chicago Suzuki Institue. My son went several ago. They have an Advanced Program and it is run by a cellist and they have great teachers. If you want a camp experience also look at Point Counter Point. My cellist son had 3 good summers there but this is maybe not the place to work on technique because the focus is on chamber music.<br>
Depends upon where you live but the Indiana program starts very early and my kid still had a couple of weeks of school when it took place so he could not go. Ithaca no longer has that very advanced cello program.</p>
<p>It sounds like your daughter is not too far off where DS was at 15. DS (cellist) attended New England Music Camp. It opened a whole new world for him. Sent you a PM with specifics.</p>
<p>It seems like IU would be a good choice if she is accepted. Violindad, you are correct, it starts very early, about 3 days prior to the end of school for my daughter. I think we may be able to work out a few days if she is accepted and wants to attend.</p>
<p>I think that given where D is with her playing, that a summer music camp can have some drawbacks:</p>
<p>-Some music festivals are not living, breathing music 24/7 and even ones that advertise an ‘intensive’ music experience may not be that despite the claim. Some festivals, for example, tend to have an experience that is more like summer camp that emphasizes music, but has all the traditional summer camp elements like swimming and games, etc. Nothing wrong with that, but if D is setting out to get some intensive lessons and music time in it may not work out for her. Some programs do offer the full ‘camp experience’ but also are intensive musically of course, but it takes care to find one. </p>
<p>More importantly, even at some of the music only festivals, the students, while pretty good musicians, often treat it as summer vacation and it can lead to an uneven experience if D is trying to ‘get serious’. </p>
<p>-More then a few of the music festivals I have heard about make claims like “students are required to practice X hours a day every day” and while that is what they say, they don’t enforce it and it can create an environment where students who are serious end up having a hard time due to distractions (this is personal experience with my S, plus from other parents with serious music students). Some places do, Meadowmount is famous for it, but others don’t. </p>
<p>-The level of teaching at these festivals is uneven, and it might have great Violin faculty and so-so cello faculty for example. The other issue is kind of a chicken and egg thing, the higher end faculty tend to be associated with festivals that admit higher end students…obviously, there are more open festivals that have great individual faculty, and if she is going to do a program it would be best IMO to choose one for its cello faculty first. </p>
<p>Obviously, if D is still unsure then a music program might help her decide. If so I would say from my perspective that she would need to try and find a program that is more 24/7 music, and also make it a short term/intense one or maybe even if there is a day program near where you live. </p>
<p>Overall,I have to agree with GH, it may be better for D to stay home and practice and bring her skills up then go to a program like this, as she has a lot of catching up to do. Book 8 of Suzuki if cello follows the violin model is not particularly high level and depending on the teacher, IME Suzuki teachers generally don’t focus on the technical details of playing the way traditional teachers do and therefore it is not unlikely your D has a lot of work to do on the details. I have to be honest, she faces a tough climb, cello is extremely competitive, at or near the top in the music hierarchy, and the level of young music students is incredibly high, it was shocking to us when our S entered that world and we saw what was out there and love of music, quite frankly, is not enough.</p>
<p>If she is thinking of pursuing this, here are my recommendations:</p>
<p>-You need to find a high level cello teacher in your area, if there is a college with a decent music program your D could potentially study with one of the faculty, or perhaps there is a local teacher who teaches at high level programs, etc. As others on here stress all the time, at all levels everything comes down to the teacher, and the teacher at the local music school is more likely then not to be what you have in Suzuki most of the time, teachers who are capable of teaching someone to play an instrument and enjoy it, but is not likely to be at the level to bring a student to the level they need to be to pursue music. I am sure there must be the equivalent of violinist.com for the cello, or perhaps post a message on here with your general location and ask if anyone knows of cello teachers in the area as potential fits.</p>
<p>The most important part is a high level teacher can assess your D’s abilities and see where she stands, if she has the potential to make a run and get into a decent music program. With music, that is incredibly important, it takes so much more then passion to make it in music, especially classical music, and while music programs at the college level turn out something like 15,000 graduates a year give or take, only a small fraction will find they can make it in music as a living. It is part of the reason that a standard line to potential music students is if you can see yourself doing anything else rather then music, you may want to pursue that. </p>
<p>-The old joke about how do you get to Carnegie Hall, “Practice, Practice, Practice” is very, very true (just for fun, the joke has a real genesis. Mischa Ellman, a famous violinist from the early to mid part of the last century, had been rehearsing with an orchestra at Carnegie Hall for a solo performance, and was unhappy the way it went, and was angrily walking down the street when he was stopped by a tourist couple [prob seeing the violin he was carrying] and asked him how to get to Carnegie Hall, and he snapped back “practice, practice, practice” and walked on)</p>
<p>Especially where you D is deciding relatively late, she is going to need to dedicate serious time to practicing. With top level strings players, it varies, but in general it is in the several hour range, I would say 2-4 hours a day is typical, some do much more. One of the things that makes it difficult on young high school music students is that this often conflicts with the crazy lives of kids these days, with all the stress on taking AP’s, having a ton of EC’s, etc, it can be hard to block out the time and quite frankly have the energy to practice after a long day at school, it is why there is a significant group of music students who homeschool or find schools willing to be flexible. You cannot as I have heard some parents suggest diddle along during the school year with an hour a day of practice, and ‘make up for it’ on vacations, weekends (which are usually tied up with all kinds of other events, soccer games, practice, etc) or during the summer, isn’t going to happen, part of the key to playing well is consistent practice time and habits. There are super kids who can do it all, but IME from talking to music parents and with our own child, that isn’t true for many or most kids…and given she is playing catch up, if you can afford it multiple lessons a week is not unheard of, it can help. </p>
<p>One thing for your D to think about is that love of music and playing doesn’t require you go into it professionally, she could still get a high level teacher and pursue the cello and do so as an amateur or semi professional. A lot of colleges have music lessons and playing opportunities available for non majors so she could have music in her life and after school, could still pursue it through lessons, practice and getting involved in amateur or semi professional music groups:)</p>
<p>^^this is without a doubt the best post I have ever read on CC (excluding “So You Want to be a Music Major” of course). Thank you musicprnt.</p>
<p>Follow this post cello-mom.</p>
<p>Hi cello-mom. I made a suggestion on Cello Chat of Point CounterPoint. I think also you should look seriously at IU Strings program. </p>
<p>PM me if you like about local university professors; I think we live in the same area.</p>
<p>More info on my daughter . . .</p>
<p>She is planning on doing either a performance degree with music ed or music ed. She does not have aspirations of becoming a professional cellist, but she wants to become the best player that she can be. She is a good student, and probably in the top 5-10% of her class.</p>
<p>D has many varied interests. She is passionate about the arts in general but also social studies, philosophy and foreign languages. I don’t think she will be truly happy if she does not pursue some of these other academic areas in college.</p>
<p>Mom4 thanks for the post in cello chat. We talked a few years ago and as I recall your son has not transferred from Duquesne to BU.</p>
<p>I also recommend New England Music Camp very highly. There is an option to do one session or two, the first is 4 weeks and the second 3. This is a nice option if you want to spend a shorter period of time at camp and do something super intensive in addition. The campers participate in Orchestra, chamber music, music electives and have one private lesson a week. There is an option to do a second lesson per week (if you want to pay for it.) I know for a fact that the cello teacher is loved by all the campers. </p>
<p>This camp is very supportive and the campers are incredibly supportive of each other. The music faculty is of a very high calibre, they are all professional music teachers. </p>
<p>The program is not an all day music program, the campers have an opportunity to socialize and participate in recreational activities many afternoons. They study music 6 days a week, with concerts several evenings a week and on weekend afternoons. </p>
<p>My S. who is now a conservatory student, was at about the same level as your D on violin and was studying viola as a secondary instrument when he first attended this camp. He was able to participate in two chamber groups, take two lessons a week (one on each instrument) and study orchestral repertoire and music theory. There is also the opportunity to sing in the chorus for anyone who wants to, not just vocalists. (search for NEMC or New England Music Camp on YouTube and you will find many posts)</p>
<p>Some campers go on to study music in college and some do not, but music has remained a part of all of their lives. </p>
<p>S had been a camper at a sports camp from age 8 to 15 and was very attached to that camp. After his first summer at age 16 at NEMC he made the comment that he never dreamed that there could be such a perfect place. He attended for 2 summers as a camper and this will be his 3rd summer as a counselor. </p>
<p>Ok, I will get off my NEMC soapbox now, if you have any further questions feel free to ask. I know there are many parents of former campers on this forum.</p>
<p>Just thought of another intensive - Aria International Summer Academy. They offer short (10-14 day) “boot camp” sessions. Audition requirements (2 contrasting pieces) seem relatively easy and it has an April deadline. D3 did the viola session and enjoyed it.</p>
<p>Reviving this old thread to ask… has anyone ever sent their children to French Woods? My daughter has an opportunity for a fellowship to teach there this summer. We are not familiar with the program (from the website it looks like a lot of fun! But… musicians don’t have fun, do they?) Anyway, any tidbits or morsels most welcome!</p>
<p>I know someone who taught numerous summers at French Woods and loved it! Where else can you play in an orchestra and practice trapeze in the same day?!</p>
<p>Aria International Music Festival in Western Mass was the best money we spent (and we have spent quite a bit on summer enrichment experiences) My kid is flute but they have 4 sessions this year with many great cello teachers and the cost can not be beat. This camp helped tremendously with the selection of schools to audition at which has yielded the right school that will is the “winner” for my kid. Good Luck" Note in many cases they will take a 15 yr old.</p>